Karaoke Forums

So I was thinking ( rarely happens except when I find myself in the tiled throne room without a book.. ) about all the hubbub regarding things like the Karaoke Cloud, karaoke jukeboxes, etc....

We have had plenty of posts regarding the fact that it's the good host that makes the show, yet this point has been debated by many.

My recent thoughts:

People thought that full sound/full library DJs would take bands out of the bar equation. Much less expensive, and a MUCH larger music repertiore. Well, they have certainly over-shadowed bands on the wedding market. However, this was not only because they were less expensive, but because no one had to worry about drawing a crowd or turning a profit.

Not so in bars. Good bands are still a bigger draw than DJs. There is more action, a bigger show, and live sound. This draws a large profitable crowd.

Now, let's worry about DJs a bit, while we worry about the Karaoke Cloud or karaoke jukeboxes in venues.

If these were really a major concern, Mega-Touch internet jukeboxes should have knocked DJs right out of the bar. The internet has the largest library available, right? Nothing but a small fee instead of paying the DJ's price, right? It's a gimme- get rid of the DJ, right?

Didn't happen. A good DJ puts on a good show using his personality and mixing skills, and pressing "play" is only a part of it.

Karaoke Hosts: Shouldn't the logic follow? It's not the library, or even how it is accessed. It's not about the fee. For the venue owner, its about:

1) Profit versus cost

2) customer satisfaction ( causing those same patrons to return).

Supply some serious entertainment value for the customers, bring in serious profits.

This doesn't mean I don't believe that Venue shows run from the cloud can't sour future markets in the short run, but I'm thinking that if one gains a decent rep for supplying the above in their working area, they should be able to overcome it.

Stop worrying. If you're a skilled Karaoke Host, it's really no biggie.

Just ponderin'- could be wrong...... Next time I'll remember the book...

_________________
"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

I do believe one thing Joe that the bad economy of the last several years has impacted the entertainment end of the various venues more than any pirates have. With the improvement of the job situation we will eventually see of the normal market conditions that existed before. The reason everything hit the fan with the manus and the certified hosts is the sudden contraction of the markets and the loss of revenues they both experienced. A rising tide lifts all boats, and hopefully things will return to normal soon. Have a nice day.

Agree Joe. 100%. If I may add this though, doesn't mean many of us won't have our routines (steady gigs) be interrupted by a bar owner who found a DJ or host who will work for drinks, or wants to try an automated system. I agree with you, those DJs who keep the floor filled and the hosts that really know how to bring it will survive, but there will be bumps in the road, in the short run as you said. Inconvenient as it is/will be, we'll survive. Just my opinion of course.

_________________
KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

I guess, Rip, but only in the short term if it happens at all. Remember what I said about PROFITS vs. cost. Let's say that they are paying me $225-$250 and making 2 grand. They MAY be absolutely brain dead enough to risk 2 grand on a $125 savings, but if they do, and the venue run show doesn't match my draw- what do you think they will do?

The only internet karaoke site that will be successful will be one that operates like Amazon or iTunes, is directed toward the professional Karaoke Host, -and in that regard-can also add a tiny U.S. based hosting useage licensing text with each track. Anything else is short term.

_________________
"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

You have to look at karaoke in the bigger picture as well. There are plenty of smaller bars around my town that have karaoke and I guarantee they don't profit on MOST karaoke nights after paying the KJ, BUT the shows bring in a bunch of patrons that normally wouldn't be there and will often then frequent the bar on non-karaoke nights.

I know my bar does pretty well on my karaoke nights, but what I'm most proud of is that on any given NFL game, big college game, etc. when I'm not there, at least 1/2 of the bar is my regulars that I introduced to the bar.

That sort of impact is hard to calculate, but is a much bigger impact on the bottom line than any given karaoke night.

_________________
C Mc
KJ, FL

Nail on the head.....

I have taken to interviewing the bar owner and bar staff as a part of my pitch. Well, "interview" is the wrong word. I get to know them and try to figure out what kind of people they are.

Why?

Because I want to find out if it is the kind of place that I would go to if there was no karaoke or other entertainment at all. I want to know if people feel comfortable there just having a beer and some nachos watching a game. is the service good. Are the staff friendly. Do they make me feel at home.

If all of that falls into place, my karaoke nights have a much higher chance of being successful. I also feel better about promoting the activities the bar has when I am not there with a karaoke gig. Like TopherM said, I believe I have helped introduce people to bars they have never been to and now check out on Trivia Night, or Taco Eating Contest night, or a plain old Tuesday with nothing but a Happy Hour Beer prices.

If I can sell karaoke to the bar by selling them on the concept that sales on other nights may also go up a few percentage points, then it is a bigger win for everyone.

This has absolutely worked for my downtown Seattle Gig.

-Chris

_________________
-Chris

Great posts by Topher and Chris for two reasons:

1) Bringing up the additional non-karaoke night business that we bring in, both through a good show and our own internet and other advertising. The owners tend to forget that part of the equation, and should be reminded in any business discussion/negotiation/sales pitch.

2) a major factor of a successful show is making sure that the venue is compatible to your work. Not only the place itself, but the crowd that normally goes there. Yup, we can bring in a different crowd, but fighting an uphill battle is always tougher.

As for the venue, I have a perfect example: Unfortunately this is the only venue that anyone from the forum- in this case Cuey- has visited.

This particular venue- unbeknownst to me because I didn't dig deep enough ( no one's fault but my own.- was on it's last legs. It looked nice enough, and the owners were friendly, and seemed upscale enough for my style of hosting.

However, this was a white tablecloth place, and as we got started they seemed seemed embarrassed by having karaoke. At one point they noted one of my ads in the local night life mag listing my venues and requested me not to repeat it. They wanted ( needed) the income from karaoke, but they wanted it kept a secret. HUH?

Then I started getting complaints from my singers about the staff's attitude toward them and they rapidly dwindled.

Needless to say, this was one of only 3 failed shows that I've had over the decades. Of the three, all failed not because of the show, but my lack of forethought- still my fault:

1) The one above was due to to lack of research on my part.

2)This was in the very beginning My massive ego ( since humbled greatly by knowledge and experience) at the time led me to believe I could bring my regulars from other venues WAY too far out of my normal work area. Didn't happen- too much distance.

Shouldn't have been a problem right? Just build a new show from regulars who would then tell their friend, and so on...! Um, no. The venue was by itself on a road to nowhere, and the venue owner vastly over-stated the amount of regular customers. There were Zero. Nothing to work with, and the owner couldn't afford any advertising. My fault for being gullible.

3) A favor for a friend, and I KNEW it wouldn't stick. He pretty much begged me to work his place. Problem: It simply wasn't big enough. I packed the place, but it couldn't hold enough people to make it profitable. I warned him, but did it anyway to shut him up- still my fault.

Venue research is a necessity. Great as we are, if the venue sucks, it ain't gonna work.

_________________
"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

very good point here Joe, the distance people are willing to travel has gotten much chorter with DUI laws etc, what was a following of 25 next week is 22, then 20 then 17 until you are left with the bars original people......of course less the ones who did not like the newcomers and left. a big reason many places go through hosts like Deep Purple goes through musicians, "how big is your following" and the cycle repeats itself, it is usually unsustainable. Building a show from the inside out in a venue is a great way to make it sustainable. get them having a good time, come in a bit earlier (maybe one drink earlier) and stay a bit later (maybe one drink later) and come an extra day for a drink on another karaoke night, bring a buddy that mentioned at work they like to sing........and on it goes.

_________________
Paradigm Karaoke, The New Standard.......Shift Happens

I know of a bowling alley bar in Kansas that has the pay CAVS JB whatever system. It is a junk, POS sound system that is run by the bartenders (volume only, if I remember correctly). Nobody goes in that bar, not even "regulars". The singers are turned off by the sound quality and the rest are turned off by karaoke anytime. And that is my point....

Karaoke should be at designated times, not whenever someone is there and wants to put a dollar in the machine. My main show has always been a juggling act. Don't usually get a ton of singers early, and constantly rotating 3-5 singers through, over and over, for the first hour or two until it picks up is usually a no-no. Once the regulars feel as if they've had enough of karaoke (and this is a short fuse), they're out the door.

Determining when their fuse is nearing the end is a complex equation that considers the number of singers, the quality of the singers, the attitude and age of the regulars, among other factors.

I am convinced that karaoke anytime does not or will not work in the vast majority of bars. There's many other factors, and this isn't even the biggest one, but it is an important one that cannot be overlooked.

_________________
I'm not a cheerleader, but I paid for my pom poms with my own money!

I have been to a few karaoke places where people come in just to listen and be entertained. They never sing, but they like to hear others. They can't do that without scheduled karaoke times.

-Chris

_________________
-Chris

I have quite a few people that come to my show and thats all they do listen and watch others. Works out good they buy drinks have a good time and the singers have a larger audience. But your right they need scheduled karaoke times.

I have many that come in to do the same.

_________________
LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

My listeners sometimes out numbered my singers 3-1. Several come to my house or other's basements. Some even sing there where they wouldn't in the bar.