Karaoke Forums

To FLIPPER YOU LISTEN!!

He's one of the FORTUNATE ones---but again LONG-TERM GUY.

Forutnate to have excellent management who REALLY KNOW THE VALUE HE BRINGS!

Not too many like him in PDX or like the venue he's at.

Most end up being low-ballers like discussed above.

But he's REALLY GOT THE KEY----get in when a new place is JUST OPENING UP or has NEVER HAD KARAOKE BEFORE and stick with it as the place grows and Karaoke become a key part of its foundation. But even then stupid owners will go for the low-ballers that come along right behind you.

THATS THE ONLY REAL WAY to succeed with the clubs here. Get in before the owners become poisoned with 75-a-nighters.

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

I feel that the KJ's in this area have done it to themselves with regard to the pay problem. Accepting substandard pay becomes the norm and the bar owners are all to happy to take advantage of it. Most of the KJ's who start up have never owned a business before so they are approaching the business from a hourly wage mentality and not factoring in operating costs such as transportation, wear and tear on equipment, song library additions, book reprints, taxes, insurance etc.

I have had bar owners balk at my prices and say "well I can get several local KJ's for less. My response is to use a similar example that they can relate to:

If I order Crown and Water from you but ask what the price is first and you say that will be $5.50. In turn I say that I can go down the street and get that same drink for $3.25 what would be your response?

Your price is based upon the expense of delivering that drink to me. It includes your profit to cover all the overhead. If you offer it for less you could not keep your doors open very long. Yet you are not allowing me to do the same thing with you. I offer a valuable service that brings in and keeps customers in your place of business and that requires professionalism. The price I charge reflects my cost of doing business and enough profit to make it a worthwhile venture. So next time you make that statement to a KJ you might want to take that into consideration first as they are no different than your business, they must make a profit to survive.

The economy in Oregon is not doing very well. Our unemployment rate is around 12% right now and the bars are struggling to make it. On the other hand the bar that I work at is thriving on Karaoke night. We do an amazing amount of business in those 3 hours and the other bars in the area are dead. Karaoke is the single largest grossing night of the week for my venue. So what would you rather have a $75 a night hobbyist or a professional karaoke company do your show. If you want the revenue then you will opt for the professional. The choice is yours.....

Many times after I say this I get a positive response from them. They appreciate that I run my business like a business and seem to relate to me better and I usually get my price.

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FlipSide Karaoke
Scott

Thanks, Flipper, for your well thought out (as usual) post - the content of your posts always contains at least one or two points that others without your business acument and experience should definitely take advantage of. Free advice, people, take it.

Flipper is one of those long-time succesful guys that I decribed earlier.
He lays it right out as to why he's been successful for so many years and why he has the LOYAL following he does and why he can COMMAND the rates that he does and why his barowners do anything they can to keep him. Again its the BUSINESS-LIKE and PROFESSIONAL skill and performance that makes the difference and makes it possible for him to get the gig referrals(that he constantly turns down).

Its a PROVEN TRACK RECORD over many years that he has.

That SO MANY OTHERS DONT!!


HEY WE HAVENT HEARD ANY FURTHER INPUT FROM OUR POST ORIGINATOR. WHERE DID SHE GO?????????

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

Oh and Flipper is ABSOLUETLY telling the truth about how well his gig does. Ive been dropping by from time to time over the past 3-4 years(since Ive come to know him) and EVERY SINGLE TIME the place is PACKED---SRO--on a weeknight. So he is being absoluetly ACCURATE when he tells how well karaoke night does there.

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

Hey Kwhore I hope we didn't scare you off...

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[img]<img%20src="http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j288/miller2348/myspace/images/Funny_Pics/images/21.gif"[/img]

CHECK YOUR ATTITUDE AT THE DOOR, STICK AROUND YOU JUST MIGHT HAVE SOME FUN

Kwhore,

Wow! I planned to move to Portland last winter and start business there (I'm an Oregonoan transplanted to LA). This info is news to me. Anyway...

Starting a karaoke business is tough. I can only suggest what I did...

Frequent bars/clubs where you enjoy the karaoke. Become friends with the bar staff, managers, and KJ's. Over time, offer your services as a temp or as a potential employee to the KJ. My first gig came from a KJ who was leaving a club. He knew me well because I did what I listed above... and the patrons of the bar and staff all knew me and liked me. Because I was so well-liked, the bar offered me the same deal as the seasoned KJ who was leaving.

Now, that's a long-term strategy, and you may not be able to tough it out over months. If you can't, try and take a few of these $75/night jobs close to home (so gas and travel are limited)... but make the contract over say 6 months (you decide the duration). So, if you bring in few people over 6 months, you leave. If you bring in a large, consistent crowd, you get bumped up to a higher nightly rate.

Lastly, try and find out what works in karaoke at the clubs you like. You're going to have to hustle the next few months, and with teh saturation in your market, you will need to have a good show -- that fits your venues -- asap.

Wish I had better words for you. I've just come out of the early business stages and am trying to expand. So, I know the aggravations well!

Just Saw this on CL Portland, I guess Kwhore wasn't lying...

DJ and Karaoke Services - Best rates around!!! (Portland and Surrounding)

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Date: 2009-09-03, 12:32PM PDT
Reply to: serv-zh7sy-1356985229@craigslist.org [Errors when replying to ads?]

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Do you have a nightclub or tavern and looking for a professional yet fun DJ and/or KJ to bring some new excitement to your place? Look no further!
Sign up for two or more nights per week and we are only $75 per night, any night including weekends!

Have a wedding, company picnic, birthday party or other event that you need a DJ/KJ for? Events starting at $250!!!
Hire the ultimate in entertainment for your next event or on a regular basis for your tavern or restaurant!

We will beat ANYONE'S written quote!

We provide highly professional yet fun DJ and karaoke services. With a Music Library of over 20,000 songs all digital, no discs!!! You will not find a more complete service.

Captivating lighting combined with crystal clear music promise to make your next event or club the talk of the town!
Our KJ/DJ's dress and act professionally, but know how to have fun and make sure your guests have a great time!
State of the art all digital equipment insures the highest quality sounds!

Please contact Shawn @ 503-428-6243


Location: Portland and Surrounding
it's NOT ok to contact this poster with services or other commercial interests

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[img]<img%20src="http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j288/miller2348/myspace/images/Funny_Pics/images/21.gif"[/img]

CHECK YOUR ATTITUDE AT THE DOOR, STICK AROUND YOU JUST MIGHT HAVE SOME FUN

AND ALL YOU DOUBTED ME WHEN I WROTE MY BLEAK DESCRIPTION OF PDX Karaoke!!

Thank you DANGEROUS!!

So in PDX we have a combination of things working against decent wages----

1. People like the guy above.

2. Illegal hardrive operators.

3. Multiriggers who will go in at 75 OR LESS(and I DO MEAN OR LESS--I personally know of one I was hooked-up with for a couple months who specifically chatted with me about it)

4. A HUGE influx of sales of QUESTIONABLE CAVS systems with harddrives sold by a particular KJ individual throughout the Willamette Valley(south of PDX), the PDX/VANCOUVER metro area and out on the coast. These are fixed installations that the bar buys for thier own equipment along with the music, songbooks etc. Effectively eliminating these venues from ever needing to hire a mobile DJ again--and that was the selling point--so they never have to offer above 60-75$ ever. AND THERE ARE MANY MANY OF THESE PLACES. Just chopped the legs right out from under the KJ wage structure.

There are only a small number of truly successfull KJs in the area---LIKE FLIPPER. Unless they have been at a place for many years or get in on the bottom floor before the undercutters come around and are FORTUNATE to have INTELLIGENT barwoners with INTEGRITY who recognize the VALUE of a PROFESSIONAL such as FLipper..............well its back to junk and 75 sa night.


It is what it is here and DAngerous's post only goes to verify it.

And I wonder if Ive met this guy in the ad?? Could well be if its the same guy Im thinking of named Shawn. Ive met MANY MANY KJ's around pdx/vanc doing stories.

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

I just don't get it. Why would anyone work for $75 including setup and tear down?

It makes no sense at all. I think I'm going to give this guy or gal a call and see what I can find out. If he is legit then maybe I can convince him or her to start commanding a higher rate and stop degrading the market here.

They are promoting themselves right into poverty...

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FlipSide Karaoke
Scott

For an owner/operater I'd ask the same question. As far as an employee, in these economic times, anything above minimum wage ($9-11/hr) I could see, esp with all the crappy min wage jobs out there. Of course if you have an illegal library and crappy equipment (say a total of a max investment of $1,000) then not a bas return.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

For someone that is broke $75 is better than nothing. If you don't know what you are doing and you do get a job, $75 is better than nothing.

I use the price charged to rate their talent level. Anyone can be a $75 KJ. To get more money your talent level needs to be higher.

The $75 KJ is at the bottom of the KJ talent list. These are the lowest of the low. I don't consider myself in the bottom or middle level. I wouldn't work for $75 20 years ago. I certainly wouldn't do it now.

The price you are willing to work for tells me enough about you. That doesn't matter if you are legal or illegal.

Many of the KJs at the 75 or less level are working for bars that have own equipment and they are essentially hourly employees of he bar or a multirigger.

Now $75/5 hr=$15.00/hour---which is not bad as a PART-TIME Hourly employee at a bar. Anything more is even better from that standpoint. Less is not so good.

Now for a MOBILE DJ with his own equipment working at that rate, doing breakdowns setups, hauling it around, maintaining equip, adding music etc----------NOW THAT IS A PROBLEM.

But either way its pretty much considered to be a going rate due to all the reasons discussed above. And with the exception of a few well-established PROS(like Flipper), KJ's are looked at as a dime-a-dozen hourly employees with plenty more where they came from.

Thats in PDX/Vancouver metro. Cant speak for other regions.

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

"I Just don't get it. Why would anyone work for $75 including setup and tear down?"

One word: DESPERATION.

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

$75 a night to walk in and turn on the house equipment isn't bad. That's almost $20 an hour at 4 hours. How many $20 an hour jobs are out there? I never had a real job paying $20 an hour.

It's too low to be mobile unless you can carry everything in, in one trip. Then that's all you'll ever be worth.

Ok, time out.. BIG timeout! Didn't you in another thread Angel argue until you were blue in the face that pay should be the same regardless of whether you were tearing down or able to leave your equipment? HAVE YOU CHANGED YOUR MIND or just forgot about your stance in that thread?

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

I believe she was referring to the HOURLY BAR EMPLYOYEE situation. $$ per hour to walk in and turn on THE BAR's EQUPMENT. NOT MOBILE DJ. I dont agree with it for mobile DJ even if it is rolled in on one cartload. Too much upkeep, etc to have to invest in to make it worthwhile.

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

I didn't say i would do it. I said in general when asked why would anyone work for $75. If it's cash it's like getting $100. Some mobile KJs aren't worth much more than $75. You may have seen some.

If the house system is close to what i would expect and would sound and act very close to my setup then i want my price to do my magic. Part of my worth is knowing how to mix. Part is reading the crowd. Part is my sense of humor. Part is my entertainment value. Part is my experience and following. Part of that is my time. All things that are worth money to anyone hiring me. They could get the $75 a night KJ. If they know what i have done and can do, they have to pay for that. I'm not now or will ever be a $75 KJ. With or Without equipment. Now we are back to this again. If you want Elvis to be at your bar you pay what Elvis charges. If you want someone acting like Elvis then you get what you pay for. I'm the real deal KJ, not an impersonator KJ. It's not a matter of if i can deliver. It's just a matter of how long it will take. This economy isn't helping any of us.

To anyone out of work and hungry or in need of a warm place to sleep, $75 a day is a nice bit of change. That was my point. If you don't have any steady work because you're a lousy KJ, anyone that is stupid enough to pay you that, you'll work for.

If you were really in dire need of cash you might even offer to do it for less. Some money is always better than none.

It comes down to this. Your talent level and your despiration level. Remember the saying everybody has their price for doing everything. Pay me enough money and i might think about being a hired killer. It won't be $75. That and a cup of coffee can get you a lousy KJ for a night.

It's too low to be mobile unless you can carry everything in, in one trip. Then that's all you'll ever be worth.

It's too low to be mobile unless you can carry everything in, in one trip. Then that's all you'll ever be worth.

It's too low to be mobile unless you can carry everything in, in one trip. Then that's all you'll ever be worth.


Very contradictive to what you said in the other thread. No matter how you slice it.

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]