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I really hope not..... I'm lucky though, their show is so much different to mine, other than we're best friends, it looks like we barely know each other at all.


edit: My typing is slow the above post was in reply to mckyj57

From many jobs and vocations I have certain advantages. As with any job dealing with the public it is 51% PR. I have had jobs such as inhome TV repair where in the first 5 seconds you had to sell self, get their confidence, repair and collect and get out in 45 minutes. Eight to ten times a day week in week out' This was at a time when TV repairmen were in the top 5% of people hated. These skills can be taught to a certain extent but some are people persons and others never will be.

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I never in my LIFE adpat'd!!

!

But for purposes of this discussion, you show me one set of regulations, and I can find someone that disagrees and can prove why it's a bad idea. I've seen posts from hoity-toity hosts that thought the ONLY industry standard for mics should be a Shure Wireless... and other hosts that were very well reputed to say that they use Seinhiesers...

I disagree with hosting softwares, with standards some say is the only way to go with computers... gimmie a break!

Once you start down the regulatory pathway, it's gonna get fugly! For CERTAIN!

Maybe we could regulate those who do not own any original CDG so that everyone is then on a level playing field....

oh wait, we have people regulate that.





Marble runs and hides and vows to post no more in this thread.

Matt I just got a Shure SM58 wireless on Ebay. Anxious to try it..

From many vocations I have eliminated the shade tree mechanics and put them out of business. (in electronics). I know how to stay ahead of the competition. On a social security check and a few gigs in the last year I have put almost 3k back into my system after coming out of retirement (including another G2). The wannabees do not bother me and never have. All in this area know I have a top notch system and I'm not cheap.

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As originator of those words, I AGREE with Jam and should've chosen the word STANDARD, instead of regulate.

It's too bad that no one with long term experience and excellent equipment knowledge couldn't put together a dvd that could give newbies and oldbies a respectable education on everything karaoke.

It would be great in my opinion to have a few kjs here to produce a promotional and sell it to various outlets, or at least teach a seminar course at the yearly Mobile Beat conference in vegas.

Removing all the personal opinions and and going with the most effiicient and straight forward approach that would guide kjs in the most professional long term success would be a great start.....although would prove a little challenging.

Off the top of my head, i'd ask Bill H.. Mickyl, and karyoker to DEBATE it

-ericlater, Jam karaoke, and Dangerous Dan to REVIEW IT and ask questions

-Dr. Fred, Karen k, Cueball, and Tim to actually WRITE IT

-add in knightshow and Steve Kaplan to ADD A SENSE OF HUMOR to it

-and perhaps Lonman, Karen, and Babs to PRESENT IT PROFESSIONALLY and thoughtfully.

- i would be the guy in the back filming and financing the project. sorry if i forgot other contributors that would make this "imaginary project" more of a success.

hummm.. I guess I have a different view on this. I do not want any kind of regulation or training for the hacks in my area. the fact that the other KJs around here are so bad only plays in my favor. I do not believe im the best around, but People tell me i am almost every week. the only time I wish they were better is when i have a night off and want to go out. Last friday in 2 1/2 hours I got to sing once, and the second song I had in got removed while others sang 3 times before and after me. this was at a show I always thought was one of the better ones around. My partner was asked a couple times that night why we have not gotten that show yet. 3 or 4 of there bartenders come to our shows a lot. it will come in time i'm sure. I do not go trying to steal shows, so the bar has to contact me. I give it a few months to possibly a year. that bar owner is slow to pull the trigger on a KJ.

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the voices arent real, but they have some good ideas

The problem is with "rules" on how to run your show is that what works in one place may not work in another....

Sure there are professional standards like don't run over your time slot if a band is performing after you, or make sure that your equipment actually works. Another thing that is important is that all of your songs should be bought from sources that at least appear to be legit.

Standards like how to run the rotation really can depend on the locale. I know some shows that mix in a lot of dance music and it works there. If I tried to do that too much in my show I would have a riot from my regulars... While I often pull my self out of rotation when it gets busy, sometimes I get a lot of requests for me to sing (and then I sometimes slip myself back in).

When it comes to crowd interaction, sometimes holding out the "applause" sign or yelling "clap damm it" can seem cheezy at times. But at other shows they do help. It all boils down to getting to know your specific crowd and what makes them tick.

I have seen many KJs come and go. Some tried bars where it didn't work. Others had substandard equipment, others did not get the crowd going.

What makes a good KJ is getting people to come to the bar, and sing and hopefully buy some drinks so the bar keeps cashflow. Looking around my town I see 20+ bars each with their own personality. What works in one will not necessaraly work in another.

My advice to new KJs out there when you get started is make the people have fun and also make sure that they know who the KJ is. Don't just be someone who presses a few buttons to keep the songs going. Talk a bit with the singers, encourage make it fun. It will take time but eventually you will get a local reputation if you have the nack for it.

Some sort of "certified KJ" stamp of approval is not something that I think the industry can handle. Who would say "yes it is ok". I see too much politics and local conflicts to make any certification practical.

On the other hand it may be a good idea to have someone make stickers to display somewhere on the gear so the people can sing it stating "we only use legally purchased songs for karaoke" or something like that. That sort of self regulation might keep some of the most dreadfull hacks out of the business if bars only hired KJs with legit songlists.

Matt - regulate is not the word - but whether you realize or not there are already some standards in place to be a decent KJ. Nobody should REGULATE or POLICE how a KJ runs their show but "we" here on KS discuss daily standards and norms on what is needed to KJ.

We all agree you need a SOUND SYSTEM , SOME MUSIC , A MONITOR and at least 1 microphone ... There are some standards as simple as they seem.

Of Course people will always argue there way is best and the best sound system is the one that costs the most.... that's life .

jreynolds - There is money to be made in selling TRAINING on how to be a succesful Mobile KJ. I think if you look hard enough you may find some out there already.

THOSE THAT CAN DO.......THOSE THAT CAN'T TEACH

It's like someone just posted --Why teach your competetion ?

I agree that in oversaturated karaoke markets it may not be too wise to educate your competition further because it may cost you your job(s).

However, just like in the DJ business, there are many many seminars, courses, educational tools, and guidelines on HOW TO be a good or better dj for all the various types of events and settings. Raising standards for the ENTIRE industry might give it more longevity and sustainability.

sure every venue is different, but it is karaoke and certain simple guidelines that could be distributed, would, as the various deejay associations, give this industry more professional credibility and MORE respect as a form of entertainment.

I believe if MORE information were mainstream about karaoke, other then mostly forums, (as in a nationally recognized magazine , show, or seminar/s) then developmental and entrepreneurial minds would come out of the woodwork and produce more exciting products and events, thereby stimulating the need for
MORE karaoke music from manufacturers, as well as influencing ALL Bar & Restaurant Owners that the public wants GREAT quality karaoke entertainment.

In many parts of the country, karaoke is either an outdated fad, cheap entertainment, or a disrespected lower form of entertainment. MOST of the respectability comes from educated hosts or good people, not the pirates looking for a quick buck. If we made it harder for undereducated folks from entering the market, because of perceived "higher standards" (used loosely), then we have done something.

Sure i know of many not-so-good deejays who will work for next to nothing, but i do know MANY MORE that have been educated and raised their standards on performing weddings and corporate events, thereby justifiably raising their performance, professional appeal, and paychecks as well. People WANT GOOD DJs and can now GET AND DEMAND them.

Why not KJ's as well. What sets apart a good one from a bad one ACCORDING to the general public?? There is no standard guideline the PUBLIC or BAR OWNERS know of for karaoke hosts....but most newly engaged couples "know of" the pitfalls of bad Deejays. How can we make bar owners frown upon the pirates or unprofessionals and educate them that there is better product out there?

Jam, i suppose i meant besides googling, an event or publication that is currently expanding an educating NOT ONLY Karaoke hosts, but indirectly John Q Public and Bar owners on karaoke and what a professional show could/should entail.

...just thinking out loud folks. No set opinions on this. Just wondering what y'all think.
sorry if i said the same thing like 5 different ways. ....not enough sleep i guess. J.R.

Im assuming this thread is a joke right? Well I'll just leave it at that.

Rick

Exactly..
Why make the KJ scene any better.. Lets just plug along and hope for the best..

Because you want karaoke to get better?

Seriously, though -- you try to teach most people and they will tell you to go to hell in a handcart. My service club wouldn't listen to me even though I was a member. Only when they got stung by "The Karaoke Candy Store", who sold them thousands of dollars of overpriced DJ equipment that they failed to support, did they come to me. Now I am persona super grata, and they give me free membership dues and free drinks. But it took getting stung badly.

I have helped some guys who had a smiley-faced EQ setting, which is just automatically wrong. I show them a few things, and the vocals pop right out. Everyone tells them how good it sounds. Then you come back some time later, and there's old smiley-face again.

To be fair, they have no idea who I am. I am sure they say, "Who does this guy think he is?" Funny thing is, the guys with pretty good sound know right away that I know a bit of what I am talking about. The clueless ones don't even know enough that they can tell who to listen to.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

If ya don't have anything nice or logical to say.....STFU.

Yes, OK. Let's call them "standards". I can only say this is a HUGE bone of contention in the DJ industry...except mobile DJs are more likely to do private parties, and KJs are more likely to work in bars.Let's not forget that DJs often equate how good or talented one is by the amount they charge. A "lowballer" might be $300-$500. The most often referenced "industry standard" rate DJs say they should make is $1200. Obviously, KJs are not going to make that kind of money at a bar...and rarely at a private party. Yet it doesn't keep national DJ organizations or industry publications to keep talking about "raising the bar" by offering more gear and personal services to raise the value of a DJ.Like in the DJ industry where there's a move toward people using their own computers or iPods, it's much less prevalent that people do karaoke on their own. The main reason? You can't as easily go to iTunes or Napster or even Limewire and download several thousand CD+Gs.As has been said, a lot depends on the venue. But a few things should remain constant. Technical knowledge of your system so that singers are brought up quickly, have their levels mixed properly, maybe even using reverb/echo to make them sound better. Organization of song slips or computer-based rotation tools. Courtesy to patrons.

Will there ever be an American KJ Association which pools these resources and fosters professionalism in the karaoke industry? I predict as soon as someone comes up with a way to make money from it, there will.

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[font=Lucida Console]"Sing for the day, sing for the moment, sing for the time of your life!"[/font]

I did refrain from saying something bad. I take it that there are those amoung us that think we should be somehow "regulated". When we get down to regulating Karaoke we won't last long. In fact all this "regulation" we have now for "our own good" has just about done us in.

I'll run my business the way I want. I don't need any permission or contol from you. Thank you very much.

I've never seen how "regulating" anything ever made it better. In fact almost everytime this happens things get worse.

Keep your nose out of my business period. What you do with your business is your business. Just stay away from mine.

I don't need to be "controlled" and will resisit any attempt to do so.

Rick

mule's post is EXACTLY my point about how some of us buck the systems. This business itself seems to attract known rebels. I personally built my show based on my growing pains as a kj with a bar that hired me... and I detested the bribes and the kjs that took them. Once I started taking a look at that, I decided to do other things the way I wanted to do them.

It's also why I joined here and the old JOLT forum... because I wanted to see if I was alone in my thoughts.

Turns out I wasn't. I don't always agree with everyone, but usually I can respect their opinions! In a world of KJs and Hosts, there has to be room for INDIVIDUALITY! Because not EVERYONE is going to be pleased by EVERY show.

Who is John Gault?

Exactly Matt!! That is why I try to keep the rules at a minimum. Although I do run a certain type format we are totally dynamic and constantly change according to demands or crowd preferences. A couple of years ago I was totally burned out by the same ol crap week after week. I actually retired and my system was sitting in storage. A little bar and staff brought me back out of retirement and I have put a lot of money into the system (yes More) and got rid of all the formality. I actually look forward to setting up now although now I am wheezing doing it. WE party and party hard although at work I cant drink...

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