Karaoke Forums

if Bertha and her friends came to my show, they'd get up ONCE in a regular rotation.

I love parties, but I'm paid to run a REGULAR show. I'm not their personal karaoke slave. They want that, then cough up the $500 for a private show, and we'll play whatever they want!

Until then, follow my rules, or find some monkey to turn your crank for ya, cause it ain't me!

I don't. because my rule is one free duet. In other words, a singer gets to be on stage twice a rotation once.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

So one free duet. Next rotation when they want to sing a duet on Singer X's turn then Singer Y doesn't get a turn correct? Reasonable enough.

It just seems to me we're making rules for Bertha and her friends when they're not the norm and those rules might impinge on regulars having some fun. I would hate to see the extreme case being the only one we worry about.

It's not as uncommon as you might think. It may not get to the extreme where Bertha brings NINE friends. A lot of times the group is a smaller group but it's just as unfair to the people who don't sing duets in every round. I know of a "BERTHA" who is married to "BERT" and EVERY time they go to karaoke, BERTHA always sings a solo on her turn and BERT always puts in a duet on his turn. If BERTHA had any sense of fairness, they would at least alternate solos for every other rotation but BERTHA has her monkey trained very well and he never complains about never getting to sing a song by himself.

Then there's the other BERTHA who goes up to almost every single guy in the bar and asks him to sing a duet with her(on his turn of course, whether he planned on singing or not) with the outcome being that BERTHA sings 5 or 6 duets every rotation, as well as here SOLO turn. Had BERTHA not solicited so many duet partners, the rotation would have been much shorter because most of the time, the guys that she "flirts" with are usually never in the rotation as solo singers.

BERTHA's ruin the fairness of a show for just about EVERYONE else. It becomes painfully obvious to all of the SOLO type singers that BERTHA is pulling a fast one and if the KJ does nothing to stop it, he risks alienating the bulk of his singers.

Don't come crying to me when you lose your gig because BERTHA is the only person who thinks that you run a great show.

You know what? Good point. I'll think on it. The one hitch is if there is one duet and one solo, instead of two duets. Then the perception is that the solo got up twice.....

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

The solo does get up there twice. Happens once a night generally, someone brings up a friend up to sing with them. The only time anyone has balked is when my 3 soul singers always get up there together. One of them is lead, the others backup and they swap the lead around. I got questions about it at first but since they're now regulars everyone sits back and enjoys it, they do sound good.

Most important thing is to be consistent with the way you run the rotation in general. So long as folks trust you not to screw them they generally don't think you are and your judgment or explanation goes a long way. The best thing I tell them is how I do the rotation and if they balk at it I explain that if they every want to do that, they're welcome to it.

It only just occurred to me that the duet situation is just an extension of how folks trust you to do a rotation. Not to open that can of worms....

Here's a worse problem:

1. You have Bob, Carol, Ted & Alice.

2. Each person submits a song for themselves.

3. When each person hits the stage, they tell the other 3 to come and sing with them. (as "helpers" of course)

What do you do about it?


Here's what happens with me:

1. Bob gets up to sing, invites the other 3 to sing and they all sing together.

2. Carol gets up to sing, invites the other 3 to sing and I turn the other 3 around and have them sit down. She either sings solo or not at all, her choice.

3. I then spread their songs apart.... waaay apart so if they try this again, they are so far apart, no one cares.

That's where the "name must be on the slip to sing" rule comes in. I have seen that at three different 7-day karaoke clubs.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

I've got a rule about "no uninvited singers"

What they effectively have done is created "duets" or a "group" song when they didn't request it.

I understand the spontaneous fun of having your friends get up and wail away with you. When you don't treat it seriously, this is what a lot of drunks or kids do!

First of all, I control the mics. If I called up Ed only his mic is on.

The moment someone else gets up to sing with Ed, I turn their music down, bring up the fade, and go to Ed and go "Wait a minute"...

TO me, it's all about keeping control. I have rules posted, and there were reasons WHY I did. It's not about ruining Ed's fun, but about the other thirty singers that get their teets in a twist, and I can't say I blame them!

Yet again we're handling a group dynamic and not simply duets. There are no elegant solutions that fit all categories, just your ability to manage the situation as it happens.

The 'name must be on the slip' rule would certainly help you control issues and move things along allowing you to space folks out as needed. That's a rule that makes it easy to know whats happening and avoiding issues.

Hmm, and actual hard, fast rule I like. Who'd have thought it?!

Imaginary rotation:

Elton John sings ONE song, Billy Joel sings ONE song, Eric Clapton sings ONE song, and then John, Paul, George, and Ringo sing FOUR songs in a row.

Great if you're a non singing Beatles' Fan but sucks if you're a singer or an Elton John Fan, but certainly not a fair situation in my opinion.

If you have been on stage, in any capacity, you have had a turn. Now go sit the F%$k down and wait like everybody else.

AMEN! Gryf.

The best way to handle duets IMHO is to give everybody ONE turn and leave it up to that individual as to who may accompany him on stage. The funny thing about it is that I PRIMARILY am a singer and only an occasional KJ and would prefer AS A SINGER that it is MY call as to whom may sing with me on stage. It is MY turn. In my area, this practice is pretty much a given at any show, fortunately.

The "logic" behind the rule that "all singers on stage lose their turns" (used by MOST of the KJs posting on this thread) is simple:

1). There are those who try to "defeat" the system by signing up non-singers for "duets" - therefore getting more "airtime". This practice is usually very easy to spot and there is a SIMPLE solution - require that the person who is signed up actually attempt to sing or you turn the song off. A KJ friend of mine did this once to a guy trying to pull this and announced over the mic that "duets" have to be legit. I've been involved in karaoke for over 16 years now and can only remember a few times at best when someone obviously was attempting this sceme. I think some of you overlook that fact that MOST singers do not want to sing every other song. MOST singers would prefer as an ideal maybe 1 or 2 turns an hour and, not to mention, a LARGE audience of non-singers.

2). It isn't "fair" that one singer will get more "airtime" than another. You see, if "Betty" sings with "John" ("John's" turn) and "Betty" sings with "Joe" ("Joe's" turn) and "Betty" gets her own turn, "Betty" has now "sung" three times in rotation. Be aware that "Betty" in many instances may be singing a song that she really doesn't want to in the first place, as a duet partner. I've been asked on numerous occasions to sing "Summer Nights" and "Love Shack", songs that I NEVER select on my own to sing (that's an understatement, as these are songs that I wish "didn't work anymore"). What happens is "Betty" happens to be really good with harmony? Is it somehow "fair" to "John" if "Betty" refuses to sing with "John" because she would lose her turn like she would at MOST of the shows hosted by the KJs posting on this thread???

The MAIN issue I have with this "all singers on stage lose their turns" rule is that you DISCOURAGE duets, harmony back-up vocals, group songs, and assistance for the "shy" singers (who often become SOLO acts). In all the years that I have been doing karaoke, the most FUN shows that I have been to were those where we had lots of people singing with each other - and I mean those who can really SING harmony/ backup vocals. I just don't see the tradeoff is worth it between diminishing the fun factor of a show to enforce some idealistic concept of "fairness". This is why there will NEVER be a rule like this at any show I host.

Knightshow's rule about "no uninvited singers" should be a given at ANY show. However, IF the singer TELLS me to turn on the mic for the singer who has just joined the one who's name is on slip I WILL turn the mic on. I will NOT allow someone to join WITHOUT permission. Once again it is the SINGER'S CALL.

Obviously, SOME rules are needed at a karaoke show. Too many rules and you diminish the fun, too few and you have total chaos. I DO understand where those of you who have the "all singers on stage lose their turns" rule are coming from but I'm just not convinced it is really necessary.

Unless these people really do not want to sing with Betty & are only doing so to be nice & to shut her up from continually asking them to sing with her & then the slip gets written up under the other persons name. Have seen this happen lots of times in places that do not control duets. Had it happen to me before, when I said no, the guy (in this case) jumped up with me anyway. The host didn't do anything about it, I left the stage & our group packed up & moved on to the next bar.
As a singer I don't care if the person is the greatest singer/harmonizer, if I see someone up on stage more than once before me, I don't stick around.
As a host I give a show as I would like to see as a singer & duets will count for both persons for that round. If the other person tries to switch the solo persons song I will make sure it is ok with the solo singer before changing the song - 9 out of 10 times, they either say they want to do their song first OR "LOSE" the slip as they do not want to sing with the other person - in which case I will let the duet requestor know they will need to find another partner that IS willing to sing. Also I will often see a couple of singers put solo songs in, then when one is called, the other will join in or be called up - ok, might let it slide, but then the other gets called up for solo & the other joins in or is called up - then I consider these two solo singers a duet.
I will usually let a group song once at the end of a round if it is a party & it is 3 or more singers. This is rare though and no one really takes advantage of that.

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