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Would you ever turn down a job...
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Author:  Alan B [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 9:46 am ]
Post subject:  Would you ever turn down a job...
...if the place wasn't up to your standards? For example; if the venue did not have enough space for you to properly set up your equipment, speakers, etc. If the area you had to work in was going to be very cramped or maybe be stuck in a corner, would that matter to you or would you turn down the job because you felt their setup wouldn't work you, and do your sound and reputation any justice.
Author:  Cueball [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 10:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
Basically, from what you describe, I wouldn't even give my business card to the place if I felt any of those things. As for giving up a job (as vs turning one down), I did that once. I was in a place where I didn't not feel comfortable around the crowd that was there. They weren't rowdy, but they were loud. It definitely affected how my show was being run. Halfway through the evening, I asked a visiting KJ/Friend if he wanted to take the show from me after that night. I told him that I just didn't like the vibe I was getting. He told me to give it another week or two, but I insisted that once my gut feeling felt something was wrong, I wasn't going to fight it. At the end of the show, as I was packing up, I introduced that KJ to the person who hired me. I made up an excuse that something came up in my schedule, where I just could not continue that particular show, and I then suggested that if they were interested in keeping the show going, they could interview this KJ and see if things would be agreeable to them.
Author:  DannyG2006 [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 10:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
The only jobs I have turned down were ones that didn't meet my price.
Author:  mrmarog [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 12:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
I have turned down several jobs because I didn't think that my core group would find it to their liking. Sounds snobbish but I too like a nice place with plenty of set-up space and a dance floor. Without those things I would turn it down. The capacity has to be 100 plus also, because when the snowbirds arrive 150 seats wouldn't be enough.
Author:  kjathena [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 12:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
Yes, if I do not believe that a show is viable due to location, parking, seating capacity, beer and wine only (with no food) lack of cleanliness ect I can and have turned down the gig.
Author:  chrisavis [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 2:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
Yes. I have declined offers and I have walked away from regular weekly gigs. It takes a lot for me to do it, but I have.
Author:  Smoothedge69 [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 7:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
kjathena wrote:
Yes, if I do not believe that a show is viable due to location, parking, seating capacity, beer and wine only (with no food) lack of cleanliness ect I can and have turned down the gig.

What do you have against Beer/wine places?? My best place is a Beer/Wine. The crowd is awesome, and very into it. I got really good singers, great owners, and an awesome atmosphere.

As for turning down a show? Yes I turned down one, so far. They only wanted to pay me $75, and the owner admitted that she didn't pay her PROs. I said, "sorry, can't do it.".
Author:  Earl [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
I recently turned down a probable long-term contract, but not because of any venue shortcomings. My reason was simple... I don't want any more jobs. It would have meant three nights in a row in three different venues, and I did not look forward to moving all that equipment three nights straight. I've become too accustomed to having at least a full day off between gigs.
Author:  Brian A [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
mrmarog wrote:
I have turned down several jobs because I didn't think that my core group would find it to their liking. Sounds snobbish but I too like a nice place with plenty of set-up space and a dance floor. Without those things I would turn it down. The capacity has to be 100 plus also, because when the snowbirds arrive 150 seats wouldn't be enough.

Same here, mrmarog. Pizza place & bowling alleys. I sub for a friend in a bowling alley lounge once. Never again. Tournament in progress, lots of kids in the lounge. It’s nothing personal against kids but we all know they can get rambunctious at times & when karaoke is added into the equation, large crowd, long rotation (what rotation? there's none. Kids tend to sing together as a group), dealing with parents; call me picky but I like to kj in a place where I can keep my stress level to a minimum. :)
Author:  Lonman [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 9:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
Smoothedge69 wrote:
kjathena wrote:
Yes, if I do not believe that a show is viable due to location, parking, seating capacity, beer and wine only (with no food) lack of cleanliness ect I can and have turned down the gig.

What do you have against Beer/wine places?? My best place is a Beer/Wine. The crowd is awesome, and very into it. I got really good singers, great owners, and an awesome atmosphere.
Only problem I usually have had in the past (at least taverns around here) the places are too small to make an real money to make the karaoke worth it - unless the kj is playing for peanuts to begin with - then it could be quite successful for the tavern. The few I've worked for in the past were small - busy, packed all the time, but packed for them was like 20 people and even though they stated that they were making more money than they ever had, they still couldn't afford our prices (I was with another company at the time). Buying a pitcher here & there didn't pay for the overhead, employees and entertainment.
Bars are generally bigger, serve food & have a bigger budget to actually pay their kj a fair wage.
Author:  Smoothedge69 [ Sun Aug 03, 2014 10:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
Lonman wrote:
Smoothedge69 wrote:
kjathena wrote:
Yes, if I do not believe that a show is viable due to location, parking, seating capacity, beer and wine only (with no food) lack of cleanliness ect I can and have turned down the gig.

What do you have against Beer/wine places?? My best place is a Beer/Wine. The crowd is awesome, and very into it. I got really good singers, great owners, and an awesome atmosphere.
Only problem I usually have had in the past (at least taverns around here) the places are too small to make an real money to make the karaoke worth it - unless the kj is playing for peanuts to begin with - then it could be quite successful for the tavern. The few I've worked for in the past were small - busy, packed all the time, but packed for them was like 20 people and even though they stated that they were making more money than they ever had, they still couldn't afford our prices (I was with another company at the time). Buying a pitcher here & there didn't pay for the overhead, employees and entertainment.
Bars are generally bigger, serve food & have a bigger budget to actually pay their kj a fair wage.

The one place I turned down a B/W, but it was huge. Around here they come in all shapes and sizes. My Friday place is small, but not tiny. For the size of it we get a good crowd, and they DRINK!! So far it's been a very good, fun gig. Only had one bad week in the past three months, and the funny part was EVERY place in town was dead. It was like the whole town stayed home. It's weird around here.
Author:  JoeChartreuse [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 12:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
Alan B wrote:
...if the place wasn't up to your standards? For example; if the venue did not have enough space for you to properly set up your equipment, speakers, etc. If the area you had to work in was going to be very cramped or maybe be stuck in a corner, would that matter to you or would you turn down the job because you felt their setup wouldn't work you, and do your sound and reputation any justice.


Easy answer. I have worked many places over the decades, with multi-year shows in virtually all of the.

Yup, I'm awesome :-) - but that's not the whole story. The key is knowing how to pick venues in which I fit best. I can't tell you how many venues I have turned down for being incompatible or "not up to standard ". Kind of tough to build a rep working venues in wbich failure is a strong possibility
Author:  mrmarog [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
Brian A wrote:
mrmarog wrote:
I have turned down several jobs because I didn't think that my core group would find it to their liking. Sounds snobbish but I too like a nice place with plenty of set-up space and a dance floor. Without those things I would turn it down. The capacity has to be 100 plus also, because when the snowbirds arrive 150 seats wouldn't be enough.

Same here, mrmarog. Pizza place & bowling alleys. I sub for a friend in a bowling alley lounge once. Never again. Tournament in progress, lots of kids in the lounge. It’s nothing personal against kids but we all know they can get rambunctious at times & when karaoke is added into the equation, large crowd, long rotation (what rotation? there's none. Kids tend to sing together as a group), dealing with parents; call me picky but I like to kj in a place where I can keep my stress level to a minimum. :)
Brian, If I could have given you 5 "likes" if would have. Stress reduction is extremely high on my list of things to accomplish. Finding a venue with a good owner is hard to come by as well. Pay has never been an issue since I have my price and that is that..... no negotiating. Now if they want to pay me more.... :D
Author:  The Lone Ranger [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
8) Several good posts on this subject. Would I turn down a job, yes, have I turned down jobs yes. A lot of it has to go to what has been mentioned gut feeling, size of venue and it's quality. Money has always been of a secondary concern to me. Karaoke is an art form and sometimes an artist isn't that concerned about the money. Many times I have donated my services to worthy causes, such as disabled veterans. If I wasn't right for a job I always had a list of hosts that I could recommend. I never lacked work, it just got to be too much I'm pushing 70 to pull down and setup six times a week. That is what you have to do if you are a mobile KJ/DJ in Southern California. I just did a gig for a friend who was ill a couple of days ago, I got through it but it is not something I want to do on a regular basis anymore.
Author:  Bazza [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 7:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
I haven't, but I would if need be.

For example, if it were a rowdy bar where people abused the equipment (dropped mics constantly, screamed for fun, etc) or got in a lot of fights, I'd turn that down.

Lone Ranger wrote:
Karaoke is an art form and sometimes an artist isn't that concerned about the money.


I gotta disagree with you here. If Karaoke is an "art form" then so are darts, pool and beer pong. :lol:

Entertainment? Absolutely. Art form?! Not so much.
Author:  The Lone Ranger [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 7:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
Bazza wrote:
I haven't, but I would if need be.

For example, if it were a rowdy bar where people abused the equipment (dropped mics constantly, screamed for fun, etc) or got in a lot of fights, I'd turn that down.

Lone Ranger wrote:
Karaoke is an art form and sometimes an artist isn't that concerned about the money.


I gotta disagree with you here. If Karaoke is an "art form" then so are darts, pool and beer pong. :lol:

Entertainment? Absolutely. Art form?! Not so much.


8) Don't tell the divas that. :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
Author:  Smoothedge69 [ Mon Aug 04, 2014 7:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
Bazza wrote:
I haven't, but I would if need be.

For example, if it were a rowdy bar where people abused the equipment (dropped mics constantly, screamed for fun, etc) or got in a lot of fights, I'd turn that down.





I would work with those people and try to fix that problem, OR change the clientele.
Author:  kjathena [ Tue Aug 05, 2014 12:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
Smoothedge69 wrote:
kjathena wrote:
Yes, if I do not believe that a show is viable due to location, parking, seating capacity, beer and wine only (with no food) lack of cleanliness ect I can and have turned down the gig.

What do you have against Beer/wine places?? My best place is a Beer/Wine. The crowd is awesome, and very into it. I got really good singers, great owners, and an awesome atmosphere.

As for turning down a show? Yes I turned down one, so far. They only wanted to pay me $75, and the owner admitted that she didn't pay her PROs. I said, "sorry, can't do it.".


I have nothing against beer and wine places per se...the thing is I understand business, a venue has to clear an absolute minimum of 5 times my rate in order to break even in most situations(in my area). A beer and wine venue (without food) stands a lesser chance of being able to do that on a regular basis do to the low cost of the drinks, and average seating of 45 or less. For a show to be successful and long term the venue needs to pull an average of 7-8 times my rate. Why even start a show that has little chance of succeeding ?

On the Bowling center issue My longest continuous venue is the lounge in a bowling center 2 nights a week for over 15 years...been thru 4 sets of owners. No kids after 10 pm so at most 1 hour of them and they MUST have parents with them even in that 1st hour.

I happen to like family shows (wee ones to great grands)but have difficulty finding appropriate venues most of the time.
Author:  chrisavis [ Tue Aug 05, 2014 5:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Would you ever turn down a job...
kjathena wrote:
Why even start a show that has little chance of succeeding ?


I like a challenge. If I can turn a bar around, that is great for the resume. I have done this at two different bars and it has been very helpful in getting new business. Nothing better than getting a bar owner to write a letter saying you have increased nightly takes by 25%. Very hard for another bar to shrug that off.
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