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Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
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Author:  RNSK [ Tue Oct 05, 2010 6:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
Hey everyone :)

I'm a relative newb ready to start looking for my first gig. I was hoping to borrow some wisdom from some of you veterans here. Does anyone have any advice, tips, or tidbits of information that you wish you had known when you were first starting out?

The first logical step seems to be determining which venues might be receptive to having me as a KJ at their establishment. Any advice on how to best make that determination, and on subsequent steps I should take? I know this is an incredibly broad query, so I appreciate any time you take to respond.

Again, thanks so much.

RNSK
Author:  Kevinper [ Tue Oct 05, 2010 7:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
The first gig is usually the hardest.

Go to different venues. See first if they have the capacity for a karaoke show. Buy something. Talk to the owner. Talk to the bartender. Be prepared to tell them what you have to offer and how it will help them make money.

Whether or not you get a gig at a venue, leave at the very least a business card and preferably something to go with it that shows what kind of quality entertainment you have.

Maybe you can "tupperware" it and get your friend to pay you at first for some parties? At least then you would have someone as a reference.

When you get one, advertise. Do not leave it up to the venue to do it. Invite people you know to help fill some seats.
Author:  DannyG2006 [ Tue Oct 05, 2010 7:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
I have done gigs for friends before doing a bar gig and it helped me get setting up in different circumstances (location of setups), the feel of the system. I still do freebie parties every now and then when I'm bringing in new equipment into the mix so that when I do do a paying gig, I'm not going in blind.
Author:  letitrip [ Wed Oct 06, 2010 8:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
A couple thoughts here. One, try to find friends who either know a bar owner or are regulars at a bar where they think Karaoke would be a good fit. These are great places to start with. Confidence is key. You don't have to lie but you should exude confidence in your ability to make money for the bar when you talk to the owner. Always do it in person, avoid "cold call' sales, it just doesn't work very well. Find some other KJ's in your area and buddy up with them. Find one or two your comfortable with and talk to them about your desire to get into the biz and see what feedback they have. Not only is this a learning experience for you but it also puts your name on their radar as possibly someone they could call to fill-in.

Set your price right now, before you go into any venue to pitch your services. Know what you want to get and don't let your inexperience be a factor in deciding what you believe you should get paid. Don't let the bar dictate your pay, it's a negotiation. You should have 3 numbers in mind when you go in. The number you're going to ask for first, the number you want to get, and the minimum you'll take to get a gig. I STRONGLY urge you to avoid setting that last number too low. Once you take a gig for $100, it's difficult if not impossible to work up to the point where you're getting $200 for a gig. In this business if you go in as the cheap option, you tend to get "type cast" permanently as the cheap option and getting rid of that reputation is tough. Remember this biz is all about word of moth referrals. If your bar that you're playing at for a measely c-note tells his bar owner friends, "Hey I got this great KJ and he only costs me $100 a night" then those other bar owners will want to book you but at that same low rate.

If you do decide to go in for a low introductory rate, make sure you and the client are very clear that it is only temporary and set a specific point in time when the rate goes up to normal. For instance, you could say, I'll give you the first 2 months (or 8 shows) for $125 but after that my rate will be $200. Don't leave it open ended or you'll never get that bump up to the rate you should be at.

Finally, don't be afraid to turn down a show that just can't afford you. There are many tiny bars around that want Karaoke but could never put enough butts in the seats to justify it. If the bar can only hold 20 people, they'll never be able to make enough in a night to pay your fee. Remember you're in this to build a crowd and following, you don't do that at venues that can't bring in people. So don't be afraid to just say no thanks.
Author:  jerry12x [ Wed Oct 06, 2010 1:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
Kevinper @ Wed Oct 06, 2010 3:07 am wrote:
Whether or not you get a gig at a venue, leave at the very least a business card and preferably something to go with it that shows what kind of quality entertainment you have.


Yes.
Author:  exweedfarmer [ Wed Oct 06, 2010 1:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
Some good advice here already.

I would add... have your presentation together. Be ready to answer all questions they may throw at you. If you have great equipment bring a picture. If you have a great voice and they already have karaoke, come early and wow the owner with something up tempo.

It doesn't hurt to schmooze a bit. Target the bar you want to work at and make some friends. Somebody is going to ask you what you do. Don't go into a sales pitch, just tell them. Got a funny karaoke story? Tell it.
Author:  leopard lizard [ Wed Oct 06, 2010 1:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
I have joked that we really do need a "drinking budget" in our "marketing" dept. It seems to be a matter of who you know or being in the right place at the right time.
Author:  spotlightjr [ Wed Oct 06, 2010 4:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
One of the most important things I can think of is to sell "YOU". The main focal point of your presentation should be about you. Not the number of songs you have, what type speakers, mics, etc. Your personality and charisma need to shine through. Like the others have said, confidence is KEY!
Know what your going to say. Ask questions. Be attentive.
Also, try not to promise anything you cant deliver. There's nothing worse than promising 40 or 50 people will be at your show and it doesn't happen.
Author:  jeffsw6 [ Wed Oct 06, 2010 8:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
spotlightjr @ Wed Oct 06, 2010 7:10 pm wrote:
Also, try not to promise anything you cant deliver. There's nothing worse than promising 40 or 50 people will be at your show and it doesn't happen.

This is very important, and seems to be a mistake most newbie KJs in my area make when they take on a new gig.

I had a restaurant ask me to do karaoke at their place on Sunday afternoons this summer. I said sure, but I really don't know if you can make money on it, because your establishment is family-friendly, there will be children who want to sing Taylor Swift all day, and that will ensure that you never get a drinking crowd.

They ended up hiring another KJ who was half my price and promised the moon. They got rid of him after three weeks.

The venue's entertainment guy was pleased with my honesty, and gave me a bunch of work on better nights at a different location for the pay I requested. It's done for the summer now (outside gig) but they made money on it and have said they may do it again next summer.
Author:  Cueball [ Thu Oct 07, 2010 6:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
exweedfarmer @ Wed Oct 06, 2010 4:51 pm wrote:
If you have a great voice and they already have karaoke, come early and wow the owner with something up tempo.



I can agree with everything else you said except for this. When trying to land a gig, this should not be a selling point. Running a Karaoke show should NOT be about how well you can sing.... it's supposed to be about everyone else that participates.
Author:  RNSK [ Thu Oct 07, 2010 8:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
Thanks so much for your responses. I've taken a lot of the info here and converted it into bullet point notes for myself. Getting advice from people with experience is truly invaluable.

Just a few more questions, if it's not too bothersome.

I've asked around before, and I was told by multiple people that I didn't need a business license to KJ at a bar. I should fall under the category of performing artist, or some such (and needn't worry about music licensing if the venue pays
ASCAP fees). Should I abstain from creating a "brand" of my own, i.e. Bob's Bumpin' Karaoke or something silly like that to put on my flyers/business cards/karaoke books? I'm a somewhat paranoid individual, and I have a fear of some state regulatory commission knocking on my door, pointing to the logo on my flyer and fining me $5,000 for not having proper licensing to do so. (I live in CA).

And, are these rules different between working a standard public venue and working a private party (or even advertising in publications to do parties)?

Again, thanks cueball, jeffsw6, spotlightjr, leopard lizard, letitrip, DannyG2006, and Kevinper for your advice.
Author:  Karen K [ Thu Oct 07, 2010 8:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
cueball @ Thu Oct 07, 2010 6:11 am wrote:
exweedfarmer @ Wed Oct 06, 2010 4:51 pm wrote:
If you have a great voice and they already have karaoke, come early and wow the owner with something up tempo.



I can agree with everything else you said except for this. When trying to land a gig, this should not be a selling point. Running a Karaoke show should NOT be about how well you can sing.... it's supposed to be about everyone else that participates.


Cueball, I will dispute this but minimally - My husband and I are both singers, we could easily carry a show during a slow time between the two of us until singers start bringing slips up (not really an issue at our shows). Most venue owners appreciate that we are good singers -- we can then help newbies while they learn, provide harmony for those that want it, etc. Helps to be a good singer. As a host, though, cardinal rule is to never abuse the fact that you have the power to put yourself up at any time.
Author:  jeffsw6 [ Thu Oct 07, 2010 11:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
RNSK @ Thu Oct 07, 2010 11:31 pm wrote:
I've asked around before, and I was told by multiple people that I didn't need a business license to KJ at a bar.

If you are going to advertise and make business cards, etc. then you had better have some income and property to declare, and pay some taxes.
Author:  Lonman [ Fri Oct 08, 2010 1:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
RNSK @ Thu Oct 07, 2010 9:31 pm wrote:
I've asked around before, and I was told by multiple people that I didn't need a business license to KJ at a bar.

Don't know about anywhere else, but I YET to work at a bar that did not ask for a copy of my business license and send me a 1099 at the end of the year for tax purposes. The honest ones will need to declare that 'entertainment' money going out somehow, those that don't are probably not going to last anyway.
Author:  leopard lizard [ Fri Oct 08, 2010 2:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
You should check the regulations for your town to see if you need a business license. Many people don't think karaoke/bar singers need one and will tell you that. We kept getting told that when in fact karaoke requires a license in our area. We had to get a state business license, a license for the county where we live and a license for any county where we do a show. Add to that, some of the cities within the counties also require a city business license.

I wish the bars had the attitude that they do in Lonman's area. We have paid for all of this licensing and the bar owners don't seem to care and don't require it for hiring. We give receipts just to have some sort of documentation of income at tax time. Other "companies" just take the money and run.

At the casino or large venue level, there is yet more regulation. This isn't a license required by the karaoke company but if a venue has a certain capacity, then the venue would also have to pay an entertainment tax if the host sings. There was an actual ruling on this. If the host sings, then the host is a paid entertainer and the entertainment tax applies. If the host doesn't sing, then it is considered patrons entertaining patrons and the tax doesn't apply.

While the venue owners don't seem to care, we did have a situation where one karaoke owner got angry with an employee for splitting off on her own and turned her in for not having a business license. He had to scramble to get one himself at the same time.

If a license IS required in your area and you don't get one, you WILL feel nervous about advertising and calling attention to yourself, as you observed. Most town or county seats will have packets that tell you all of the hoops to jump through as well as include the forms. You can also usually get the info and forms on line, also.
Author:  letitrip [ Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
In the State of Wisconsin, no business license is required and your business can be run as a sole proprietorship under your own SSN if you choose. I'm sure it's different in other states based on the comments here.
Author:  exweedfarmer [ Fri Oct 08, 2010 11:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Any advice on how to get work is appreciated :)
cueball @ Thu Oct 07, 2010 6:11 am wrote:
exweedfarmer @ Wed Oct 06, 2010 4:51 pm wrote:
If you have a great voice and they already have karaoke, come early and wow the owner with something up tempo.



I can agree with everything else you said except for this. When trying to land a gig, this should not be a selling point. Running a Karaoke show should NOT be about how well you can sing.... it's supposed to be about everyone else that participates.

True, but singing gets you noticed and it gets you street cred with the crowd and the owner. In this scenario you have to show the current KJ up without "showing him up." At this point in the schmoozing no one knows that you're a KJ.

As for licensing. Yeah, unfortunately. If this is going to be a business you have to let the state try to run you out of business like everyone else. There's not much you can do about it because they have all the guns.
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