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earthling12357
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:15 pm |
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Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2011 11:21 pm Posts: 1609 Location: Earth Been Liked: 307 times
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HarringtonLaw wrote: I can't for the life of me figure out why you would want to hide it if defendants were consulting you, unless you were practicing law without a license (something I know you wouldn't do) or (more likely) you understand that public knowledge that you were making money from the litigation would tarnish your credentials as an anti-SC crusader. All good crusaders are true believers and wouldn't dream of taking money for their advocacy.
As you pointed out, I think, merely telling someone to consult with a lawyer or consider a countersuit--those things don't really count. (By the way, I think it's cute that you seem to think I don't want defendants to hire a lawyer; I recommend that every defendant consult with a lawyer, and one with IP experience if possible. I prefer that defendants get a lawyer because I believe that they will benefit from the professional judgment and independence that a lawyer will provide.) And here is the accusation behind the original accusation. As one who practiced law in Florida with authorization to do so, HarringtonLaw would have been privy to the identities of all those practicing law from the opposing side. If Chip was on the list he would not need to ask the question. If Chip's documents were submitted as evidence, he should already know that. HarringtonLaw wrote: I'm stating outright that it appeared to me that you provided some sort of consulting assistance to the attorney who represented two bars in Panama City Beach, Florida, against whom we tried a case in early July. My reason for suspecting that this is the case is that the attorney, who is not an IP attorney in the slightest, attempted to present certain defenses that you have vocally advocated on this forum and elsewhere and did actually present documents that indicated they had been stored on a website you control (but that are not generally accessible through Google, for example). Providing some sort of cunsulting assistance to an attorney is not practicing law without a license. Are defense attorneys in soundchoice lawsuits uniquely not allowed to seek out and interview experts in the field to help them direct their own path to defense? HarringtonLaw seems to be trying to manufacture something sinister out of nothing. HarringtonLaw wrote: I prefer that defendants get a lawyer because I believe that they will benefit from the professional judgment and independence that a lawyer will provide.) And once they find out how much getting a lawyer could cost, they are more likely to decide to settle.
_________________ KNOW THYSELF
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Second City Song
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:21 pm |
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Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2011 3:00 am Posts: 192 Location: Illinois Been Liked: 16 times
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earthling12357 wrote: HarringtonLaw wrote: I prefer that defendants get a lawyer because I believe that they will benefit from the professional judgment and independence that a lawyer will provide.) And once they find out how much getting a lawyer could cost, they are more likely to decide to settle. And why on earth would they settle? Maybe because they are guilty in the first place? Wouldn't it be cheaper still, if legitimate, to pay the audit fees?
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earthling12357
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:29 pm |
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Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2011 11:21 pm Posts: 1609 Location: Earth Been Liked: 307 times
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Second City Song wrote: earthling, Maybe Harrington has some facts he's not telling us? So I will ask. Does HarringtonLaw have some facts that he is not eluding to? It seems that Chip has made accusations, on various subjects in the past, regarding information he has in which he turns around and says, "Look it up yourself, I'm not your secretary." It sounds to me as I read all this is that Harrington has gotten under Chip's skin by using Chip-like posting tactics. If HarringtonLaw has some facts that he is hinting at yet unwilling to share, we have no way to look it up ourselves. This would be below the level of class and respect that Chip has shown us by at least telling us where to look things up. If one were to assume the exisitence of these mysterious "facts", perhaps the reason HarringtonLaw can't tell us where to find these alleged "facts" is because they are held in secrecy by court order as attorney privilege from that case. In which case, the act of publicly hinting at those "facts" would be below the level of class and respect the courts would expect from an attorney who has been properly authorized to practice law.
_________________ KNOW THYSELF
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earthling12357
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:32 pm |
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Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2011 11:21 pm Posts: 1609 Location: Earth Been Liked: 307 times
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Second City Song wrote: earthling12357 wrote: HarringtonLaw wrote: I prefer that defendants get a lawyer because I believe that they will benefit from the professional judgment and independence that a lawyer will provide.) And once they find out how much getting a lawyer could cost, they are more likely to decide to settle. And why on earth would they settle? Maybe because they are guilty in the first place? Wouldn't it be cheaper still, if legitimate, to pay the audit fees? I once heard a guy named Guido say almost exactly the same thing.
_________________ KNOW THYSELF
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JimHarrington
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:40 pm |
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Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2011 8:59 am Posts: 3011 Been Liked: 1003 times
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earthling12357 wrote: HarringtonLaw wrote: I can't for the life of me figure out why you would want to hide it if defendants were consulting you, unless you were practicing law without a license (something I know you wouldn't do) or (more likely) you understand that public knowledge that you were making money from the litigation would tarnish your credentials as an anti-SC crusader. All good crusaders are true believers and wouldn't dream of taking money for their advocacy.
As you pointed out, I think, merely telling someone to consult with a lawyer or consider a countersuit--those things don't really count. (By the way, I think it's cute that you seem to think I don't want defendants to hire a lawyer; I recommend that every defendant consult with a lawyer, and one with IP experience if possible. I prefer that defendants get a lawyer because I believe that they will benefit from the professional judgment and independence that a lawyer will provide.) And here is the accusation behind the original accusation. As one who practiced law in Florida with authorization to do so, HarringtonLaw would have been privy to the identities of all those practicing law from the opposing side. If Chip was on the list he would not need to ask the question. If Chip's documents were submitted as evidence, he should already know that. This looks very much like you are accusing me of practicing law in Florida without authorization--something that is definitely not true. I am going to chalk that up to an awkward wording on your part. I am not accusing Chip of practicing law without a license--and I specifically said so ("something I know you wouldn't do"). Chip's documents *were* submitted as evidence. But just because those documents were submitted as evidence does not, by itself, mean that Chip was a consultant (paid or otherwise) for the defense. earthling12357 wrote: Providing some sort of cunsulting assistance to an attorney is not practicing law without a license. Are defense attorneys in soundchoice lawsuits uniquely not allowed to seek out and interview experts in the field to help them direct their own path to defense? HarringtonLaw seems to be trying to manufacture something sinister out of nothing.
Again, I have not accused Chip, and would not accuse him, of practicing law without a license. And of course, there is no reason why he shouldn't be allowed to consult with attorneys and pro se defendants regarding their defense. That is not what my inquiry is about, and I am not trying to "manufacture something sinister" out of it. My inquiry is specifically directed to Chip's participation on this forum. If he is a consultant for defendants in SC lawsuits, that ought to be disclosed because it potentially affects his credibility with respect to information he posts here. If he is a paid consultant, then his views might be colored by a desire to encourage defendants not to settle, or to pursue certain defenses, in the hope that they will hire him to assist in their defense. As I have said several times, I hope defendants are hiring him, because his "assistance" spells disaster for them and makes my job easier. earthling12357 wrote: HarringtonLaw wrote: I prefer that defendants get a lawyer because I believe that they will benefit from the professional judgment and independence that a lawyer will provide.) And once they find out how much getting a lawyer could cost, they are more likely to decide to settle. Virtually all of the defendants who hire attorneys are counseled by those attorneys to settle with us because settlement is a good deal for most of the defendants we sue.
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chrisavis
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:44 pm |
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:38 pm Posts: 6086 Images: 1 Location: Redmond, WA Been Liked: 1665 times
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None of this has much to do with the link I posted at the very beginning of the thread...
-Chris
_________________ -Chris
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timberlea
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:46 pm |
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Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2002 12:41 pm Posts: 4094 Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada Been Liked: 309 times
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Chip may be good at pointing out errors, missed deadlines or whatever, buthe has not shown any law or case law stating that it is legal to copy material or Trademarks for commercial purposes or showing a ruling that states that running karaoke as a business is not considered commercial. Bottom line for all his twisting, sidestepping, backsliding, and changing, he has NOT shown that the nub (the copying, format shift, media shift, what have you) is legal. To Use a Chipism, if a court hasn't struck a law down, then it is valid.
_________________ You can be strange but not a stranger
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earthling12357
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 4:05 pm |
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Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2011 11:21 pm Posts: 1609 Location: Earth Been Liked: 307 times
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HarringtonLaw wrote: earthling12357 wrote: HarringtonLaw wrote: I can't for the life of me figure out why you would want to hide it if defendants were consulting you, unless you were practicing law without a license (something I know you wouldn't do) or (more likely) you understand that public knowledge that you were making money from the litigation would tarnish your credentials as an anti-SC crusader. All good crusaders are true believers and wouldn't dream of taking money for their advocacy.
As you pointed out, I think, merely telling someone to consult with a lawyer or consider a countersuit--those things don't really count. (By the way, I think it's cute that you seem to think I don't want defendants to hire a lawyer; I recommend that every defendant consult with a lawyer, and one with IP experience if possible. I prefer that defendants get a lawyer because I believe that they will benefit from the professional judgment and independence that a lawyer will provide.) And here is the accusation behind the original accusation. As one who practiced law in Florida with authorization to do so, HarringtonLaw would have been privy to the identities of all those practicing law from the opposing side. If Chip was on the list he would not need to ask the question. If Chip's documents were submitted as evidence, he should already know that. This looks very much like you are accusing me of practicing law in Florida without authorization--something that is definitely not true. I am going to chalk that up to an awkward wording on your part. I'll chalk it up to awkward reading perhaps combined with a missing comma typo. Quote: As one who practiced law in Florida with authorization to do so, HarringtonLaw would have been privy to the identities of all those practicing law from the opposing side. It's obvious from the public documents that you are indeed authorized to practice law in Florida.
_________________ KNOW THYSELF
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c. staley
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 4:15 pm |
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Extreme Poster |
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Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2002 7:26 am Posts: 4839 Location: In your head rent-free Been Liked: 582 times
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timberlea wrote: Chip may be good at pointing out errors, missed deadlines or whatever, buthe has not shown any law or case law stating that it is legal to copy material or Trademarks for commercial purposes or showing a ruling that states that running karaoke as a business is not considered commercial. Bottom line for all his twisting, sidestepping, backsliding, and changing, he has NOT shown that the nub (the copying, format shift, media shift, what have you) is legal. To Use a Chipism, if a court hasn't struck a law down, then it is valid. You are full of moose-poop... Where was I EVER supposed to show "any law or case law stating that it is legal to copy material or Trademarks for commercial purposes or showing a ruling that states that running karaoke as a business is not considered commercial?"That is idiotic. You're now creating an artificial condition which you claim that I have refused or failed to answer. I can do the same thing by simply stating that you have not proven that you can high jump over 8 feet high standing on 1 foot. It's a ridiculous invented premise and I'm really not surprised that you would stoop this low. Get a life timberlea and stick with the subject at hand. You're sounding like a low-class flatfoot so desperate to dogpile that you'll make stuff like this up. And at least in this instance you are correct: timberlea wrote: To Use a Chipism, if a court hasn't struck a law down, then it is valid. If there is a law on the books that has not been repealed, modified and is still legally enforceable, then of course it's valid. If you commit any of the following crimes or civil infringements, the laws on the books – that a court has not struck down – are still valid: Murder embezzlement fraud copyright infringement trademark infringement jaywalking speeding racketeering and the list goes on and on. Luckily, there's no law against stupid. There are plenty of old laws that might seem ridiculous these days, such as it being illegal to walk a Moose down Main Street – but nevertheless, that law can still be enforced if you break it. And every once in a while one of these laws is actually enforced in order to make the news more exciting. Now I don't know how Canada works, perhaps you can shed some light on that.
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c. staley
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 4:21 pm |
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Extreme Poster |
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Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2002 7:26 am Posts: 4839 Location: In your head rent-free Been Liked: 582 times
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chrisavis wrote: None of this has much to do with the link I posted at the very beginning of the thread...
-Chris You should talk to HarringtonLaw about that. He's done a wonderful job of hijacking.
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chrisavis
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 4:57 pm |
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:38 pm Posts: 6086 Images: 1 Location: Redmond, WA Been Liked: 1665 times
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Actually....You hijacked the thread with your very first post, Chip. c. staley wrote: It's interesting that the article says that Kurt Slep would want to sell hard drives but can't.... Nowhere in the article does it say that Kurt/Sound Choice can't sell hard drives. It says this..... Quote: Until then, Sound Choice's CEO, Kurt Slep, says he's figuring out a way where he could sell hard drives directly. If that doesn't work out, it looks like we'll be "Rolling in the Deep" for a very long time. You either read it wrong or intentionally twisted it. You then go on to throw it into the weeds with the typical licensing mumbo jumbo and speculation that you are infamous for. -Chris
_________________ -Chris
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c. staley
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 5:27 pm |
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Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2002 7:26 am Posts: 4839 Location: In your head rent-free Been Liked: 582 times
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chrisavis wrote: Actually....You hijacked the thread with your very first post, Chip. c. staley wrote: It's interesting that the article says that Kurt Slep would want to sell hard drives but can't.... Nowhere in the article does it say that Kurt/Sound Choice can't sell hard drives. It says this..... Quote: Until then, Sound Choice's CEO, Kurt Slep, says he's figuring out a way where he could sell hard drives directly. If that doesn't work out, it looks like we'll be "Rolling in the Deep" for a very long time. You either read it wrong or intentionally twisted it. You then go on to throw it into the weeds with the typical licensing mumbo jumbo and speculation that you are infamous for. -Chris I did not read it wrong, nor did I intentionally twist anything. The article specifically says that "he's figuring out a way where he could sell hard drives directly" and you know, and I know that his current agreements with publishing houses will not allow him to do that. Perhaps his only avenue in this case would be to license the sale of hard drives through a division he would set up in a foreign country such as Mexico, Trinidad and Tobago, or even Bora Bora. That way, he could sell hard drives directly right back to the United States through these countries as long as these countries have agreements with the performing rights societies to pay them next to nothing. I'm simply questioning why his model for selling hard drives directly is not similar to his current method for selling the gems series directly but through a different country. So I am not a hijacking your thread. I'm simply expanding on a quote made by a manufacturer – from within that article.
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Cueball
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 7:28 pm |
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Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2001 6:55 pm Posts: 4433 Location: New York City Been Liked: 757 times
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HarringtonLaw wrote: The key point is that the discs--the physical thing Clark sells--are actually authorized by the publishers in Australia. The first-sale doctrine prevents the publishers from prohibiting the importation of authorized discs into the U.S. under copyright laws. (The key case is Quality King Distributors Inc. v. L'anza Research International Inc., 523 U.S. 135 (1998).)
Downloads, on the other hand, require the making of a new copy as the delivery mechanism, and the first-sale doctrine does not apply.
Of course, if the UK downloads were actually licensed by the publishers, they would be fine to use. I don't know whether they are or not. Question: Is Clark Music selling premade discs in any series... as an example (in comparrison) --- SC8000, SC8001, SC8002, etc... where each of these discs have the same tracks on them? Or, are they selling Customized discs, where I am asking for a song from SC8001 and a song from SC8007, and a song from SC8115, etc... to be made for me on a unique disc? If the answer is the latter, then wouldn't those discs be considered to be a downloaded product? After all, the songs were not on a premade disc, and someone had to download the specific tracks that I requested, in order to burn it to a disc and then send it out to me.
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kjathena
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 7:53 pm |
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Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2010 3:51 pm Posts: 1636 Been Liked: 73 times
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from what I have found after much research is that discs (custom or premade) fall tru the 1 disc direct sale loop hole. But as much overseas discs as you want 1 at a time as you can afford....until the loop hole is eliminated and ASCAP/BMI/OTHERS are paid the fees and you own the disc the chance is no- 1-1 disc KJ will ever have to worry
_________________ "Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain." Unknown "if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters." Lee McGuffey
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timberlea
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 8:02 pm |
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Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2002 12:41 pm Posts: 4094 Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada Been Liked: 309 times
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So Chip, then why all the vitriol against SC when what they are doing is completely legal in regards to their lawsuits? Then you comment on ways to get around it and give out misinformation. It's one thing to say I don't like this and another to attack them on just about everything.
_________________ You can be strange but not a stranger
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Second City Song
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 8:26 pm |
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Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2011 3:00 am Posts: 192 Location: Illinois Been Liked: 16 times
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HarringtonLaw wrote: As I have said several times, I hope defendants are hiring him, because his "assistance" spells disaster for them and makes my job easier.
Now THAT, is sound advise!
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Cueball
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Posted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 11:12 pm |
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Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2001 6:55 pm Posts: 4433 Location: New York City Been Liked: 757 times
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kjathena wrote: from what I have found after much research is that discs (custom or premade) fall tru the 1 disc direct sale loop hole. But as much overseas discs as you want 1 at a time as you can afford....until the loop hole is eliminated and ASCAP/BMI/OTHERS are paid the fees and you own the disc the chance is no- 1-1 disc KJ will ever have to worry Thank you for that, but I still would like to know what answer HL has for me about that.
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c. staley
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 3:26 am |
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Extreme Poster |
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Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2002 7:26 am Posts: 4839 Location: In your head rent-free Been Liked: 582 times
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Second City Song wrote: earthling,
Maybe Harrington has some facts he's not telling us? So I will ask.
Does HarringtonLaw have some facts that he is not eluding to? Notice how your question was ignored by your own hero? Does that tell you anything?
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chrisavis
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 9:23 am |
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:38 pm Posts: 6086 Images: 1 Location: Redmond, WA Been Liked: 1665 times
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c. staley wrote: chrisavis wrote: Actually....You hijacked the thread with your very first post, Chip. c. staley wrote: It's interesting that the article says that Kurt Slep would want to sell hard drives but can't.... Nowhere in the article does it say that Kurt/Sound Choice can't sell hard drives. It says this..... Quote: Until then, Sound Choice's CEO, Kurt Slep, says he's figuring out a way where he could sell hard drives directly. If that doesn't work out, it looks like we'll be "Rolling in the Deep" for a very long time. You either read it wrong or intentionally twisted it. You then go on to throw it into the weeds with the typical licensing mumbo jumbo and speculation that you are infamous for. -Chris I did not read it wrong, nor did I intentionally twist anything. The article specifically says that "he's figuring out a way where he could sell hard drives directly" and you know, and I know that his current agreements with publishing houses will not allow him to do that. Perhaps his only avenue in this case would be to license the sale of hard drives through a division he would set up in a foreign country such as Mexico, Trinidad and Tobago, or even Bora Bora. That way, he could sell hard drives directly right back to the United States through these countries as long as these countries have agreements with the performing rights societies to pay them next to nothing. I'm simply questioning why his model for selling hard drives directly is not similar to his current method for selling the gems series directly but through a different country. So I am not a hijacking your thread. I'm simply expanding on a quote made by a manufacturer – from within that article. Chip, You are the Lord God King of Wordsmithing. You know it. I know it. Everyone knows it. c. staley wrote: It's interesting that the article says that Kurt Slep would want to sell hard drives but can't.... The article does not say that. You are attributing the article as saying that Kurt said something that he did not say. What you and I may know is completely irrelevant. I am not going to argue with you because you are wrong. you know it. I know it. We all know it. you just won't ever admit to it. -Chris
_________________ -Chris
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mightywiz
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Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 9:50 am |
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Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2011 12:35 pm Posts: 1351 Images: 1 Location: Idaho Been Liked: 180 times
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this thread is going no-where fast....
i think an OP should jump in and lock it.......
_________________ It's all good!
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