Karaoke Forums

Heard someone bring up contracts in the Gig from Hell thread and figured that was another great topic that deserved another thread.

In his post, the dude mentions negotiations were going fine and he felt he was about to land this dream gig until he brought up a contract.. and then it was 'Don't call us, we'll call you.'

In close to 20 years of performing i've worked under a contract only a handful of times.. and generally those were contracts or performance agreements that the VENUE had me sign.

Sure i've had bar owners try to re-negotiate the pay at the end of the night on a slow night.. and if the club WAS slow, i'll generally cut them a break.

Sure i've had the occasional bar owner try to write me a check at the end of the night, and i'll agree, only if they cash the check at the bar.

Sure i've had instances on at least seven occasions, where I pull up to a regular gig only to find that the place has either shut down, burned down, or has changed ownership since I was last there.

I've had plenty of situations where I *could* have pulled out a contract and said, "See.. it says here this is how we do things.", but i've always found it's easier to work things out on the spot and either walk away happy, or look for a new gig to fill that night from then on.

In short, I strongly suspect requiring a venue to sign a contract would loose me more money than having such a contract would save me.

Maybe if I were doing regular $1200 a night shows or something i'd reevaluate my position.. but when i'm getting paid between $150 and $250 a night for bar gigs and $600 for parties, I just think it's more hassle than it's worth.

Besides, a contract is only worth as much as you're willing to pursue it. If the venue defaults on his/her end of the bargain, it's up to you to take them to court, pay the filing fee.. get up early and show up, etc etc.. for what? Because the club owner stiffed me for $150?

It hasn't happened yet.. but if it did? Life is too short to go through all the court hassle to end up with a judgement against a guy for $150 that you still have to try and collect.

When I do private parties and things of that nature I generally require half up front as a non refundable deposit, and the balance when I set up.

Bar gigs pay me in cash, or a check I can cash at the bar at the end of the night. They pay the pre-agreed amount at the end of the night.

No contracts.. just a handshake.

For bar gigs, I rarely use a contract unless they request one. As you said, a contract is only valuable if you're going to pursue it and in those cases for $200-300, it's usually not worth it. If they stiff me, I just won't be back. If they go out of biz well who was I going to sue at that point anyway? If they cancel a gig at the last minute, it's only a few hundred bucks and would I really take them to small claims over it?

Now private parties on the other hand are a completely different animal. This is where I ALWAYS have a contract. Not so much to make sure I get paid or whatever, but to protect myself. Especially with weddings but even with other parties, you want to make sure it's in writing what you will and won't provide. What happens if there's bad weather, you get sick or in an accident, etc. For Private gigs I always require half down. For weddings and some major events I require the remaining balance 2-4 weeks in advance of the show, for smaller gigs I require it once I've completed setup. In my contracts I also include language about my requirements (power, space, shelter). This puts it out there so they can see exactly what I need. It doesn't guarantee that I'll get what I ask for but it puts it in their heads and gives me a legal "out" if a bad situation occurs that can't be worked around (outdoor gig, rain coming, no shelter - I'm outta there with my money).

The person with the most to lose is usually the one that will want the contract. When you're hired by a club, they usually have a lot more money and resources than you do, so if anyone would want a contract it would be them. With a private gig, your client is the one that is going to see potential dollar signs if they feel they have grounds for a lawsuit, so protecting yourself is a very good idea.

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DJ Tony
Let It Rip Karaoke

Yep That pretty much sums it up for me too. Except when I was in a band we always used contracts.

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Contracts for private shows only. Never used one for clubs to date. I have watched in the past companies with contracts lose in court simply because the club made the statement, the company promised so much following/return and didn't come through.

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Pretty well same as Lonnie. Though for private parties/weddings we get half up front a week before the event, nonrefundable unless we screw up (and has never happened). This way if they cancel we have been paid for our prep.

Thecheese


Now on the other end if the bar has a great night, do they give you a bonus?

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You can be strange but not a stranger

The problem is they operate on the same O & E I do if they want a discount for a slow night then I want to share in a bonus for a great night.

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CHECK YOUR ATTITUDE AT THE DOOR, STICK AROUND YOU JUST MIGHT HAVE SOME FUN

How would I compose a contract?

Even if things go wrong and I am awful
you agree to pay me $..........

I couldn't do it.
But, I wouldn't know how to anyway.

Weddings and parties?

1/2 due at signing - remainder due 2-4 weeks before the event. Contract value? Hovers in the $1500-$3000 range most of the time. On occasion it will be higher or lower depending on the event.


Club
No contract in the past. If I can't trust a business to pay me at the end of the night what we agreed upon, then I probably shouldn't be doing business with them.

If I get back into bar business I'll likely have a simple agreement stating that I'm covered by the bars dram shop liability insurance if I'm sued. Otherwise, I'd be extremely flexible - but any agreement I'd have reviewed by a lawyer. One DJ company I worked for had a contract, but it's pretty straightforward. $xxx per night, paid monthly, and the bar can cancel the contract at any time by simply notifying the DJ company 1 month in advance so they can seek work elsewhere for their DJ's. Most bars didn't have a problem with that when they hired them.

If you PM me with your e-mail address, I'll send you a copy of what I have drafted.

As far as using contracts, I'm in agreement with what the others have already stated. In my area, we (KJs) get paid "Off the Books" and most of us do NOT work with a contract. I know of 1 or 2 KJs in my area that do work with a written contract, but they seem to be always looking for a new gig after 2 or 3 months.

I have only tried to use my contract once (for a Bar gig). The only reason I presented the contract to this place, was because the guy was infamous for stiffing the past KJs that worked there. He would be there at the beginning of the evening, and then leave early. Then he would call up the Bar about 30 minutes before the show was to end, and check with the Bartender (as to how much money was taken in). Then, based on that, he would tell the Bartender how much to pay the KJ for the night. Well, after 3 KJs had worked there for several months each (and then quit), I decided to try my hand at it. The Manager was all smiles until I handed him a contract, and told him that I will not work there without the use of a contract. He said that he would look it over and call me. Needless to say, he never called me.

The only time I really use a contract, is for private parties.

Don't know about karaoke, but a dj friend of mine charges a minimum $1500 per event with the avg being $2500 - he is VERY good and booked every weekend through Jan 2012 with several weekends have 2 gigs per day - 1 day show, 1 night show. Primarily does weddings but works with the wedding party to coordinate the entire wedding as well and can get everyone up to 99% dancing at some point in the night. I know he does karaoke, but never a club gig & is usually just an add on to the dj portion.

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