Karaoke Forums

I might do a smaller venue on a one time basis as a favor but I dont want to be obligated weekly at a minimum fee and miss out on more lucrative gigs or parties.

I have engaged in many projects thst necessitated bids, proposals and negotiating down to the smallest details. When doing a consult or interview I can engage in any one or a combination of all. This is called business 101. I will work for drunk owners or those with attitudes. If we cant establish common goals and have a good working relationship I am gone.

Karaoke is not a religion it is a business unless one considers it a hobby. Certain things are worth discounts. Instead of discussing ways of pricing and maintaing a competitive edge another thread has been turned into petty childish arguments.

I personally have years of experience in every phase of running or providing services for bars or clubs. Some of the comments or ideas presented in these threads blows my mind. There are many oher things that make a successful and long lating gig than the basic things argued about here over and over. That would take another thread which I might start.

_________________
Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!

Bit Harsh. I didnt think so....

You can also look at it this way. Tis better to be paid at a lower rate to pay bills while looking for something better. Some $$$$$ is better than none. Just remember the number of people out there doing literally crap jobs for minimum or slightly higher wage.

_________________
You can be strange but not a stranger

Of course, as I said that is our choice to accept or reject. However, we don't control the amount they pay us. I wish that were true. If we controlled what they paid us, we'd all always get exactly what we want; whether we deserve it or not. We know that isn't true. The truth is we control only our option to accept or reject, as does the employer.

Our level of success in getting paid what we want is attributed only to the strength of our intractable will to hold out for a price we consider fair. This (for some) may also be backed up by talent and reputation.

Now y'all may say that this smacks of semantics, but my belief is just as intractable those who believe they control what the employer pays.

_________________
EveningStar Entertainment & Events
JR & Michele LaPorte
Peoria, AZ

True Tim. My parents lived thru the great depression. It formed their belief system and ways of doing things for the rest of their life. They knew how to bargain and horse trade with the best. Some know how to compete and some dont when the competition is at it's greatest. Attitudes, demands, egos or bragging does not get the best gigs.

Businesses that dont have common goals and bonds with everybody involved will not prosper. I can holler at owners and they can holler at me but we sit down and rectify whatever problems we have and devise strategies. It is give and take on an equal basis.

I will stand by my comment about petty arguments. Compare the comments to real business or practical business meeting propoasals.

_________________
Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!

I stand by my statement. In the end, it's up to the owner. You can't tell him what you charge and then him/her hire you if they don't agree with the price.


Angel, sounds like you should be in the KH hall of fame. Not afraid to tell people how good you are. If you treat people at your show like you talk to people here, I don't see it.

_________________
KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

It's up to the owner to accept or reject my fee. Correct.

But he is not going to tell me what he's willing to pay me. That makes it MY choice to accept or reject.

I have never worked for one bar owner that told me what he was willing to pay. Even when i started out i still set the price. Now i have worked for as little as $100 a night to get a job when i had no jobs or experience. But i even set that price.

Who can say what i am worth? They can say they don't want to pay that much, but they can't say i'm not worth it. It's just that i'm not worth it to them. My fee stands on it's own, take it or leave it. I have had bar owners turn down my fee. They hired someone else. That's their choice. It was my choice to walk away.

interesting topic..i see it as a negotiation..ive worked for $100 also, but it was when i was new, and it was weekly on wednesday nights in the middle of nowhere. just when i knew we were stable enough to raise the price the place was destroyed by a flood..it was also the most fun weekly show i ever had. to me enjoying the show means a lot!


last sat while i was doing the fair show my "regular" venue had a birthday party and would have gladly paid me 300. they wound up hiring a company who i know did not do the job as well, but probably paid them $100 or $150. I KNOW the owner would rather have had me even at 2 or 3 times the price.. his sales would have covered it.

_________________
the voices arent real, but they have some good ideas

I won't even touch a private show unless my price is met. 3-5x my normal club rate depending on what I need & how formal it needs to be. There is a difference in a formal show as opposed to a off the cuff informal show.

_________________
LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Here is my price. This is what i charge.

Here is what you want to pay.

I can see a few reasons for a KJ negotiating their price. (1) they are not confident with their skills. (2) they are willing to work anywhere at any price in order to work at all. (3) not good enough to get a higher price so i'll take whatever i can get.

Before everyone blows a gasket.

What are the reasons KJs negotiate their price? What am i missing? And don't tell me it's to create a good working relationship. I can do that by telling them what i charge.

The point you are missing is this. A buyer negotiates for a lower price. A seller negotiates for a higher price. I do have a minimum but during this negotiation which doesnt take very much time I negotiate bar tabs and things like raises when we start improving the z tape. Negotiation might be the wrong term but I establish communications with who I am working for before I even obligate. If these negotiations fail it is a nogo.

_________________
Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!

Let's put it this way. I manufacture top quality widgets and sell them for $10.00 a dozen. That's my price and that's what they are worth. Six months down the road I haven't sold one. So I have full stock and no cash in my pocket. My competetion manufactures widgets (may not be as good as mine) and sells them for $7.50 a dozen. He can't make them as fast as he can sell them. Who's better? I'll tell you. The one with cash in their product. You cannot price yourself out of the market no matter how good you are.

_________________
You can be strange but not a stranger

"Positive effect in negotiation

Even before the negotiation process starts, people in a positive mood have more confidence,[14] and higher tendencies to plan to use a cooperative strategy.[11] During the negotiation, negotiators who are in a positive mood tend to enjoy the interaction more, show less contentious behavior, use less aggressive tactics[15] and more cooperative strategies.[11] This in turn increases the likelihood that parties will reach their instrumental goals, and enhance the ability to find integrative gains.[16] Indeed, compared with negotiators with negative or natural affectivity, negotiators with positive affectivity reached more agreements and tended to honor those agreements more.[11] Those favorable outcomes are due to better decision making processes, such as flexible thinking, creative problem solving, respect for others' perspectives, willingness to take risks and higher confidence.[17] Post negotiation positive affect has beneficial consequences as well. It increases satisfaction with achieved outcome and influences one’s desire for future interactions.[17] The PA aroused by reaching an agreement facilitates the dyadic relationship, which result in affective commitment that sets the stage for subsequent interactions.[17]
PA also has its drawbacks: it distorts perception of self performance, such that performance is judged to be relatively better than it actually is.[14] Thus, studies involving self reports on achieved outcomes might be biased."

_________________
Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!

Case in point.

I had a bar manager come to one of my shows looking to hire a KJ. Someone told them about me. Just so happens he showed up on a really good night. Anyway he wants me to stop in and talk to him.

So i went over with my advertizing package to show him what i would do as far as advertizing and such for the karaoke night. They already had karaoke on that night by the KJ was sick and retired. I already knew what they paid but that is also my asking price. After the talk and presentation he asked if i would do it for $150 i said i wouldn't be interested. I told him i would do it for 4 weeks at that price and then i wanted $200. He may not have been real happy but he agreed.

I give every new bar a reduced rate for at least 4 weeks. So I had planned on doing it for him as well. So i really didn't lose any money.

Every night when i say good night he is handing me my fee within 5 minutes. There have been some bad nights since the economy went crazy but he hasn't said one word about my price or about taking a cut. I have actually offered to give him back some on the really dead nights. HE ALWAYS PAYS FULL MONEY. THERE HAVE BEEN NIGHTS WHEN HE HELD UP THE KARAOKE FOR A HOCKEY GAME AND HE HAS PAID FULL MONEY. Even though i did over an hour less karaoke.

I think he is happy with my work and he must feel that i am worth the fee i charge. I don't take any job unless i get $200. I'm not interested in working for less. It's the value i put on my time and my ability. The bar owner is not going to tell me what my time and ability is worth. If he hires me he must agree. If he doesn't hire me he doesn't think i'm worth it. That is his choice. To offer me less than my fee is an insult to my ability. That's how i look at it.

WHAT YOU NEGOTIATED? OMG! Goes against EVERY single post you have been jabbering about!!!! When we all say we negotiate different pay you get all up in arms.


AGAIN, you cut your rate - even for a few weeks - gee, I see a double standard here from the one that says I get my price or no show basically. Hmmmm.


That's just a good bar to begin with, I have went to work & the power was out & still got paid.

_________________
LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

They are few and far between.

Yeah bottom line is you negotiated a lower fee, whether it went up to your regular or not, no different than many here.
This topic is going to be closed soon. Everyone make final comments!

_________________
LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Now that's priceless

_________________
[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

The market and economic conditions set the price - we need to talk apples to apples. For similiar type venues etc.
Its a CHICKEN AND EGG THING .... Venues in a given area pretty much know what each other is paying for a Karaoke Show. ( lets say $150per night)
If all the KJS in the area start to accept $100 night then as we've seen over the last few years the AVERAGE GOES DOWN ALSO. BUT THE FLIP SIDE is if all KJS don't accept less than $175 per night the average goes UP ...those bars wanting to host Karaoke will pay the $175 and those who don't --won't have a SHOW ..until some hungry KJ works for $125 ( then we all call them an undercutter and pirate) and the circle of life continues

OK One last comment.. Bars in this area started hiring the lower priced bottom feeders. Now they are looking for the old hosts because the crowds and good singers disappeared. Sorry I have gone on to bigger and better things. You get what you pay for.

_________________
Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!