Karaoke Forums

It wouldn't change my way of doing things one bit. I am a single op, and I enjoy that. Like someone else said, if you can multi-rig and keep on top of it, more power to you. I don't think it would change many of the hosts around here. We don't have many multi-riggers around here. But I enjoy being a single rig op. I only have to maintain on set of equipment, I only have to buy one of any song I get, and I make enough to live on. I am not one of these people who looks to get rich. I want my bills paid, and I want food on my table. But even if the music wasn't a factor anymore, there is still plenty of equipment to worry about when you multi-rig, plus accounting, and selling more gigs, and all the other headaches. No thanks.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

Apologize up front as we did not read the thread, just replying to the question about if multirigging was legal, would it change your business.

We have maintained for years how ridiculous it is for a kj with 5 systems forced to buy 5 sets of music.
It should simply be that you pay full price for one set and you buy special licenses for the other 4 at a cheaper rate. just a side opinion. Take care guys!

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MADPROAUDIO ~ DISABLED VETERAN ~ FAMILY OWNED COMPANY

I am actually torn on this one. The physical media has value in a resale. If a hosting company downsizes, it is more valuable to sell off a system with discs included than with only a paper license. This is of course only valid for content produced up to about 2-3 years ago though. Everything after 2011/2012 has been available in multiple formats. At that point you have to be a better salesman to note that a LOT of money was spent on downloaded music that will be included.

This is one of the reasons I still buy discs even though I buy a lot less than I used to. One of my KJ's has proposed working for free to buy the system he works with and go solo. I am inclined to do so but want to ensure they have discs and documentation in case the karaoke police come knocking.

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-Chris

Multirigging IS legal IF you are 1-1. We run 4 rigs now and it is a TON of work. For every hour of show time there is at least 2 hours of behind the scenes work required. Hiring, training, looking for new shows, books, searching for discs/new songs, book keeping, equipment replacement/repairs, ripping, promotion, travel time and the list goes on and on. Currently we operate 12 four hour shows a week(48 hours), 8 of those are run by our KJ's (48 - 32 = 16) . We also perform the majority of the behind the scenes work( 96 hour total we do over 80% so 77 hours per week + 16 hours of show=93 hours of work a week). After covering expenses (taxes, insurance, payroll, music, equipment, storage, repairs, gas ect) we are ecstatic if we clear $1000 making our time pay less than $11 an hour. Given the amount of hours we work I would hardly say we are greedy or out to get rich. But we can pay our bills

Can anybody cite any case of a DJ being prosecuted for not being 1-1?

Nope. That would be just the publishers / owners, and they haven't gotten desparate enough fo sue single DJs......YET.

Also harder to do- no visual clues.

Could be easier to nail Video DJs, but nothing there either so far - at least as far as I know.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

I understand you wanting to have value to resell if you downsize. However as i grow i don't make purchases with downsizing as a thought. Everything i purchased is a business expense and bought with the though of growth in mind. If the time comes that i must downsize then and only then will I look at resale values and options. Just as i have purchased downloads, they are of zero value for me to resale since the suppliers i use prohibit resale and i must respect their requirements. As for physical media, then it is of whatever value the seller and buyer agree upon.

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No venue to big or too small. From your den to the local club or event, we have the music most requested. Great sounding system!

Might I suggest you contact promo only and ask them if they have sued any djs for pirating their tracks and the answer they will give you is yes! They perhaps can cite several cases.

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No venue to big or too small. From your den to the local club or event, we have the music most requested. Great sounding system!

Frank, you know how much I respectt you and Athena as hosts. That being said, I'm thinking that you may wish to think about expense reduction / cost study (what I call the Back End Principle - higher profits through less spending) . I am a single rigger, buy my discs, pay taxes, and put in at even more pre-show time, yet bring home a bit more.

Maybe the storage is over-priced, or the transport economy doesn't match the load to be hauled, etc....

Example: I have a friend who charges $50 more per show than I do, yet brings home much less. In his case it is because A: He uses transport that is WAY over what he needs, and a true fuel sucker.

This, coupled with B: He will work anywhere, no matter how far away, without factoring in cost.

C: Does not match equipment to venue, carrying more than he needs to smaller venues - with larger transport - as well as not spreading wear and tear over more than one system.

I know I'm probably out of line just bringing this up. Apologies in advance. I would have PMed it, but I believe that others could benefit from cost studies as well.

If you are going to put in all those hours and effort,you should be better compensated for it.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Frank, Joe has a point! I would bet that if you had permanent installs at 4 locations and you and Athena ran the shows all by yourselves you would make more money. Of course that would be if you had more than 1 show a week at those permanent installs. Just think of the reduction in loading and unloading alone You could drive a Prius to work and save even more.

JoeC and Mrmarog,

We do perm installs in every location where we play more than 1 night a week, this increases our equipment costs and repair costs but does decrease set up time.

We do custom build systems for each location even when we are hauling equipment for every show....this also increases equipment costs and repair costs but insures the best sound for each room helping us keep shows for MUCH longer than our competition.

We do travel upto 1 hour each way for well paying jobs that tend to be long term as well.

Currently Frank runs 5 shows a week ,( I am currently unable to run shows due to some health issues but love to go and "run the crowd" when I can) Franks son Scott runs 4 shows a week. Kj DC runs 2 shows a week (he is a full time student and does not want more) and Kj Susan runs 1 show a week (She also runs 2 other businesses and only wants 1 show a week) We also have 1 fully trained fill-in KJ (all he cares to work at this time) and 2 more in training at this time.

We pay our Kj's well and expect them to run each and every show to the standards of a Certified Karaoke show (truth be told they make more than the most of the single ops around here without all the work or investment)....each may have a different " personality flavor" but all company rules and procedures must be followed at all times. It is very difficult to find responsible GOOD Kj's to complete our 6 week training process.

We are now running at capacity until our new Kj's complete training (unless a Wednesday show pops up for Scott). Once the 2 new Kj's are ready we will be able to book upto 5 new shows a week increasing our profit by a minimum of $650 per week(after expenses).

Frank and I also work 30+ hours per week each marketing, canvassing, repairing/replacing, promoting, training, researching/finding new music, working on books and book keeping (the hard and boring part of karaoke), We hope to be back upto running at full capacity with all 4 systems by the end of the year, again having 6 Kj's working as much as they wish like we were before the industry crash 6 years ago.

As much as I would like to be running shows on my own again that is unlikely to happen however I can still pull my weight doing "back end" work and be a integral part of the business we have built . If/when we ever decide to retire we have a business that has value we could sell it whole...or we could sell off individual systems to our Kj's and recoup 30K minimum per system (we already have 2 Kjs who are begging for this option)

Karaoke has been our "bread and butter" for the greatest part of the last 20 years....this is how we paid our bills and put food on the table...we work hard at our business and had to make it work without a safety net. We do not regret the hours we work and can live comfortably on what we now make(simple tastes and NO debt except a small mortgage that will be paid off in less than 2 years...happy Dance) I personally do look forward to a few more luxuries returning however

Multi-rigging is HARD work but well worth it to us....enough rambling for now

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"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

Preach it sister!!!!!!!!!!!!

I too have permanent installs in several locations for 2 of my KJs but like you I also spend time making sure all our systems are in tip top shape. I also generate higher (with the help of great talent in each location) revenue per show than the other kjs in our market. For me multi rigging is very well worth it but hard work and expensive to put in play. June 4th I will be adding a new location and giving one of my kjs additional revenue. Note: prior to making additional investments in equipment and music, I run an ROI statement so I always know where my cost are and how soon I can expect to profit from each purchase and location.

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No venue to big or too small. From your den to the local club or event, we have the music most requested. Great sounding system!

All I was trying to say is that a multi like F&A should be bringing home more than a single rigger, not the other way around. Otherwise, why go through all of the time, employees, perm installs, extra time and accounting?

I like Frank and Athena, regardless of the SC debates that seem to P*** EVERYONE off. I'm trying to be helpful.

Either their area is one of those that have lower standard fees (entirely possible, I simply don't know) or expenses are higher than they should be, and should be re-examined.
All just suggestion. What would doing a full review hurt? However,if not worth their time, then it's not.

Moving on......

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Joe I understand where you were coming from...In our area the better than average karaoke host (single op)is working 3 nights a week for average $125 a night....and is normally churning venues often due to pirates that will work for less. Our weekday rate is double that (weekends are more) Most of our shows last years not months.

Single Op 3 x 125 = 375 per week - expenses using an example of a few locals backwork for them is equal to show hours so 24 hours giving 15.62 per hour gross.... subtract taxes, insurance city/county licences, and it quickly drops below $11 per hour BEFORE music and equipment repair/replacement.

Our expenses are higher than MOST because we do pay our KJ's more...we buy and maintain more equipment....we buy more music...pay more taxes...pay for licences and insurance, however we are working MUCH more than most and for MUCH longer timeframes at most venues at MUCH higher rates of of pay. We are content when we clear $1000 a week because no-one else around here is doing even 1/2 that consistently.

This is our business and we treat it as such...it supports us. Many do karaoke as a hobby...they pay no taxes, buy no insurance or licenses, and put much less time and money into it because it is not as important to them, they may see higher returns for a short time than we do but they do not stay long once they learn what is needed to succeed in this business.

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"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey