Karaoke Forums

Then those KJs had no other material to use. I could drop my SC in a heart beat and no one would care. I have people coming to me from other shows that DO showcase SC as their go to brand, and they are becoming my regulars, with barely ANY SC. So I find your claim a bit dubious.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

Those KJs had lots of other material they could use. They just didn't want to use it.

I'm not saying it applies to everyone, and believe me, I don't fully understand it anyway. It's frustrating at times because it inhibits the resolution of cases. But there are plenty of KJs out there who do not want to give up their SC under any circumstances.

I went back to read this.......

So.......49 bars have issued an edict that Sound Choice is not allowed at their venues. Thus forcing legitimate KJ's to make sure they don't use SC at their shows for risk of losing their jobs.

So.......29 KJ's have agreed to drop Sound Choice and replace it with......what? Do they already have other versions of their SC tracks? Or will they have to buy other versions to replace the tracks? My guess is it will cost most if not all of them more than $150 to fill in the holes in their libraries after dropping SC. Not to mention parking those discs on a shelf and losing the investment (unless they sell them).

The combination of lost investment (on discs not used), effort to remove content (to ensure they don't run afoul of a venue), re-print books (another expense), manage expectations of singers (who may be accustomed to the arrangement and quality of SC tracks) all seems like a lot of effort to me.

So I am wondering why KJ's would agree to the extra work and expense to stay in business by replacing their SC libraries versus paying $150 to certify which protects the KJ and Venue and lets them utilize their existing investment in music.

For all the bashing the Sound Choice gets for being heavy handed, a large number of venues deciding that they will not hire KJ's that legally use Sound Choice content seems MUCH more heavy handed than anything Sound Choice has done to any host that follows the rules.

My guess is that uninformed and/or mis-informed individuals have spread enough fear that the venues - who don't want to deal with it - have issued a blanket demand on KJ's at their expense. Again, much more heavy handed and potentially more costly to KJ's than anything Sound Choice has asked for.

Perhaps the KJ's and venues should speak to some folks that are certified to get the real story of how being certified does not jeopardize them or their venues.

Certified KJ's can be easily located through the Sound Choice site here - http://www.soundchoicestore.com/certified-hosts.html - Most have their email address or web site listed so they would be easy to contact.

I am also happy to speak with KJ's and venues who would like to gain some perspective on how being certified is not harmful and can be beneficial when utilized properly (and without using fear).

again.....

Chris E. Avis
425-647-3440
chris@feelgoodpros.com

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-Chris

chris omg
did you miss the point

for those of you who work in bars you know owners don't want to lift a hand
don't bother me with carp
they take the easy way out and don't give a crap about fenders
sound choice gave them the answer they been looking for
dont use no sue

I don't know what world you live in
but most people don't care whose disc they sing as long as you have there song
no dj has gone thru all that crap you just posted
for me i have not used sound choice in 8 years chartbuster for 6 years
and I don not use the cloud
the rest of the kjs have been weeding out sound choice for the last 4 years
and its only a dat file to change
most of them don't use books
no one losing there job they don't have sc anyway
its ok chris you like what u use but please stop trying to forced feed the rest of us the kool aid
respect our choice and will respect yours

I am not force feeding anyone. I am pointing out some things based on the information in your post and asking questions. Had you stated that these same KJ's had been removing SC from their system over the past 4 years, I would never have made the previous post.

However, I still believe that informed venues and KJ's can take an easier path through certified KJ's than removing SC from availability.

The fear of being sued is completely unjustified, IMO. To the best of my knowledge, here in Seattle, nobody was sued for following the rules. There were no disc based hosts sued by accident. There were no venues sued for hosts using SC material legitimately.

If the venues in your area were to take an accounting of the same information, they would find that the ONLY hosts and venues that were sued were those that deserved to be sued because they were either flat our pirates, or they thumbed their noses at the rules.

So where is the fear of getting sued coming from? My guess, it is from certain anti-Sound Choice KJ's that are trumpeting as loud as possible that no matter what, SC WILL sue you even if you are legitimate, even those cases of that happening have been rare AND settled without damage to hosts or venues.

On top of all of that.......what you seem to be dismissing is that agree or disagree with SC tactics, SC is using existing laws that are designed to protect intellectual property to..........protect their intellectual property!

........and no matter how long these hosts have taken to remove SC from their libraries, they are still losing their investment in the core tools of their business.

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-Chris

While I fully understand and expect the venue's mindset about not wanting to be told what to do, the fact is they are only being told not to play illegal versions of SC songs. So they have a tantrum and say if we can't use illegal versions we won't use them at all?????

The reason it seems like an illogical response to me (And Chris's economics add a whole new dimension to that) is that they are also eliminating any certified hosts or Safe Harbor hosts who may be in the area. If they were just trying to eliminate the lawsuit worry than why eliminate those options? It just doesn't seem well thought out or informed to me. And as far as the DJs, no, they may not have had to deal with that YET but DJs have indeed been sued before although mostly for distribution. But they have been sued.

Emotional responses rarely are.

Their goal is to punish SC for daring to call them out on piracy.

Knowledge is power, but with today's dissemination of the facts and trying to figure out who is telling the truth about anything, it is sometimes totally logical to do absolutely nothing one way or the other. So given a choice of having karaoke along with possible risks or not having karaoke and eliminate those possible risks, some have simply chosen the "no karaoke" (or no SC) route. It can have nothing to do with "punishing" or boycotting, it could simply be damage control and proactive thinking.

You're quite the pot stirrer today. I've said no such thing. What I DID say was that in SC's case one signs away any right to expect the same treatment of personal info that others provide.

Do you actually READ any of the posts to which you reply?

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

And according to the questionnaire, one signs away the right to expect what you have claimed above.

So which is it?

Two problems arise. One, opposing statements as noted above.

Two, one has to decide whether to trust SC or not based on their past performance, actions, and treatment of KJs / customers...

I know that those who somehow find SC's actions ethical still believe the myth that they are trying to fight piracy.

In real life the are a for profit company whose income is currently modeled on that of the IP troll, and this latest action is basically info fishing for dollars. I get it.

It is my personal choice not to trust people or corporations that have proven ( at least to me) themselves untrustworthy.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion. Your mileage may vary.

I only have one venue left that allows me to play SC tracks ( not that it matters - they are the smallest brand in my library excluding bits and pieces).

It's no biggie business-wise for me. I just find the whole deal not only offensive, but also just another negative impact on our industry.

I do use a lot of Chartbuster for many reasons, and will continue to do so.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

no bar that I know of in 30 years has ever been sued for what a dj has in way of dj music
I have seen the dj sued but not the bar using him or her

this is where in my opinion sound choice messed up
go ahead sue the kj leave the bar alone
that's like suing ford for the car used in bank robberies
omg really
really all your doing by suing the bar is posing the source of income
and giving karaoke a bad name like it wasn't hard enough to sell karaoke
if I were a bar owner and I could be sued for karaoke for what ever reason
I just would not do It

sound choice you said its not about the money
so stop suing bars and go after the kjs
by the way bar karaoke is side money for most kjs its not going to hurt them if karaoke goes away in bars

I think that facts are pretty clear -

No certified host has ever been sued after getting certified. No GEM holder has ever been sued after picking up a GEM. No venue has ever been sued while using a certified host or a GEM host.

On other side.....

Lots of venues and hosts have been sued that don't use certified hosts or GEM hosts.

Of course it is also true that no host or venue has been sued where there is no Sound Choice being used. But that doesn't make those venues legitimate either.

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-Chris

Mike, they are once again attempting to use the venues ( through intimidation) to get TO the Kjs. That's the point.

They do not care who they hurt on their fishing expeditions - that's not an opinion, it has been proven fact by their " Sue now, find any actual information later " method of operation.

They will to annoy the venues, making waves, and damaging our industry until they ultimately fail. Could take awhile. If nothing else, Kurt's no quitter.

It may be just a matter of annoying the wrong person or venue. They were extremely lucky to get out of Vegas in the manner that they did.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

MIKED - I read your post about the venue & KJ's meeting again. Where and when did this take place? With all due respect, I am a tad bit skeptical that this meeting actually took place. Unless you were a part of said meeting and are willing to provide more detail, then there is no proof this even took place unless one of our roving karaoke people stumbles into a Sound Choice dead zone.

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-Chris

And those venues may have used proactive thinking by not allowing obvious litigious threats such as trademarks showing up on TV's. I don't think any one pays bars to be the "Karaoke Kops" and pat down their entertainment before allowing them to set-up. Bars and hosts have a common goal to make some money with the least amount hassle. Ethics and morality is fading but not totally gone yet.

There is NOTHING in the questionnaire that says anything different from what I said--which tells me either that you haven't read the questionnaire or you're intentionally lying about what you read.



You're entitled to your opinion, but not to your own facts.

The fact is that SC uses the information the KJ provides only for the purposes stated and no others. There is no contradiction in the site or anywhere in the program. There is not the slightest hint that SC will disseminate the information provided for any purpose.

If a KJ registers with the site and says "Hey, I use a hard drive and I don't have discs," and when we contact him to work it out, he tells us to (@$%&#!) off, is that guy gonna get sued? You bet.

(Which, by the way, how many people on this site and elsewhere have complained about how we supposedly do nothing to work things out prior to suit? Lots. But here's something that's designed to do just that, and what do you know? The supposedly anti-piracy yet anti-SC crowd finds fault with that, too.)

Lying for the purpose of fearmongering doesn't suit you, Joe.

nice try Chris have HarringtonLaw ask there own ????

Okay, Mr. Harrington. Joe has put the fear into me. Please don't share with anyone that I have 88 SC discs, I play them on a disc player and that I have no SC burns. Who knows what damage this sensitive information would do to me if the venue where I work were to find this out? Well, on second thought don't spread it around because people won't think highly of me for having so few.

@ Mike D: If you can get your hands on one, could you please print a copy of that Safe Harbor letter here? I am curious about how it was worded.

I am just asking for proof or evidence that this all took place.

Btw.....last night there was a 4 hour meeting with 51 (Ha! More than yours!) venues owners and 43 (Ha! Beat you again!) locals hosts. But our meeting only took 15 minutes to realize that we all needed to dump and burn all NuTech related brands. The venues agreed to subsidize the purchase of Sound Choice discs to ensure they had high quality karaoke music at all shows.

The other 3 hours and 45 minutes was spent drinking, doing karaoke, and having a great time.....

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-Chris