Karaoke Forums

You're Kidding right? Go back and read every post in here again. Everyone of us answered all of your questions very completely. There is nothing to add or change.

Are you worried about your reputation at all? Do you care if you get hired any place else?

I quit more jobs than most KJs ever had. Do you have any other jobs? Have you looked for any? If you lose this job will it cause a tremendous financial hardship for you?

Most Bar/restaurant owners never do anything right as far as making money. How much are you making there? If the business owner has already said the till doesn't look good, he means it.

1. TELL THE WHINERS YOU RUN A FAIR ROTATION AND THAT IS THE ONLY THING THAT GETS YOU JOBS. YOUR EQUAL FAIR TREATMENT OF EVERY SINGER. YOU DON'T DISCRIMINATE.

IF THEY QUIT COMING TOO BAD. Hope the door doesn't hit them in the A&&. Suck it up. You will lose plenty of jobs over time. WE all have. You can not build a night based on a handful of people. There are other people to take their place. I'm not saying that these people aren't important, but if you lose this job are they going to pay your rent? So they aren't that important. WHINERS ARE BUSINESS KILLERS.

You are going to lose everyone if you start KISSING THEIR A&&. If the business owner wants you to KISS THEIR A&& you will lose all the other people along with your reputation. Then you won't have to worry about getting another job. NOBODY WILL COME.

It's not your job to calculate everyones spending habits for the night. It won't help you anyway. That's why they have a cash register.

The business is going to make enough money to keep you or they aren't.

Do you run a fair rotation now? (VERY IMPORTANT)

You said there are new people coming in.

2. IT TAKES TIME TO BUILD A NICE CROWD. As little as one new person a week. That will only take you a year to get 50 more people. You may have to work with the business owner on the price you are now charging if you need to keep this job.

3. IT HAPPENS TO ALL OF US. Not every job we get runs like a textbook case. Some are very hard to get going. You have to find enough people that already have plans and places they hang out, to change their plans to start coming there. It takes time for the word to spread. EACH BAR DRAWS IT'S OWN CROWD.

Do you have monthly calenders to give to the singers? Do you have calenders in your books for people to see? Do you have posters to hang in the restrooms and around the bar? Do you tell the people other places you work?

Karaoke isn't a big "no work" party for you. Building a quality karaoke business reputation is hard work and takes time. How the people talk about you is how you get jobs or not.

If you can't figure out how to keep this job after all these posts without ruining your reputation, there is no hope for you. Sorry.

Lonnie...what's a Dessert Pizza?? We dont get those in the UK....

HOW SHOULD YOU REACT ?.... Just do the job , run a good and fair show - You can't be OWNED by a few people who think they are better or deserve SPECIAL treatment because they spend more money ! --That's crazy !! very diplomatically tell them that the rotation is run on 1st come 1st sing and not on how much money is spent. Tell them that you really appreciate their support and SMOOZE them a little . Sometimes little minded people just want to FEEL special

Pizza Ranch in town,,, dessert pizza,, mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm tastes like a cinnamon pastry!

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

Hey guys give Tovmod a break. He is a new KJ trying to keep his gig. He's just looking for suggestions on what to say to these people. He isn't suggesting he should let them sing more. He's willing to put up with the whiners because he really wants to keep the gig.

It's easy for us not to care if we lose whiners as customers because we've been doing this so long. We realize people come and go, and it is better to get rid of the hard to deal with people then try to be nice to them. I agree you shouldn't make special amends for whiners, and I don't think Tov is saying that. He'd just like to see them coming in still, so he can keep his gig.

I liken it to when I first started. It bites to lose your first gig. Once he is more established he'll be able not care if he loses a few whiners and realize in the long run it is better not to have them.

Good luck Tov and let us know what happens.

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[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

I am only a singer so no real advice from experience but I will tell ya this.

If I walk into a place and find that I have to spend X amount of $$ to sing Z amount of songs............I will walk out the door and go to the next karaoke place.

If I walk into a place and find that the KJ is not running a fair, first come, first served type rotation.........I will walk out the door and go to the next karaoke place.

..and honestly, what kind of nut job keeps up with what other people are spending?

No matter what, I would definitely keep in close contact with the owner about this subject and try to get him to suggest what to do. After all, he's paying you. Also don't be rude to anyone in there (which I think you're not anyway), try to show your nicest side to each side and get them somehow "together".

It's not an easy situation, but with the owner's input definitely workable.

The bar owner is the last one i'm taking advice from about my business. He will want you to "take care" of the whiners. Bar owners will agree with everyone that spent a dollar. If he wants him (KJ) to let them (whiners) sing more, he (KJ) is screwed.

I will not let a bar owner make my rotation unfair to accomodate what he wants ignoring what it will do to my reputation. I don't recommend any KJ do that.

I have a group of semi regulars that spend a lot of money when they come. They usually have 6-8-10 people in the group. One guys tips me $20 every night.

I don't base my night on them showing up. I don't overly Kiss their a&&. If they show up the night is a little better, but it's not breaking my night if they don't. I'm not losing sleep every night hoping and praying they show up. If they do, they do, if they don't..OH WELL.

You can not base your entire success on a small group of people, especially if they are whiners. They will drag you down with them. They will hurt your reputation if you offer them special privileges. If one of them gets sick they will al stop coming anyway. People will come and go all the time. I don't base anything on anyone. Whoever is there is and the ones that aren't, aren't so what. Do your best show for the ones that are there.

The possibility exists that you will LOSE this job. It won't matter if the whiners stay or go. Expect it. Except it and move on. It won't be the only one you lose. That's just how it goes. Learn from your experiences good or bad.

In general I agree with you, in this particular situation I don't. Fact is, he wants to keep the show. Therefor my advice to work it out with the owner. Obviously the owner does care about the Karaoke night.

Tovmod, the answer to your problem on approaching the whiners is to tell them that you run a fair rotation for all, and that you'd really like to help them, but there's just NO WAY you can change the rotation policy. They are concerned about how many songs THEY get to sing, and that they are singing less because of the CHEAP people, RIGHT? What if you get some customers that are spending MORE than the WHINERS, does that mean that THEY get preferential treatment OVER the WHINERS? That would mean that they sing even LESS songs. If they are NORMAL people, and you explain this to them, they'll only have 3, conclusions that they can come to, 1. Monitor what EVERYONE is spending, 2. Agree with you that it is IMPOSSIBLE for YOU to know what EVERYONE is spending, or 3. They really are A$$****'s, and don't care about YOU, YOUR OTHER CUSTOMERS, YOUR BUSINESS, or anything other than HOW MANY SONGS THEY GET TO SING. If they choose #3, you don't need them, BUT, that's YOUR call, if you want them, YOU GOT THEM.


Rosario

What if the bar owner says let them (whiners) sing more times than the other singers? Then what? Do you still agree? Now he's screwing with the mans reputation. That could ruin his chances of future employment. Are you willing to let a bar owner do that to you just to keep a job?

That's what's coming. What other solution do you think the bar owner will have? I highly doubt he has anything else to suggest.

If he throws out the ones that aren't spending as much then what? Now he's the spending control NAZI?

I'm never going down that road of letting a bar owner tell me how the rotation will be for any reason. That's the worst possible thing you could do for your business.

I agree rotation is the KJs responsibilty and the owner should not be involved in it. If a bar owner starts telling me when people should or shouldn't sing, we've got a problem. Bar owners usually don't understand the importance of keeping a fair rotation.

I don't think there is anything wrong with keeping the owner informed if necessary about what is going on in case people are running to him to complain. Most of the time venue owners don't want to bothered with our problems. They think all they should do is hire us and we are reponsible for our customers unless we are in harms way.

You could although discuss advertising to get more people in, so you don't have to worry about losing whiners.

Tov - do you advertise within the bar? Posters, table tents etc..

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[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

If the owner tells me to jump up one of his friends in the rotation --I do it
If he tells me to turn up or down the music ...I do it

If he tells me to take care of the HIGH ROLLERS and MONEY SPENDERS... I do it

I'll make sure that anyone effected knows where its coming from ( the owner) but I do it .....The owner is the boss ---The one writing the check and the one ultimately responsible for the business profitable ......

excluding anything unsafe or illegal

This reminds me of a venue i hosted a few years ago. The OWNER was a control freak and didn't respect anyone that worked for him, only the paying customers' money. Then he would speak badly about the customers when they left.

This got OLD quickly... but the venue was always packed and i got paid $225 for four hours on a monday night. So i "hung in there" for approx 6 months. I was always respectful speaking to him and carried myself professionally at all times.

Even with the success of the show he had a hard time looking me eye-to-eye and respecting my huge contribution to his bottom line.

Eventually he started trying to direct my show and began to sing himself insisting HE WAS NEXT UP whenever he had time.

I concurred to my dismay. I finally quit when one night he pushed me to cater to only his 12 friends and ignore the other singers requests. I apologised to my regulars and shut off the equipment and left.

I have since moved on to greener pastures many times over and have had owners completely respect what i do and would never interfere or impose their will...

My point being; sometimes you NEED TO deal with BAD owners' dispositions if you wanna keep that job. change sucks and sometimes you gotta suck it up. Some kjs "walk" at the first sign of trouble and leave behind all their hard work because of personality issues. I stayed hoping he would change. i was wrong on that one, but not on many others. MOST Owners warm up and LEARN how it really works after awhile.

That particular venue lasted another year of business and brought in cheaper raunchy karaoke to its demise. I still went to say hello and to support the nice waitstaff. I became better "friends" with the owner after the fact. Bankrupsy and lousy investments in a car dealership eventually put that venue in the ground...

Great post - That's more of where I was coming from, but explained so much better.

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[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

..Aww shucks Babs... You always say the sweetest things!...

I'm still new at this, but I've already let the owner know my rotation is my rotation and will be run to the letter of the law inside the songbooks. He knows this and respects it. If he wants a volume change, I respect that.

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

Of course some requests are within reason from bartenders, the manager, owner. I actually appreciate it most times when they tell me the volume maybe to loud as long as it is within reason.

I was speaking more of the owner/manager who is the control freak constantly telling me how to run my show.

I turned down a gig at a resort because after talking to the manager I realized we weren't a good fit. He told me he wanted to sing when ever he wanted and when his friends came in they were to sing as much and when ever they wanted. He also told me if he didn't like the way someone sang I was to tell them they weren't allowed to sing any more. This was a huge red flag to me it would be a nightmare to work with him.

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[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

Sounds like this resort is South. Waaaaay South, He!!. The guy sounds like the devil of karaike.

The funny part is the guy called me. It was more money than the Friday night gig I already had, but it wasn't worth it. He acted as if I needed to compromise my standards because he was doing me a favor by offereing the job. Like how dare I say no. I stayed professional although the guy was a total jerk. I heard it took 2 months to get a KJ in there and he only lasted a couple weeks.

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[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]