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mckyj57
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Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 9:54 am |
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Joined: Tue Apr 04, 2006 9:24 pm Posts: 5576 Location: Cocoa Beach Been Liked: 122 times
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karyoker @ Fri May 09, 2008 12:22 pm wrote: Any machine is most efficient at the middle of its operating range whether mechanicl or electrical AT the extremes the temperature rises reduces the overall efficiency
True. But I don't see how that affects the sound....
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karyoker
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Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 10:28 am |
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Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 3:43 pm Posts: 6784 Location: Fort Collins Colorado USA Been Liked: 5 times
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Essentially as long as both are operating in their nominal range there would be no difference at close range. The main difference would be dispersion area and the acoustics would vary. At a certain distance from the speakers there would be a huge difference.
There is a nominal wattage for every venue but as Lonnie says it is better to have more than not enough. Attenuation does not affect freq response or overall sound quality.
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jamkaraoke
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Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 11:04 am |
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Joined: Thu Dec 26, 2002 10:54 am Posts: 3485 Location: New Jersey , USA Been Liked: 0 time
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Karyoker - I have to admit you lose me on these technical responses :thinkin: :thinkin:
In KJ terms - is there a formula out there like
X-amount of Sqft you should use x amount of speakers pushing X amount of watts ?
Don't get too technical --I'm sure you know your sheet but it gets lost on me LMAO LMAO LMAO LMAO
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Lonman
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Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 11:31 am |
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Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 3:57 pm Posts: 22978 Songs: 35 Images: 3 Location: Tacoma, WA Been Liked: 2126 times
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Really there is no formula as not all systems are equal. A more efficient speaker & power amp combo will sound louder than an inefficient speaker & amp combo. You just want to get the best you can - look at the specs for sensitivity & SPL ratings. Most are standard measures & the higher the numbers the better theoretically. Match the amp to the program rating of the speaker & you'll be good. If you still need to be louder in a room without having to turn up the volume, simply adding two more speakers will effectively double the perceived volume.
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lyquiddye
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Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 11:49 am |
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Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2005 12:26 pm Posts: 1252 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Been Liked: 3 times
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Lonman
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Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 11:57 am |
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Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 3:57 pm Posts: 22978 Songs: 35 Images: 3 Location: Tacoma, WA Been Liked: 2126 times
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Disagree, program power is where you want your amp as a rule of thumb which is usually double the continuos power. Majority of sound engineers will tell you this even many sound stores such as Sweetwater
Quote: When you're matching a Power Amp to a PA Speaker, a good rule of thumb is to pick an amplifier that can deliver power equal to twice the speaker's continuous IEC power rating. This means that a speaker with a "nominal impedance" of 8 Ohms and a continuous IEC power rating of 350 watts will require an amplifier that can produce 700 watts into an 8 Ohm load. For a stereo pair of speakers, the amplifier should be rated at 700 watts per channel into 8 Ohms. A quality professional loudspeaker can handle transient peaks in excess of its rated power if the amplifier can deliver those peaks without distortion.
Using an amp with some extra "headroom" will help assure that only clean, undistorted power gets to your speakers. Some professional amplifiers are designed so they have additional headroom. These amps can cleanly reproduce transient peaks that exceed their rated power. In this case select a model with an output power rating equal to the continuous IEC power rating of the speaker. Consult the amplifier manufacturer or owner's manual to learn more.
In some applications, such as critical listening in a studio environment, it is important to maintain peak transient capability. For these applications, use an amplifier that can deliver 6db (or four times as much) more power than the continuous IEC power rating.
If budget restraints or legacy equipment force you to use an amplifier with less power, extreme care should be taken to see that the amplifier is not driven into clipping. It may surprise you to learn that low power can result in damage to your speaker or system. .
Quoted from
http://www.sweetwater.com/shop/live-sou ... -guide.php
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karyoker
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Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 12:02 pm |
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Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 3:43 pm Posts: 6784 Location: Fort Collins Colorado USA Been Liked: 5 times
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There is no formula. What works in one place sucks in another. Some places took 2 or 3 setups to find the best. I am by no means an expert although I have lit many bars with 100 watt jukeboxes. It is more efficient to have speakers placed at critical spots than 2 blaring from one end. I always wanted to install a good jukebox system and then tap in with a karaoke system but never got the chance. An extra amp would be necessary on one end I think but dont know.
People laugh when I say 100 watts. When Pioneer came out with their first CD jukebox we were one of the first installing them. They had an 18" bass in the bottom. When cranked the cone was going in and out 2-3 " It would break windows. I totally fried a 100watt L pad to a black crisp the smoke called the fire dept.
A good soundman or KJ will learn the limits and strengths of the system and get the best out that is possible. They were making music long ago without all this modern stuff. It is know how. I have made tis statement before and will make it again Run your system outdoors and see what it really will do.. Tweak it and get the best. Then go into different venues and learn how to compensate for acoustics.
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Lonman
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Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 12:15 pm |
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Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 3:57 pm Posts: 22978 Songs: 35 Images: 3 Location: Tacoma, WA Been Liked: 2126 times
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But that's also part of it, more speakers will seem louder than 2 trying to cover an entire room. Most of the jukebox systems i've seen have a minimum of 4 speakers in the club. I know ours has 6 spread out evenly throughout. When that thing is on, you know it's there & its internal amp can't be more than 100 watts either.
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jamkaraoke
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Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 12:38 pm |
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Joined: Thu Dec 26, 2002 10:54 am Posts: 3485 Location: New Jersey , USA Been Liked: 0 time
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karyoker
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Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 1:31 pm |
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Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 3:43 pm Posts: 6784 Location: Fort Collins Colorado USA Been Liked: 5 times
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Quote: But that's also part of it, more speakers will seem louder than 2 trying to cover an entire room. Most of the jukebox systems i've seen have a minimum of 4 speakers in the club. I know ours has 6 spread out evenly throughout. When that thing is on, you know it's there & its internal amp can't be more than 100 watts either. _________________
But Lonnie doesnt it still give you a rush when you say kill the jukebox and you say test test test into a microphone with crystal clarity. And you totally blow the jukebox system away
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lyquiddye
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Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 4:11 pm |
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Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2005 12:26 pm Posts: 1252 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Been Liked: 3 times
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jamkaraoke
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Posted: Mon May 12, 2008 5:14 am |
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Joined: Thu Dec 26, 2002 10:54 am Posts: 3485 Location: New Jersey , USA Been Liked: 0 time
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Lyquid- appreciate the offer. Although probably a killer set-up not in my budget.
I KJ partime for extra $$$ - I do take it seriously but the $275 I make a week working 2 nights does not justify the purchase.
Thanks
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