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kjathena
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 Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 10:32 am |
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we have ALWAYS given discounts for multiple nights at the same venue IF we can leave a permanent system - computer installed
Blessings
Athena
_________________
"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey
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BruceFan4Life
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Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 12:21 pm |
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jdmeister wrote: Sorry to relay that Bruce posted an opinion, and it fell off the interwebtubes.. Drink the Kool Aid and shake the pom poms or don't bother to post anything. That is the message of the day.
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mckyj57
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Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 12:27 pm |
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Out on the ground, I am not seeing that much effect. In Florida in particular, the pirates are back with the loaded drives. Just went to a show last night in Miami, DJ for a guy I am sure was sued. Had the whole nine yards, every SC song, the usual pirate loadout.
I have been traveling a lot for the last month, gone to karaoke in 5 states and about 15 cities. It is mostly business as usual, perhaps I see a few more trivia shows and a few less karaoke shows. But hard to discern.
The other day I went to a show with a guy advertising "The area's largest legal song collection". I asked for a song that is damaged on just about all the pirate drives. He put up the SC version. Sure enough, graphics died and music jumped in the middle of the second verse, in the same exact pattern as about all the rest of the hard drives users I have seen.
_________________
[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.
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JoeChartreuse
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Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 11:14 pm |
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Don't know if I misunderstood, but it seems that some posted that it was a positive that Lisah had to drop rates to get more work? Thanks to SC?
If I read correctly, then, um....no. That is a LOSS, not a gain. Time to review those business courses.....
_________________
"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"
" Disc based and loving it..."
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karaokegod73
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Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 11:15 pm |
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Haha, wish I had that kind of knowledge to know a pirated track from experience. I don't go to many shows and I know one company with a lot of graphically troubled songs. Whether they were ripped from bad disks or are illegal downloads I don't know. I do know that I have some of the same versions/songs in perfect condition from disks.
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mckyj57
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Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 3:03 am |
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karaokegod73 wrote: Haha, wish I had that kind of knowledge to know a pirated track from experience.. It's not like I'm trying to do it. It is just pretty obvious that we are dealing with the same rip. It isn't a song that is done by many people -- if that type of defect were in "Summer Nights" I am sure it would be fixed. But when it's a song that I frequently hear "That's a great song -- never have heard anyone do it before", it is probably that way because not enought people have done it to register the problem.
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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.
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jclaydon
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Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 9:24 am |
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Joe: you must have misunderstood. Two is more than zero. Ie two extra gigs, results in more extra money than zero extra gigs.
Basic math skills.
Now if she was taking a pay cut on the job she ALREADY had then that would be a whole different matter.
Actually tho, I don't think it had ANYTHING to do with sound choice, just Lisah's own personal initiative to go talk to the owner and convince them to hire her for extra work instead of hiring an alledged infringer.
-James
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ripman8
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Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 12:32 pm |
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Lisah wrote: I think it will take quite some time before a benefit from lawsuits or the fear of them, will show up. Karaoke will suffer, as it is already suffering. If it becomes apparent that illegal will get caught, then the illegal will slowly go away and venues will eventually begin to look for legal KJ's. This could take years and years.  Some good news: We have had a Saturday gig at one venue for three years... this venue hired a KJ that uses a pirated hard drive for Sundays. The venue owner mentioned that he wanted to do Mondays also. I was nervous that he would hire the 'illegal' guy. This 'illegal' guy charges half of what I charge. Anyway, I had a meeting with the venue owner and explained to him what was going on in the karaoke industry. I offered a 'package' deal to him of Saturdays at the usual price but Sunday and Monday at $50 less each night...To my surprise he said, "Sounds great!", "Illegal guy is outta here!" He's paying us more than he paid the 'illegal'. Goes to show that if you take the time to really talk to your venues and explain what is happening.... One small business owner to another.... there is the chance we could make more of a difference in this battle than the lawsuits are. Yes, I took a cut in pay... but I got took one gig (possibly two) from a 'bad guy' and the cut wasn't to the bone so-to-speak. One gig at a time.... we can make a difference. Schedule a meeting with venue owners, see if you can't do the same as I did. I hope to have more of those meetings... getting the word out that illegal hard drives are hurting the legitimate small businesses.... can't hurt. Not all owners listen, trust me. Some, not even if you spend the time with them to tell them what is going on. To them, a buck saved is a buck earned. Legal or illegal. Moral or immoral. As long as they have 100,000 plus songs!
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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]
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BruceFan4Life
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Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 8:59 pm |
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BruceFan4Life wrote: jdmeister wrote: Sorry to relay that Bruce posted an opinion, and it fell off the interwebtubes.. Drink the Kool Aid and shake the pom poms or don't bother to post anything. That is the message of the day. If I read your post correctly; is using Sax & Dotty now a sign that someone is a pirate? and why the big secret? What's the name of the defective track so we can all go out and sing it so we'll know who all of the pirates are too. Maybe that's the secret track that Sound Choice looks for when they send in the investigators.  If you have Devil Went Down to Georgia and it has a bad pixel at the 2:27 mark; you might be a redneck!!!
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Alan B
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Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 9:58 pm |
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ripman8 wrote: Lisah wrote: I think it will take quite some time before a benefit from lawsuits or the fear of them, will show up. Karaoke will suffer, as it is already suffering. If it becomes apparent that illegal will get caught, then the illegal will slowly go away and venues will eventually begin to look for legal KJ's. This could take years and years. Some good news: We have had a Saturday gig at one venue for three years... this venue hired a KJ that uses a pirated hard drive for Sundays. The venue owner mentioned that he wanted to do Mondays also. I was nervous that he would hire the 'illegal' guy. This 'illegal' guy charges half of what I charge. Anyway, I had a meeting with the venue owner and explained to him what was going on in the karaoke industry. I offered a 'package' deal to him of Saturdays at the usual price but Sunday and Monday at $50 less each night...To my surprise he said, "Sounds great!", "Illegal guy is outta here!" He's paying us more than he paid the 'illegal'. Goes to show that if you take the time to really talk to your venues and explain what is happening.... One small business owner to another.... there is the chance we could make more of a difference in this battle than the lawsuits are. Yes, I took a cut in pay... but I got took one gig (possibly two) from a 'bad guy' and the cut wasn't to the bone so-to-speak. One gig at a time.... we can make a difference. Schedule a meeting with venue owners, see if you can't do the same as I did. I hope to have more of those meetings... getting the word out that illegal hard drives are hurting the legitimate small businesses.... can't hurt. Not all owners listen, trust me. Some, not even if you spend the time with them to tell them what is going on. To them, a buck saved is a buck earned. Legal or illegal. Moral or immoral. As long as they have 100,000 plus songs! And what do they say to you when you tell them "by hiring one of them, you're opening yourself up to lawsuits of several hundred thousand dollars including the risk of losing your liquer license". "Mr. Venue owner, are you willing to take that risk just to save a buck???
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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.
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karaokegod73
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Posted: Sat May 19, 2012 9:59 pm |
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I'd like to know too . I usually fix mine if there's any problem with the rips. I try to make them all perfect. Even from brand new disks there can be some problems sometimes
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rickgood
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Posted: Sun May 20, 2012 6:13 am |
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Alan B wrote: And what do they say to you when you tell them "by hiring one of them, you're opening yourself up to lawsuits of several hundred thousand dollars including the risk of losing your liquer license". "Mr. Venue owner, are you willing to take that risk just to save a buck??? Point to proof of any venue in the United States being sued for having "illegal" karaoke tracks in their bar and lost their liquor license? Don't look towards Vegas though, that is over. You can't suggest that to venue owners and be believable, if that were the case, all the pirates would be gone, right?
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Paradigm Karaoke
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Posted: Sun May 20, 2012 11:54 pm |
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Alan B wrote: And what do they say to you when you tell them "by hiring one of them, you're opening yourself up to lawsuits of several hundred thousand dollars including the risk of losing your liquer license". "Mr. Venue owner, are you willing to take that risk just to save a buck??? In AZ they laugh at you (first hand experiencs....lots of it) and ask "like who?" followed by "company x said some people would try this crap to justify a higher price" these certs are the best thing to happen to non certified hosts.
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Paradigm Karaoke, The New Standard.......Shift Happens
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kjathena
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Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 2:28 am |
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easy enough to pull up files from Justia and answer the question......plenty of ongoing cases to show them (maybe involving states other than your own). With most you can also use analogies they can understand about buying VS stealing product they use everyday (I use beer). It may not get through the first time but by the 4th or 5th KJ that explains it they do start to understand.
Blessings
Athena
_________________
"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey
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ripman8
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Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 8:53 am |
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Alan B wrote: ripman8 wrote: Lisah wrote: I think it will take quite some time before a benefit from lawsuits or the fear of them, will show up. Karaoke will suffer, as it is already suffering. If it becomes apparent that illegal will get caught, then the illegal will slowly go away and venues will eventually begin to look for legal KJ's. This could take years and years. Some good news: We have had a Saturday gig at one venue for three years... this venue hired a KJ that uses a pirated hard drive for Sundays. The venue owner mentioned that he wanted to do Mondays also. I was nervous that he would hire the 'illegal' guy. This 'illegal' guy charges half of what I charge. Anyway, I had a meeting with the venue owner and explained to him what was going on in the karaoke industry. I offered a 'package' deal to him of Saturdays at the usual price but Sunday and Monday at $50 less each night...To my surprise he said, "Sounds great!", "Illegal guy is outta here!" He's paying us more than he paid the 'illegal'. Goes to show that if you take the time to really talk to your venues and explain what is happening.... One small business owner to another.... there is the chance we could make more of a difference in this battle than the lawsuits are. Yes, I took a cut in pay... but I got took one gig (possibly two) from a 'bad guy' and the cut wasn't to the bone so-to-speak. One gig at a time.... we can make a difference. Schedule a meeting with venue owners, see if you can't do the same as I did. I hope to have more of those meetings... getting the word out that illegal hard drives are hurting the legitimate small businesses.... can't hurt. Not all owners listen, trust me. Some, not even if you spend the time with them to tell them what is going on. To them, a buck saved is a buck earned. Legal or illegal. Moral or immoral. As long as they have 100,000 plus songs! And what do they say to you when you tell them "by hiring one of them, you're opening yourself up to lawsuits of several hundred thousand dollars including the risk of losing your liquer license". "Mr. Venue owner, are you willing to take that risk just to save a buck??? "I pay my fees and it covers karaoke." I told them that was bogus but they didn't listen to me. Cheap owners are willing to take the chance.
_________________
KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]
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kjathena
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Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 9:53 am |
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it is a very sad state of affairs that cheap owners have been trained to believe parts of the pirates lament.....re training of the owners/KJ's and singers is now required
blessings
Athena
_________________
"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey
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Lisah
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Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 5:49 pm |
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Sorry for being out of the loop since I posted... had an extremely busy week last week FOR A CHANGE! As for bar owners listening, it's correct some won't listen. This guy did and believed me when I told him he was open for a lawsuit. I went in with knowledge. I explained it simply but told him I'd be happy to get more detailed if he wanted. His comment was "I trust you". Yes, that says a lot for how he views me and our small business. For those of you that think I lost money, here's the scoop: We get $200 per night for Saturday but are going to do the Sunday & Monday gigs for $150 per night. So, we are making $1,200 per month more (minus the wages, taxes etc.). We only set up once and tear down once per week for that gig! YAY! I'm pretty happy that the bar owner decided to pay us more than he paid the 'illegal'. For those 2 nights: Illegal cost would be $800 per month. Legal (Us) will be $1,200. Bar owner is spending $400 more than he had to. I credit this with... yes, I am better than the other guy. My equipment is better. I have more experience. My library is high quality & large...AND I'm legal. The bar owner was happy to say "illegal gone"! I also know that this particular bar owner gets out and about talking to other bar owners. This can't hurt either  _________________  SoundChoice Certification coming soon!
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JoeChartreuse
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Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 11:20 pm |
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Alan B wrote: ripman8 wrote: [And what do they say to you when you tell them "by hiring one of them, you're opening yourself up to lawsuits of several hundred thousand dollars including the risk of losing your liquer license". "Mr. Venue owner, are you willing to take that risk just to save a buck??? What makes you think that even real pirates (people who steal songs as opposed to media shifters who are good customers and still get sued) are always cheaper? Most in this area charge the same on average as hosts who pay for their music.
_________________
"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"
" Disc based and loving it..."
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Lisah
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Posted: Thu May 24, 2012 9:59 am |
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If the 'real' pirate is charging the same as the legit KJ then the playing field is a bit more level, isn't it? (I'm not talking about KJs that media shifted, I'm talking about the buyers of illegal hard drives.) In that case, I would still get the word out to the venues about the risk of lawsuit. I was honest to my venue about the risk not necessarily being high BUT that the cost IF sued could be very high. Anyway, back to the illegal charging the same as the legit.... a more level playing field, isn't it? If you do a better job, have better equipment, keep up-to-date with your library... then it's up to you to convince the venues that you are better. IF this illegal had a far superior library than the average KJ, it's very important to warn the venues... and that should give you a step up on them. No matter how small that step may be...
As stated here before... some venues won't listen or don't care about legalities. It's too bad really.... how would that venue like it if the bar across the street bought cheaper whiskey and filled his Jack Daniels bottles with it. (I'd complain as a customer because I KNOW the difference in taste but you'd be amazed how many don't.) Anyway, same concept.. that venue owner would have his panties all up in a wad!
_________________ SoundChoice Certification coming soon!
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rickgood
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Posted: Thu May 24, 2012 12:40 pm |
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But you're making the assumption that the pirate is using SC or CB - if he is not, currently, there is no threat of a lawsuit for the venue. As a matter of face, the "smart" pirate would use neither and relieve himself of that possibility. I'd be very careful about the language I used when discussing another KJ's business...
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