Karaoke Forums

They hadn't sold their catalag.

I really hesitate to bring up the subject, but it has been weighing very heavily on my mind.

Was their situation really desperate enough that if they hadn't sold their catalog they would have had to fold/declare bankruptcy?

Cause it seems to me that every single one of their current difficulties, wouldn't be so dire if they hadn't

First of all, they wouldn't have to sue for trademark infringement, they could stick with copyright and had virtually an open and shut case

Second, they could have leased their catalog to KSF like Stingray does now, thus creating a stream of income

Third, they wouldn't have had as many problems with a third party maintaining a custom disc site

Next, the GEM series would have been considerably less to make/license and maybe they would have been able to release even more of their catalog that way.

Finally it wouldn't put people in the position of violating Stingray's rights thru the HELP program. If they owned the copyrights to the music, the HELP licecense would be 100% bulletproof and the best option in the industry *although to be fair, i can't speculate on wether this program would exist if they had kept everything*

In my opinion, selling their catalog was the single biggest mistake they ever made, but it makes me wonder if they really didn't have any choice

-James

Stop the presses! Stingray's catalog is available from KSF?

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Never the same show twice!

Yes, overseas. To the best of my knowledge KSF owns customburn.com which is based in the UK.

Unfortunately, the site is blocked to US & Canada but i bought quite a few Karaoke Channel tracks and custom discs from them before the rules changed.

-James

1) where are you getting this information? can you provide links?
2) The Gem set is the cheapest set to buy on the market 70 cents a track compared to 3.00/track from others. Why do you assume the Gem set is expensive to professional KJ's.

You "license," a.k.a. lease the GEM set for $0.70 a track. You don't own it. You can't sell it.

For closer to $2 a track, you own it, and have the rights to sell it.

You aren't comparing apples to apples there.

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C Mc
KJ, FL

You can sell your license. In fact, if you want to sell your license, we will help you find someone to buy it. You have to complete some paperwork, as does the purchaser, but that costs nothing. The only restrictions are (a) that if you still have time payments left, you have to pay it off, and (b) the purchaser has to be eligible to be licensed.

Which information? If you mean about KSF here is a reciept of mine

"Thank you for your order!

Order details


Payment method: PayPal
Order status: Paid

Items ordered (vat 0%): 13.33 GBP
Delivery costs (vat 0%): 4.17 GBP
VAT (20 %): 3.50 GBP
Grand total (inc. vat): 21.00 GBP

Status history:

: Order received
: Paid
OOP Soundchoice Replaceme (cdg)

items: 8 Price
(vat 0%) vat % vat
amount Price
(inc. vat)
SR10804: Cinnamon Girl - Neil Young ~1.67 GBP 20.00% ~0.33 GBP 2.00 GBP
SR10302: I'm A Lonely Jew - South Park ~1.67 GBP 20.00% ~0.33 GBP 2.00 GBP
SR12843: Rockin' In The Free World - Neil Young ~1.67 GBP 20.00% ~0.33 GBP 2.00 GBP
ZM05071: Cold Hard (@$%&#!) - Jet ~1.67 GBP 20.00% ~0.33 GBP 2.00 GBP
SR11231: Only The Young - Journey ~1.67 GBP 20.00% ~0.33 GBP 2.00 GBP
SR11536: Time To Change - The Brady Bunch ~1.67 GBP 20.00% ~0.33 GBP 2.00 GBP
SR11535: It's A Sunshine Day - The Brady Bunch ~1.67 GBP 20.00% ~0.33 GBP 2.00 GBP
SR11537: Keep On - The Brady Bunch ~1.67 GBP 20.00% ~0.33 GBP 2.00 GBP
Total 13.33 GBP 2.67 GBP 16.00 GBP
Best regards,
CustomBurn
KSF Entertainment UK LTD
34 Boulevard
Weston-Super-Mare
North Somerset
BS23 1NF
United Kingdom

https://www.customburn.com
sales@customburn.com"

All Karaoke Channel tracks except for the one by zoom and at the bottom it mentions customburn and KSF


If you meant regarding HELP all the references can be found on this site.
HELP can only grant you rights that it owns. This is easily verified by reading the HELP license agreement.



Every time a music recording is licensed and made, that music is considered a new work and contains 'Master Rights' which Soundchoice sold to Stingray who owns karaoke channel. They now own the master rights to the majority of songs Soundchoice made prior to 2007.

When the HELP program first came out, i asked if Stingray was a participant and Mr. Harrington told me they were not.

Until this changes, PEP cannnot gauruntee, with 100% certainty that Stingray wpm't sue anyone who obtains the full library or uses multiple copies of the discs that they own.

Now given Stingray's proven disinterest in the professional market *All their tracks are labeled for Home use only" the likelyhood that anyone would be sued is remote to practically non existent, but it does exist.

2. That wasn't my point at all, my point was that when Soundchoice first started out to make the GEM series, they started with a list of 10,000 of their most popular songs. They narrowed this list down to 6,000 based on what it would cost, and what they could get licensing for.

My point was, if they still had own the catalog they would not have had to pay royalties to stingray to use the musical works, and with that extra money they might have been able to license more of those 10,000 songs that they started with. It had absolutely nothing to do with the end user

hope that clairifies things for you

Stingray, a company located in Quebec Canada provides 16000+tracks available for commercial use through their Licensing website.
http://licensing.stingray.com/music-lic ... +Licensing

Stingray provides top quality tracks with "The Karaoke Channel" label and made available to home users through their Karaoke Channel App.

STINGRAY Does not provide licensing to individual KJ's for use of their tracks.

SOUNDCHOICE is a different company with Red Label Tracks containing SC Trademarks.
STINGRAY is a different company providing "Karaoke Channel" Trademark and HD quality Videos.

Contact them for more info:
Stingray Digital Group Inc.
730 Wellington, Montreal,
Quebec, Canada H3C 1T4

support@stingray.com

On another note, I contacted KSF a few months back and their answer to me was that their Overseas site and products are different and not made available to North America Due to Licensing restrictions.

I requested to purchase their Software / Subscription and was denied.

You obviously didn't read my post or you simply don't understand. The majority of Stingray's catalog was bought from soundchoice and rebranded.

That means that the MUSIC RECORDINGS for 90% of soundchoice tracks belong to STINGRAY not soundchoice.

As far as stingray is concerned, it does not matter if they are branded with the soundchoice mark, the music still belongs to them, therefore if you make copies of it, you are committing copyright infringement.

SoundChoice is SoundChoice.
Stingray is Stingray.

That's it done deal, why are we having this conversation?

Your original question is "Would SC have folded if.

Simple answer. YES if people keep pirating their music then yes.

It's not like any hypotheticals are going to be looked at by P.E.P. as a learning lesson. They're still run by the same people and I can see their new venture folding just as quickly. Compared to their foreign counterparts, their business model is completely ridiculous. Aside from the obvious lack of downloads, their web site is completely static. They've never had any kind of automation. They're so behind the curve, they forgot what a curve even looks like.

Yes, Sound Choice was once the best producer of karaoke tracks on the planet, but sadly it was, and still is, the only thing they were good at. Their inability to put together a business model that fits the modern world, and their complete lack of foresight when it comes to downloads and automation has put them in a position that is once again doomed to fail. They should stick with what they're good at and just license their audio tracks to some other company that is up to date with the modern world.

Because you asked. But whatever, I don't have the energy to argue with someone who is too obtuse to listen. So let's just agree to disagree and move on.


Your probably right that they would have folded as much as i wish it wasn't so.

But you two both speak Canadian "Eh". You should have a love in and put this behind you. That is what our democratic leaders believe we Americans should do

I hear a tune playing in my head ......Everything Is Beautiful.

Actually, Jim has said if a SC inspector were to happen upon a KJ who is using Stingray songs, one of two things would happen. A.) you would be reported to Stingray, and they would have the option of filing suit against you, OR B.) P.E.P would file a case against you, on behalf of Stingray!! Now, according to Jim, they have NEVER come across a KJ using a large amount of Stingray tunes.

Jim, is that nonsense still going on??

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

What's the difference between a Stingray track and a Sound Choice track??? Or is it just that the Stingray tracks are from their Karaoke Channel with a very specific clause that says "FOR HOME USE ONLY."? Did Stingray put out anything above and beyond what Sound Choice produced?

Actually there was a suit locally that used to advertise using Stingray tracks and buying the songs on demand - after the suit, they no longer used Stingray tracks & had a GEM set for a little while, but the club seems to no longer have karaoke as far as I know. I don't know if that was part of the case or just a coincidence, but the fact they no longer offered Stingray tracks seems odd.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

I believe they did, they at least had some Lady Gaga that I know SC never released.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

I was just on their site. They now have Karaoke videos. Definitely stuff after 2009.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

The difference is that Stingray tracks are Hi Def with Video background. They also provide Home users with a Free Player and subscription options. They are by far the best tracks I've ever heard.

I've been contacting the head office many time to get licensing but only keep getting denied.

I won't stop trying, I think maybe if quite a few KJ's contact them for KJ licensing them may put something in place.

That was probably part of the deal with SC, so that Stingray would not overtake them in the market. AND it would allow SC to sue for another reason!! The company you seem to love so much is pretty sleazy, at best.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE