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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 6:46 pm 
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MtnKaraoke wrote:
No, I am not using ad-hoc networking. I am using a software hot-spot in windows 7. The network connection is reliable (barring interference) almost all of the time.

The network was still working fine. The problem was that when CH shuts down, the server for the kiosks also shuts down, the kiosks don't handle that very well and have to be re-booted. Even if I was printing tickets, that wouldn't be possible until I restart CH, restart the Remote Request Server and then restart the kiosks.

I am using old (5-7 years) Panasonic ToughBooks for kiosks. They do have touch screens and rubberized keyboards. I found them on e-Bay for around $70 each on average. I use D-Link usb adapters so that the older XP systems can "talk" to the current wireless N secured network.
I've also used, and had customers use Iphones, Blackberries, and HTC Droids. They still have to use a kiosk to enter their "performer profile" but after that they use their devices instead of my kiosks.

When the time comes that 10" tablets drop below $100 in price (kindle is already $139), I'll go book-less and have singers "check-out" my songbooks. Maybe I'll just keep a hard copy of the master list.


eww... that sux.... It seems to me like CH is using a DDE connection (Dynamic Data Exchange) to the kiosks... Been there, done that and it's good for access to the database, but as you experience, completely dependant on the "server" or hosting program being present and connected. Lose that connection and wham-o! Game over.

The scheme I use for my kiosks are a little different: They contain the song listing database locally and are not dependent on the hosting program. So even if the hosting program were to go down completely, I can still print tickets all night long.


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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 6:54 pm 
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Ok, I'm curious on the kiosk you guys are using. do they need to be hooked up to the host computer directly? or do they have wi-fi capabilities as well? I'm suffering specifically to the touch screen units some of you have been referring too . And if so, what are some of the model numbers and makes ?


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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 7:57 pm 
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simpmech wrote:
Ok, I'm curious on the kiosk you guys are using. do they need to be hooked up to the host computer directly? or do they have wi-fi capabilities as well? I'm suffering specifically to the touch screen units some of you have been referring too . And if so, what are some of the model numbers and makes ?


These are 2 different types of kiosks: Sandman uses one that comes with Compuhost and I use Karaoke Songfinder which is a standalone kiosk program.

Both can be run wirelessly or wired. With a good wireless network adapter, you should be able to go 300 feet from the host machine with no problem.

Don't confuse "Wi-Fi" with "wireless" because they are 2 different animals. Wi-Fi requires a "wi-fi router" (special equipment) and wireless can use a standard router (infrastructure) or peer-to-peer (computer-to-computer) doesn't require a router at all. My preference is Infrastructure because in 6 years, I've never had a hiccup. (and I MUCH prefer D-Link brand to Linksys any day)

Sandman uses Panasonic (?) "Toughbook" laptop computers that he bought used.

I use an old win '98 machine with a 15" lcd touchscreen on an adjustable 2-wheeled cart.


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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:35 pm 
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c. staley wrote:
simpmech wrote:
Don't confuse "Wi-Fi" with "wireless" because they are 2 different animals. Wi-Fi requires a "wi-fi router" (special equipment) and wireless can use a standard router (infrastructure) or peer-to-peer (computer-to-computer) doesn't require a router at all. My preference is Infrastructure because in 6 years, I've never had a hiccup. (and I MUCH prefer D-Link brand to Linksys any day)

What documentation do you have to support that statement? Wireless networking == Wi-Fi == 802.11. There aren't two different things supported by every laptop. It's all 802.11, aka wireless networking, aka wi-fi. Yes, it has an infrastructure mode and an ad-hoc mode, and there are many differences in security layer and speed depending on the iteration of the standard. But they are all the same thing.

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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 9:05 pm 
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mckyj57 wrote:
c. staley wrote:
simpmech wrote:
Don't confuse "Wi-Fi" with "wireless" because they are 2 different animals. Wi-Fi requires a "wi-fi router" (special equipment) and wireless can use a standard router (infrastructure) or peer-to-peer (computer-to-computer) doesn't require a router at all. My preference is Infrastructure because in 6 years, I've never had a hiccup. (and I MUCH prefer D-Link brand to Linksys any day)

What documentation do you have to support that statement? Wireless networking == Wi-Fi == 802.11. There aren't two different things supported by every laptop. It's all 802.11, aka wireless networking, aka wi-fi. Yes, it has an infrastructure mode and an ad-hoc mode, and there are many differences in security layer and speed depending on the iteration of the standard. But they are all the same thing.


If you want a wi-fi connection that your patrons can instantly connect to with their smartphones, good luck with regular router.

I Mistyped what I meant.... rather than "wi-fi router" I should have said "wifi Hotspot" I believe what this person is looking for is a way for others to connect to a karaoke system with a smartphone...

However, these kiosk systems are NOT "hotspots" you can access with your phone. (You can make them into one... but what a pain in the arse!)


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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 12:26 am 
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autokdj's new kiosk system (and android app) cache the database locally. If there is a change (such as a song downloaded) the changes are sent to each kiosk.

The kiosks in turn function as servers for the android app users. They just connect to our wifi.

Downside of this is database sizes, and corresponding hash for each song in your database creates a bootyload of data for the small devices.

We use comcast business for internet. I tried mapping a DNS entry to our static IP (then forwarding port 80 and 443 for autokdj communications) This way my customers could queue songs from anywhere.

Found one issue though. Seems the major carriers are blocking comcast IPs. From my IT experience, it's because the largest number of infected, spammy machines come from comcast (no joke)

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It's like the difference between high and low budget toilet paper, it really doesn't matter in the end. -exweedfarmer

Which is smarter? Just sticking to making/selling karaoke, while people all over the world create software FOR FREE that helps you sell it, or trying to compete with them and keeping it a closed loop while you blow your money into an industry (software) that you(the karaoke manu) knows nothing about?
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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 5:14 am 
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c. staley wrote:
mckyj57 wrote:
c. staley wrote:
simpmech wrote:
Don't confuse "Wi-Fi" with "wireless" because they are 2 different animals. Wi-Fi requires a "wi-fi router" (special equipment) and wireless can use a standard router (infrastructure) or peer-to-peer (computer-to-computer) doesn't require a router at all. My preference is Infrastructure because in 6 years, I've never had a hiccup. (and I MUCH prefer D-Link brand to Linksys any day)

What documentation do you have to support that statement? Wireless networking == Wi-Fi == 802.11. There aren't two different things supported by every laptop. It's all 802.11, aka wireless networking, aka wi-fi. Yes, it has an infrastructure mode and an ad-hoc mode, and there are many differences in security layer and speed depending on the iteration of the standard. But they are all the same thing.


If you want a wi-fi connection that your patrons can instantly connect to with their smartphones, good luck with regular router.

I Mistyped what I meant.... rather than "wi-fi router" I should have said "wifi Hotspot" I believe what this person is looking for is a way for others to connect to a karaoke system with a smartphone...

However, these kiosk systems are NOT "hotspots" you can access with your phone. (You can make them into one... but what a pain in the arse!)

It's not that hard any more -- there are pretty standard pieces of software that create a hotspot out of a PC. But it isn't just turning things on, as you note. You have to have a DHCP server and have some sort of IP forwarding to perform the router function. It is far easier just to install a little wifi router, which you can get for $30.00.

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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:56 am 
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I use Win7 and a FREE hotspot called Connectify. The system works reliably and has done so since December of last year.
The problems with the hosting software's server are separate from the network

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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 8:55 am 
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...or you could just run a couple of wires out the COM port.

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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:18 am 
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exweedfarmer wrote:
...or you could just run a couple of wires out the COM port.

Most PCs don't come with COM ports any more. Much less the software that allows you to easily use them.

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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:40 am 
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after reading these responses, and physically looking at different netbooks (all P.O.S. in my opinion) I am on my search for some used and very cheap wi-fi ready laptops. Hitting ebay, amazon and local pawn shops. I like the idea of at least a 12" screen and a full keyboard. The kiosk ideas are great, but my OS (i run on a mac) will not support the windows programs you are using. And I have a KJ program for Mac that I really like already. So, I am going to make it as simple and user friendly as I can. Any further comments, good or bad are welcome


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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:20 am 
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mckyj57 wrote:
exweedfarmer wrote:
...or you could just run a couple of wires out the COM port.

Most PCs don't come with COM ports any more. Much less the software that allows you to easily use them.


I think he was being sarcastic.

There's a ton of USB>Serial stuff out now that lets you use com ports all day long. Man, I so don't miss the days of switching jumpers for port 3f8 and irq 4 and ooh wait, my sound blaster card is using irq's 7 and port 220, gotta make sure there's no conflicts. Oh what was that VGA irq again? 3? Can't use that.

So much easier these days.

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It's like the difference between high and low budget toilet paper, it really doesn't matter in the end. -exweedfarmer

Which is smarter? Just sticking to making/selling karaoke, while people all over the world create software FOR FREE that helps you sell it, or trying to compete with them and keeping it a closed loop while you blow your money into an industry (software) that you(the karaoke manu) knows nothing about?
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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:31 am 
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toqer wrote:
mckyj57 wrote:
exweedfarmer wrote:
...or you could just run a couple of wires out the COM port.

Most PCs don't come with COM ports any more. Much less the software that allows you to easily use them.


I think he was being sarcastic.

There's a ton of USB>Serial stuff out now that lets you use com ports all day long. Man, I so don't miss the days of switching jumpers for port 3f8 and irq 4 and ooh wait, my sound blaster card is using irq's 7 and port 220, gotta make sure there's no conflicts. Oh what was that VGA irq again? 3? Can't use that.

So much easier these days.

LOOOOOL!!!! I remember that!! :D lol


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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:32 am 
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toqer wrote:
mckyj57 wrote:
exweedfarmer wrote:
...or you could just run a couple of wires out the COM port.

Most PCs don't come with COM ports any more. Much less the software that allows you to easily use them.


I think he was being sarcastic.

With weed, you can't be sure...

Quote:
There's a ton of USB>Serial stuff out now that lets you use com ports all day long. Man, I so don't miss the days of switching jumpers for port 3f8 and irq 4 and ooh wait, my sound blaster card is using irq's 7 and port 220, gotta make sure there's no conflicts. Oh what was that VGA irq again? 3? Can't use that.

So much easier these days.

It is, which is why I am glad I stopped working for the serial-port-maker I worked for in the 1980s and 1990s. 8-)

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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 12:15 pm 
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Oh that's a good laugh on me. I wasn't being sarcastic and it just goes to show you how old my karaoke machines are. I never even looked for a COM port on the little Windows 7 moster I'm typing on and now that I do... well, there isn't one. Look to the west, that bright red glow is me. :withstupid:

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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 1:57 pm 
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exweedfarmer wrote:
Oh that's a good laugh on me. I wasn't being sarcastic and it just goes to show you how old my karaoke machines are. I never even looked for a COM port on the little Windows 7 moster I'm typing on and now that I do... well, there isn't one. Look to the west, that bright red glow is me. :withstupid:



Happens to me too.... and that's because we grew up with computers with cranks in the front to get 'em going....

These days, you're obsolete in 3 months.


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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 6:47 pm 
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My computer you had to hold down the OPTION Key to disable the built in basic.

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It's like the difference between high and low budget toilet paper, it really doesn't matter in the end. -exweedfarmer

Which is smarter? Just sticking to making/selling karaoke, while people all over the world create software FOR FREE that helps you sell it, or trying to compete with them and keeping it a closed loop while you blow your money into an industry (software) that you(the karaoke manu) knows nothing about?
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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 11:10 am 
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My first computer was a Trash 80 model I, circa 1978.. then a few years later i'd eagerly await the next issue of Compute! magazine to arrive so I could see what kinds of cool programs I could type in that month.. first on my trusty VIC 20, then on my Commodore 64.

I cut my 'online' teeth logging into BBS's at 300 baud, and who could forget the great D-Dial seven line systems run on Apple II hardware.. seven people chatting at the same time.

I remember getting my first 1200 baud modem in the mail that i'd ordered from one of those cornball 'Protecto Enterprises' ads.. although there were very few local systems I could dial into that supported that high a speed.

The good old days.


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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:19 pm 
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theCheese wrote:
My first computer was a Trash 80 model I, circa 1978.. then a few years later i'd eagerly await the next issue of Compute! magazine to arrive so I could see what kinds of cool programs I could type in that month.. first on my trusty VIC 20, then on my Commodore 64.

I cut my 'online' teeth logging into BBS's at 300 baud, and who could forget the great D-Dial seven line systems run on Apple II hardware.. seven people chatting at the same time.

I remember getting my first 1200 baud modem in the mail that i'd ordered from one of those cornball 'Protecto Enterprises' ads.. although there were very few local systems I could dial into that supported that high a speed.

The good old days.


I didn't have that experience, my first computer was in "95", an HP (which was on the recall list LOL) had AOL phone line connection with a blazing speed that could download a program in 24 to 36 hours. The funny thing is that computer is still in use today!


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 Post subject: Re: Going paperless
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:50 pm 
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Thunder wrote:
I didn't have that experience, my first computer was in "95", an HP (which was on the recall list LOL) had AOL phone line connection with a blazing speed that could download a program in 24 to 36 hours. The funny thing is that computer is still in use today!


...And it has a COM Port!!! :mrgreen:

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