Karaoke Forums

It seems there are two schools of thought concerning KARAOKE contests....one school thinks the BEST SINGER should always win....the other theory is that the most ENTERTAINING ACT should win.....now, these are not always the same person....so it follows that there will always be a difference of opinion as to who actually won.  Personally, I subscribe to the most ENTERTAINING ACT theory.... after all, MOST of these contests are billed as KARAOKE contests, not SINGING contests, not TALENT contests.  There is, in my opinion, a BIG difference.  A large part of the allure of Karaoke is the FUN part.  MOST people who sing Karaoke are NOT really very good singers....just think about it....how many of the singers at your shows have REALLY good voices and know how to use them....not many...most just get up to sing and have fun.  Personally, I don't see how one can get up and sing without moving with the music....grooving to the beat...."do a little dance, make a little love, get down tonight, get down tonight".....SO to cut short a dissertation that is WAY TOO LONG already....a BIG part of Karaoke is "acting crazy and jumping around" (just look at how the audience usually reacts), so if the contest is judged by singing alone...then the best singer should win...but if it is judged by stage presence, audience participation, etc., as WELL as singing...then the BEST SINGER will not always win....but that doesn't mean that they are NOT the best singer.

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Still kickin', jes' aint raisin' much dust !

Steve,
I'm glad this system works for you but...

I used this method (before seeing it here) at the last competition I did, this was the way the owner wanted it run, and it was a disaster I was more of a popularity vote than a karaoke competition. Almost all the finalists were picked not on their singing but because they had brought friends and there second and third places went to other friends that had also entered. I got a lot of heat from karaoke regulars and  have sworn to never let an owner of an establishment tell me how to run a comp. as it's my reputation at stake.

I'm not dumping on your system Steve ( so I hope you don't take offence) , just saying how it did'nt work for me.

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Rob Montgomery
Montgomery Entertainments

Unfortunately, popularity votes rarely work. They usually vote for the guy that brings in the most people and they are having the most fun. Now, the BAR loves it when this happens... but the karaoke regulars DON'T!

It's primarily what gives karaoke contests a bad name.

I DO think audience reaction should be taken into account, but I vote for three areas, and they all have primary scoring... then a fourth evens it out.

* Singer's voice and talent singing (30%)
* Knowledge of song (if they look at the screen very often) (30%)
* stage presence (30%)
* Crowd Reaction (10%)

You get honest judges ( I like to have three judges, and I make the fourth, tally all the points to get the top three.

And my partner just mentioned something yesterday that makes me change my mind about some stuff... you should have a woman's category, and a man's category!

Matt

Matt

You make way too much sense for a short guy...

Jerry :music:

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Yes, We do That... Computers, Web Sites, Networks, Antique Cars, NASCAR,
Tour Guide, Stunt Double, Romance Lessons, Hyperbole, Humor, Modesty.
Karaoke too...
Quotes on request... Jerry Dixon

My partner's the shorty... I'm six ft. He's five-two!!

I dont think all contest are judged unfairly, but we all know that fixed contests exist, but this is common in all things in life. In a perfect world this could possibly exist. But I live in the real world. I dont enter contests because nice people become wankers when push comes to shove. And what is wrong with short people boys.

Michelle :spiny:  :thumbs-up:

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LUV & KISSES SHELL

Are contests fair? Hmmmmm...I used to think so, until I ran one. We did a contest (the winner won a stupid prize but then went to the national competition) at one of our shows. Up until the finals, the contest was fair. I, personally, saw to the fairness of the contest. In the finals,the bar brought in some local celebrities and DJ's to be the judges. The judges did their job wonderfully. They chose the best singer in the bar. I was VERY pleased. Right up until the entertainment director of the bar told me to ignore the judges decision and choose the singer HE wanted to win. The person the entertainment director chose completely messed up his song that night. Of course the judges would not have chosen him. I went against my better judgement and did what I was told to do. I was then bombarded with questions from the judges as to how exactly I had read their scorecards. I told the judges what happened, I then went to the REAL winner and told her, then I went to the general manager of the bar and told HIM, then I quit the show. As it was our highest paying show (not to mention a nationally recognized restaurant and bar and I was able to meet several VERY famous people) I had a hard time walking away from the show, but I can face myself in the mirror and not hate the person I see there.
    In my experience, the ONLY person happy after a contest is the winner. The bar is not happy because most contestants drink water all night and there's not alot of profit in that. The losing contestants feel cheated and will probably NEVER come to another of your shows. The karaoke company is not happy because they just angered a BUNCH of customers. Do drawings, not contests. One winner, but people do not get nearly as angry!

I agree with a lot of what Revengee states.  In general, I do not like contests because of all the politics invlved, which ultimately makes contests unfair.  In the six years or so I have KJ'd, I had only one contest series and all it accomplished was to anger a lot of the singers (and I ultimately lost that gig).  
The main problem was finding judges who knew music and could tell a vocal talent from a vocal flop.  I might be in a small camp, but I believe most of the emphasis (i.e., 90%) in deciding a karaoke winner should be on the contestant's voice, not on the act or on how much the contestant is able to move the crowd.  To me, a karaoke contest is essentially a singing contest not an acting audition.  Unfortunately, most judges who are picked at a bar to judge a karaoke contest have no clue as to what to look for in judging a voice--such as pitch, power, range, the difficulty level of the song, etc.--and instead tend to vote for the singer who was best outfitted for the occasion or who wiggled hi/her rump the most, and such unimportant, secondary (if not quaternary) issues.  
I did enter a couple of contests when I first started karaoke  singing, but then quickly learned the sad truth behind 99% of the karaoke contests out there (e.g., the regulars win much more frequently than non-regulars, it helps to be related to the owner or manager in order to win, and that most contests are judged by people entirely clueless about music), and I haven't entered a contest since, and don't plan to, either!

In a nutshell they suck.....
Michelle

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LUV & KISSES SHELL

@Michelle...Why am I so long-winded???

As a way to offer some constructive advice to those who want to pursue the contest route, the following might be a *good start* in attempting to level the playing field as much as practicably feasible:

1)  Male and female contestants should be judged separately.  That is, there should be a male category and a female category.  (I think this was already mentioned.)  Male and female voices are just too dissimilar to be pitted against one another.

2)  Within each of the gender categories, there ought to be subcategories--for instance, Oldies, Classic Rock, Country, Altern. Rock, etc.  Once again, the singing styles for each of these subcategories are too different from one another to be all lumped and compared together.

3)  There should be more than just one winner.  How many times have you attended a contest and just heard too many great singers for you to be able to fairly pick one as *the absolute* best?  I think within each of the subcategories, there should at least be a first, a second, and a third place.  

4)  Judges should be brought in from outside the local scene so as to minimize the chance of acquaintance with the contestants.  These judges should have some credentials in music or the recording industry to have any legitimacy to act in a voting capacity.  

Of course, all of this puts the total price tag of a contest beyond the means of most restaurants and clubs.  But in the absence of such guidelines, there will forever be the unending dissatisfaction and disgust with the outcome of most karaoke contests.  

...I should write a manual on the subject... :rolleyes:

You know SUPRSNGR, I could have been a little more constructive with my above comment, but then I thought NA.
It was 1.30am you know a girl has to be quick sometimes. And I am becoming quite fond of you sweetie after reading some of your posts.

Michelle :p

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LUV & KISSES SHELL

...you're making me blush, Michelle!

Super...
sometimes I wonder if you are not in the Recording Industry yourself...it seems you know too much...  :thumbs-up:

I'd like to see you In Vegas New Year's Weekend...
I'll be looking at singers there that weekend... stay in touch...
I'd like to pick your brain... I like your ideas... :sneaky:

Brian D.

Thank you very much for the kind words, Brian D.  No, I'm a computer consultant actually...PCs, servers, networks, Unix machines, databases, Web design, and wireless (RF)communications, although sometimes I wish I had gone into the music and recording industry.  I might be retired by now and able to spend most of my time doing what I *love* to do, which is sing.   :happy:
Instead, I took the "safe" route and went for a bachelor's, a master's and a doctorate degree :hehe:
But, I have sung since the age of two (my mother tells me so, I can't remember that far back...), and took some music classes while attending college.  I'm pretty much a ballad singer, and on a good night, I can sing any of the following pretty much as well as the original artist(s):
"Peaceful, Easy Feeling," "One of These Nights," "Take It Easy," "Witchy Woman," "I Can't Tell You Why," (all by The Eagles), "If" and "Make It With You" (Bread/David Gates), "I'd Really Love To See You Tonight" (England Dan & John Ford Coley), "Lookin' Out My Backdoor" (CCR), "Imagine" and "Woman" (J. Lennon), "Yesterday" and "And I Love Her" (The Beatles), "Sister Golden Hair" (America), "Carry On, Wayward Son" (Kansas), "Travelin' Man" (Ricky Nelson), "A Teenager In Love" (Dion & The Belmonts), "Cold As Ice" (Foreigner), "Every Woman In The World" (Air Supply), "I'm Into Something Good" (Herman's Hermits), "Time of Your Life" (Green Day), "Out of My Head" and "The Way" (Fastball), "Californication" and "Scar Tissue" (RHCP), "Wrong Way" (Sublime), and "Island In The Sun" (Weezer).  And if the KJ can adjust the mics properly (need loooooooots of echo and reverb) and Charles (my singing partner for certain songs) is there, I can even pull off a couple of Bee Gees tunes ("Night Fever" and "You Should Be Dancing") as close to the recorded version as possible live.  I even do a few female songs occasionally just to mess with the crowd:  "The Tide Is Hight" (Blondie--I change the words a bit so people don't get the wrong idea...), "One of Us" (Joan Osborne) and "You're Still The One" (Shania Twain)--this last one down a half-step (the rest in the original key).  
Anyway, I'm not sure what I'll be doing New Year's Eve, but I'll be more than happy to stay in touch with you.  Feel free to do the same.
Peace and prosperity to all.

Its easy to tell that you are very well educated, just by the posts that you have entered and the way you talk, I believe that even though we dont have a big flow on Karaoke Scene the people here are truly one in a million. Some one asked me to join another Karaoke Forum, but there was so many people and I quickly came back to where I have made wonderful new friends this year. Thank you all for making me look forward to logging on each day and talking to you all.

Love Michelle xoxoxoxoxoxoxoxox :thumbs-up:

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LUV & KISSES SHELL

I think it depends on the method of judging.  I can tell you that I think that the least fair way is by applause.  You could sound like a canadian goose with a cold and still win.  Just bring a bunch of your friends to applaud.  Another contest I witnessed had a different scoring system for country music singers than they did for pop or rock singers. :spiny:

Your right Brad there has to be a fair system for all contestants, any monkey can clap for their friends. The only fair contest is a very professionallay organised contest where the people scoring are qualified to do so.

And on a personal note welcome to Karaoke Scene hope you have fun.

Michelle  :p

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LUV & KISSES SHELL

Thank you for the welcome Michelle.  I'm sure I will enjoy myself.

Your welcome Brad

Michelle

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LUV & KISSES SHELL