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MtnKaraoke
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 Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2015 10:03 am |
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Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2010 1:40 pm
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The fact is that Smooth challenged Harrington.
It most certainly was not a bully move.
It was an adequate and appropriate response.
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Smoothedge69
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Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2015 5:37 pm |
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Ok, now, can we get the F&*K off it, already?? Geeze some of you are ridiculous!!!
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Elementary Penguin
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 1:04 am |
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Alan B wrote: With that said, can you run a successful show without SC? Artistically successful? No. That's the viewpoint from the old-school, die-hard, singers' perspective. Unfortunately that's getting to be a rare breed. Commercially successful? Absolutely, yes -- no SC or any other specific brand required. My customers have gotten younger and younger. Most of them have never seen a CDG, much less a laser disc. They not only don't distinguish between brands, they don't even understand the very concept of separate karaoke manufacturers and brands when I try to explain it to them. That there are multiple versions of many songs in my book confuses the daylights out of them, and when I explain it to those who ask I just get a glassy-eyed stare, and then they repeat the question. They sing in groups (loudly and badly) and couldn't care less what version it was or how good or bad it was. The only thing that matters is having the one song they want to sing then and there, not whether it's MM or SC. And heaven forbid you don't have that song, especially after they've done it at a different bar or (worse yet) seen it on YouTube. They all think tracks are "free" and every place should have them "all". A surprising number of them think I work for free too, which is hilarious when you think about it. It's not as bad when the crowd is older, but the contemporary urban hipsters which comprise most of the audience couldn't care less about the quality of my library, where I got it, or how much I paid for it. That's rather depressing.
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Smoothedge69
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 1:13 am |
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I used to be picky about the brands I used to sing from. Obviously, I always went with SC, as it became available. That was between 20 and 3 years ago. I didn't know any other decent brands beside SC, DK and Pioneer. I didn't sing much off CB, because I am not a Country singer. When I started doing my shows, I found the UK brands. I found that they were even BETTER than SC, at least in opinion. Now I do not particularly care for the quality of SC. I find Zoom make MUCH better renditions, PLUS the sound quality is cleaner and more crisp. SBI runs a close second for Rock, in my world. I use SBI, almost exclusively for my Country singers, and they couldn't be happier. Many of them are people who are used to singing off SC and CB.
All that being said, I have found that I do not have to stick with the old brands. I can sing off the newer brands just as easily, and just as comfortably. And I am looking forward to singing off the new Party Tyme songs!! In my life, SC has become irrelevant. And CB never mattered, except for the Dave Matthews disk I bought for my own use. I only bought THAT one because it is the only one I could find.
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leopard lizard
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 8:52 am |
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Depending on the age of the singers, I've experienced the same as Elementary Penguin--younger mob puke and scream crowds don't notice the brand differences, they just want the song. Older "traditional" karaoke singers notice the quality.
The ones who are really into music in general will notice if the guitars aren't correct. This especially goes for 90s rock types or Blues fans. Other things people will notice is if the song has been shortened (Zoom does this sometimes). I've had a few people thrown off when they know the song and expect to go into the chorus and instead the next verse starts.
People will get used to SC giving a starting tone and countdowns and get caught off guard by brands that don't do that. Another thing that SC does well, (with a few very notable exceptions) is the words light up right when they should be sung. I didn't really notice this at first as by the time I had practiced a song, I knew the words and would just glance at the screen for reminders. But if you take someone like Patsy Cline or Willie Nelson or even a Reggae song where the phrasing can be rather unique, you can get close to their style by following the light ups on an SC version. Most people aren't going to concentrate like that "live" but it is helpful in learning a song and understanding that you don't necessarily sing each note right on the beat.
SC just seems to have made their songs to make it easy on the singer. The little details may not make or break a show but the more experienced singers do seem to notice and appreciate them.
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Elementary Penguin
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 4:39 pm |
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leopard lizard wrote: younger mob puke and scream crowds I almost put it that way  leopard lizard wrote: Older "traditional" karaoke singers notice the quality. That's one of the reasons I still go after the best possible version of any song -- when traditional singers pass through I want to retain them, and turn them into regulars. Another reason is that I don't want the non-singing customers hearing crap music lest it drive them out (they're more inclined to forgive "bad" singing than bad sound). And finally the selfish reason: I have to listen to this stuff! Over and over and over... leopard lizard wrote: Another thing that SC does well, (with a few very notable exceptions) is the words light up right when they should be sung. They were always good about that, as are Zoom and Recisio today. But I'm of two minds here. I've watched so many singers struggle to keep up with the words, especially the more inebriated ones, having the swipes just a hair too early isn't always a bad thing, at least not with the high tempo songs.
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Lonman
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 4:42 pm |
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Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 3:57 pm
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Elementary Penguin wrote: But I'm of two minds here. I've watched so many singers struggle to keep up with the words, especially the more inebriated ones, having the swipes just a hair too early isn't always a bad thing, at least not with the high tempo songs. That's where sync adjust on some hosting programs work out nicely. Just push the graphics to slightly ahead of where they are supposed to be sung. _________________ LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!
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Smoothedge69
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 4:57 pm |
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leopard lizard wrote: Depending on the age of the singers, I've experienced the same as Elementary Penguin--younger mob puke and scream crowds don't notice the brand differences, they just want the song. Older "traditional" karaoke singers notice the quality.
I don't like the way you are classifying these people. Regardless of age and what they do, they are STILL patrons, to be treated with respect!! I hate the way some KJs act snobbish, like they are better than everyone else. The way I see young singers put down, REGULARLY, really annoys me. My younger singers are just as enthusiastic as I was, when I started singing Karaoke. Many of them are awesome singers, too. And weren't we ALL young, at one point?? Not to mention, that when WE were young, there was hardly anything really available out there. Nobody gave a crap about brands back then. There was hardly any SC back then. It was mostly DK and Pioneer laser disks.
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Lonman
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:14 pm |
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Smoothedge69 wrote: Nobody gave a crap about brands back then. There was hardly any SC back then. It was mostly DK and Pioneer laser disks. Actually that is where brand preference started in the late 80's early 90's with Pioneer with the cheesy videos but spot on music or DK with no videos and often in lower keys (because they felt it would better the experience for those who couldn't hit the higher notes). I didn't like DK one bit when I started singing and went to shows that had Pioneer. But back then it was also one or the other - you never seen both brands at one show. When Sound Choice, Music Maestro, BMB/Nikkodo, Standing Ovation, Backstage, All Hits, etc all started coming on the scene, now shows offered more choices in selection, thing is the quality very much showed from one brand to another & SC usually stayed consistantly upper shelf while the others were hit and miss or just plain bad and unsingable. I actually believe Music Maestro got into cdg before SC if I recall, I started buying their stuff in 92, but was never impressed. Then SC hit the market in around 94 and they just exploded. _________________ LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!
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leopard lizard
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:39 pm |
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Smooth, I call them the scream and puke crowd because there is a certain segment of young singers who are just that. Not ALL but I am referring to a certain type that I sometimes see. They are the ones who also swing the mics by the cord, swing the mics stands themselves, destroy any blow up guitars the first night out going Pete Townsend all over them. They have also broken the bar's ceramic toilets, punched holes in the doors and walls and yes--I get to dodge the puke puddles while loading outside--or oops, I interrupt someone peeing on my car tire like a dog. It is not the normal crowd but when they come out, it is a job to keep order. I can deal better if it is all them one night than if it is a combo of them and traditional karaoke singers.
The good things about these crowds are they don't care about rotation order or how many turns. They don't care if anyone else joins them on stage, in fact if the whole bar comes up that is fine. They have an enthusiastic energy. But they aren't out for quality singing, they are out for fun that gets a bit too rowdy sometimes. They also tend to order drafts and then sneak the hard stuff out in their cars. I have seen bar owners get excited by the numbers at first and then have second thoughts when the destruction and police calls start to add up.
Scream and Puke doesn't describe all young singers. I have plenty who love music and are respectful and can sing any era and will blend with the more traditional crowd. But I stand by my term for a certain type that is just out for a mob type experience and are oblivious to certain other factors.
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Paradigm Karaoke
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:10 pm |
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Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2010 6:24 pm
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leopard lizard wrote: Smooth, I call them the scream and puke crowd because there is a certain segment of young singers who are just that. Not ALL but I am referring to a certain type that I sometimes see. They are the ones who also swing the mics by the cord, swing the mics stands themselves, destroy any blow up guitars the first night out going Pete Townsend all over them. They have also broken the bar's ceramic toilets, punched holes in the doors and walls and yes--I get to dodge the puke puddles while loading outside--or oops, I interrupt someone peeing on my car tire like a dog. It is not the normal crowd but when they come out, it is a job to keep order. I can deal better if it is all them one night than if it is a combo of them and traditional karaoke singers.
The good things about these crowds are they don't care about rotation order or how many turns. They don't care if anyone else joins them on stage, in fact if the whole bar comes up that is fine. They have an enthusiastic energy. But they aren't out for quality singing, they are out for fun that gets a bit too rowdy sometimes. They also tend to order drafts and then sneak the hard stuff out in their cars. I have seen bar owners get excited by the numbers at first and then have second thoughts when the destruction and police calls start to add up.
wow, i must be the luckiest SOB to have almost 10 years and never coming across this in sports bars, british pubs or irish bars. where does this crap happen?
Scream and Puke doesn't describe all young singers. I have plenty who love music and are respectful and can sing any era and will blend with the more traditional crowd. But I stand by my term for a certain type that is just out for a mob type experience and are oblivious to certain other factors.
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Alan B
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:15 pm |
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leopard lizard wrote: Scream and Puke doesn't describe all young singers. I have plenty who love music and are respectful and can sing any era and will blend with the more traditional crowd. But I stand by my term for a certain type that is just out for a mob type experience and are oblivious to certain other factors. I have a mix of young and old singers. So far, the young ones have shown respect and have not been a problem. With that said, if I was in your situation, there is no way I would tolerate that behavior. In fact, I wouldn't even work for a bar where I had to deal with these punks on a regular basis. I have standards and one of them would be not catering to this kind of crowd. Yes Smooth, we all were young once, but my friends and I never showed any disrespect like the kids of today. We went out and had fun but weren't destructive and didn't cause any problems or harm. This is a new generation that just doesn't give a sh*t.
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Smoothedge69
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:28 pm |
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Well, I don't get those kinds of people. We have all good people at my shows. Maybe it's the area. There is no destruction. I had one guy try to swing a mic, ONCE. He never did it again.
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Alan B
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:51 pm |
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Smoothedge69 wrote: I don't like the way you are classifying these people. Regardless of age and what they do, they are STILL patrons, to be treated with respect!! Seriously?? Are you still going to respect them when they damage your equipment?? Smoothedge69 wrote: I hate the way some KJs act snobbish, like they are better than everyone else. The way I see young singers put down, REGULARLY, really annoys me. How can you respect them if they show no respect for you, or your equipment or the other patrons? Smoothedge69 wrote: And weren't we ALL young, at one point?? Yes we were but we didn't act like spoiled little brats who think they can do anything they want, like the kids of today.
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leopard lizard
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:58 pm |
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There used to be a lot of different experiences on here. There was a fellow who catered to the 21 year olds as he felt they were under served, music wise, at most shows. He mentioned that he laminated his song books so he could hose them off in the back yard after the shows.
There was a fellow who played a few dance songs at the top of each round as his particular crowd loved doing it that way.
Then there was Toqer.
There also used to be a lot more females, which jives with who I see running shows in my area.
Now there seems to be a morality as far as how you run your shows. I think it may discourage others from posting.
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Smoothedge69
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Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 7:25 pm |
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Alan B wrote: Smoothedge69 wrote: I don't like the way you are classifying these people. Regardless of age and what they do, they are STILL patrons, to be treated with respect!! Seriously?? Are you still going to respect them when they damage your equipment?? Smoothedge69 wrote: I hate the way some KJs act snobbish, like they are better than everyone else. The way I see young singers put down, REGULARLY, really annoys me. How can you respect them if they show no respect for you, or your equipment or the other patrons? Smoothedge69 wrote: And weren't we ALL young, at one point?? Yes we were but we didn't act like spoiled little brats who think they can do anything they want, like the kids of today. I haven't had those kinds of problems at my shows. The young ones at my shows are very respectful. If not they don't come back.
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