Karaoke Forums

Apologies for the previous self-promotion.  Was curious what you thought of this idea that I'm starting at my new karaoke night.  Any ideas you think might be good to add?

OUR THREE TYPES OF SONGS
1. THE GOOD. They made karaoke versions of Pixies and Wall Of Voodoo songs?! Yep. There's plenty of great old soul, Beatles, Ozzy and Who songs on our list too! Sing any of these that you want. They're free. You might disagree about their goodness but you can vote off "good" songs down to the minor leagues.
2. THE BADD. The overplayed. The annoying. The boring ballads. If you want to sing these, you have to pay and we'll donate half of the money to music education charity. If a song is three minutes and 17 seconds, you pay $3.17. Have exact change ready. If you like anything you see here, you can nominate to promote them up to the "good" list on Election Night.
3. THE UGLY. "The Dreaded Ten" are the ten worst, most overplayed songs in karaoke history. Singing any of these songs costs $10.00. Your votes help songs get on the forbidden list alongside Achy Breaky Heart and We Are Family. Every few months, we'll ban one song for the period of time known as FOREVER.

Your nominations are counted and, every three months, we'll have a big ELECTION NIGHT where people can sing, campaign and vote on songs! Our first Election Night will be in March. Come on down and start nominating! Since this is such a new idea, we'll be adding songs all the time (DONATIONS WELCOME)! 1000+ songs is a good start but we're growing and growing and also growing. More details soon!

Alot of those songs that may be overplayed or people may be sick of are sung alot by new 'virgin' singer because they are easy & can make them more comfortable in trying other songs.  You may be potentially pushing a karaoke virgin away  from ever singing if one of those easy songs are banned.  Just a thought.

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I agree with Lonman on this.  A show like that would keep me away.  Why penalize a singer because they want to sing something they are comfortable with or enjoy but has been decided by others to be "bad?"   I like the fact that you plan on donating half the money to music education, but...why not just donate half your tips?

This just feels kind of...unfriendly to me, I guess....

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"I hold the key to an open door....will I ever be free...?"

I like the idea somewhat, but I tend to agree about turning off new singers.

I bet Picture would be in the first five songs to be banned.

My wife came up with "Picture" for us before we had ever gone out to karaoke on purpose!  We got a SuperCore set on special, she saw that song, and immediately thought we should do it. She bought the CD, and we practiced it in the car on a trip. She had exactly no idea that it would be a groaner.

Okay, this idea strikes me as a bad one however, I like it because it is fresh.  Give it a try and see if anyone takes to it.

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Okay, who took my pants?

I'm catering to a way more "indie" crowd than most of you are probably used to (see below for the songs I'm putting on our page to lure music snobs).  Turning the average karaoke enthusiast people away is going to be kind of the point.  It's actually called "Too Cool For Karaoke".  I'm looking for any other really unique/weird/different karaoke nights worldwide to list on our page if anyone knows any!  We're only going to ban a song every 3 months.  I'm guessing "Black Velvet" or "Achy Breaky Heart" will be the one of the first to go.

Ldn by Lily Allen, Oh! Darling by the Beatles, Metro by Berlin, Paranoid by Black Sabbath, Union City Blue by Blondie, Rebel Rebel by David Bowie, Last Goodbye by Jeff Buckley, The Magnificent Seven by the Clash, Watching The Detectives by Elvis Costello, Johnny Are You Queer by Josie Cotton, A Letter To Elise by The Cure, Punk Rock Girl by Dead Milkmen, Whip It by Devo, Chelsea Dagger by The Fratellis, Number Of The Beast by Iron Maiden, Look Sharp by Joe Jackson, Love Will Tear Us Apart by Joy Division, It's Not Easy Being Green by Kermit thee Frog, She Moves In Her Own Way by The Kooks, Destination Unknown by Missing Persons, Supermassive Black Hole by Muse, Don't Look Back In Anger by Oasis, Here Comes Your Man by the Pixies, Candy by Iggy Pop and Kate Pierson, The Bends by Radiohead, Teenage Lobotomy by the Ramones, Golden Touch by Razorlight, Blood Sugar Sex Magik by The Red Hot Chili Peppers, Radio Free Europe by REM, (@$%&#!) by the Rolling Stones, Rock You Like A Hurricane by the Scorps, What Difference Does It Make by the Smiths, Ghost Town by The Specials, Kiss Off by Violent Femmes, Buddy Holly by Weezer, The Kids Are Alright by the Who

dont start "selecting" songs or singers until you have a reliable surplus of singers, Ie you have 30+ singers a night. For at least 10+ nights in a row.

I had a good friend who was a KJ who discouraged some very good singers from attending his shows because SOME of the songs they sang were not the ones he liked.

Eventually he scared away many good singers AND their friends, and had a very small show.

If you end up trying to select away some singers and songs you can end up with an empty room, or only 2-3 singers who like the same songs as you. Eventually even they might go to a bigger crowd.

If you really hate a song that much just dont list it in your book.

The thing about music is that SOMEONE must like the songs if they sing them and they have been made into karaoke.


Sure you may like the pixies, but according to KJ pro, a grand total of 2 songs have been made (possibly a few more by the very small manus). Same for wall of Voodo grand total of 1 song has been made.

If your music taste run to such indie music you pretty much have to spend the time to do vocal removal and sync lyrics to get a reasonable size songlist. For me that adds up to about 30 minutes to do a song and only some work. But then again I have a couple people that love the fact that i have created karaoke versions like Patty Smith's Gloria and Bikini Kill's Rebel Girl, and some Gang Of Four songs as well. I just dont have the time to keep up with the requests. Technically not really legal but I only do it on songs that I have bought the CD, and the songs can not be obtained as a commercial karaoke version.

Even a couple hundred songs that are true "indie" and impossible to find may help attract an audience in a town with a lot of young people.


While I believe a good songlist of 1000 songs may be enough, most people are spoiled by much larger lists. Unless you have a lot of songs they cant sing elsewhere you will have a hard time keeping a crowd with such a list.

By making a blacklist of songs and charging, unless you have very rich patrons, most people just wont sing those songs and go elsewhere. You may be a music purist but you will be in an empty room eventually.

I'm exactly the audience you're looking for with these songs (I've sang quite a few of them at karaoke) and I absolutely can't stand listening to people sing the same old overdone songs week after week after week.

Having said that, I think your idea is terrible.  Nobody should have to pay to sing at karaoke, even if it's for a "good cause".  Word will quickly spread among the karaoke geeks that they have to pay to sing at your shows and that word isn't going to include the fine print about the good, the bad and the ugly.  And the novelty of voting will get real old real fast, especially if they're not voting for anyone to actually win anything.

I've gone to plenty of karaoke shows that are filled with young hipsters.  And these are young LA hipsters, the most annoyingly self appointed cool of them all.  And guess what?  They don't want to sing the cool songs for the most part, they want to do the same cheeseball stuff that the average karaoke enthusiast does.  They'd much rather hear and sing "Love Shack" over "A Letter to Elise" or "Achy Breaky Heart" over "Union City Blue".  Irony trumps alt-rock.

Your core idea (a hipper selection of songs)  is fine, but there's just too many negative aspects in the rest of it and that's what people will focus on and remember. Marketing needs to be positive, not negative.

Having said that, given your taste in music you should definitely check out selectatrack.com if you haven't already.

Yep, I did picture with a gf of mine for a few weeks, when it first came out.  Noone had even heard of the song yet.  It was OUR song, I/we loved it!  It was quickly picked up by everyone that wanted to sing a duet.  If I catch too many people singing a song I like, I quit singing it.  With picture, after hearing 1,057,509 times.....at EVERY show.  Ugh!

MrD

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'Turning the average karaoke enthusiast people away is going to be kind of the point.'  Wow, it's the average enthusiasts that pay our way, I thought. It's good to have that eclectic group around, and to groom and build that kind of a show will be a challenge.

I am in an area of the US where there are karaoke shows every night of the week, sometimes 5-6 shows in the same town. Granted, the level of the hosting varies and most of the shows are what I would describe as 'poor' - no knowledge of sound, no song selection, a drunk host, etc., etc., and they still attract singers. The very good hosts in good locations with all the bells and whistles, meaning great library (with something for everyone), a good working knowledge of live sound reproduction, top notch mics, etc., are the ones who are busiest, once people find them. It can take a while for a reputation to be established (good and bad, sadly) and really all it takes is a handful of those 'indie' kind of singers to get things going, but there will never be enough of those 'above average' karaoke enthusiasts to keep a show really successful. Fact is, there are a lot of 'average' people who enjoy all kinds of music, even the occasional odd 'indie' hit ...

After 10 years of working hard to establish a great reputation, making everyone feel welcome, even the neophyte who only KNOWS the words to "Dreams" by F/M or "Friends in Low Places," the prospect of actually potentially turning away people is just NOT something I would start out to try to do!  Maybe a one-night fundraiser might be fun...  

I guess it depends where you're located ... the singer base in your area (and if you are new to hosting karaoke, just figuring this out will take some time)... and your hosting competition.  

One of the reasons I do not EVER do contests is because they are EXCLUSIONARY. Karaoke is a form of entertainment that I believe should be INCLUSIONARY - the more the merrier...and the greater our longevity!

K

Thanks for the feedback!  There's some stuff that I hadn't really considered.  There are a few places nationwide that just do indie stuff with vocals removed and they've done well.  Live band karaoke seems to draw the crowd of folks that don't like "normal" karaoke & they've done VERY well in lots of cities.  What I'm going to do is somewhere in between.  Hopefully this will have a broad enough appeal to work.  Mixed in with all of the more obscure tunes, there are HUNDREDS of well-known classic rock, soul & rap tunes that you don't have to pay to sing.  I know what you mean about hipsters who'd rather sing Journey than something obscure so there's PLENTY of fun/popular songs that I won't make people pay for. I'm just listing the more obscure ones because if I listed Don't Stop Believin and I Saw Her Standing There, it won't seem unique.  You can't please everyone but these folks love to complain which is why i'm sure they'll love the voting thing.  I can't wait for the "Election Nights" where I've got some local comedian friends who are going to give campaign speeches to save songs or rid our community of others.

I should also mention that I'm not really starting from scratch.  I've been putting together successful cover and music trivia shows and benefits for years under the name Cover Me Badd and my own band is well known 'round town too.  For the folks who've wondered where I live, it's sunny (not today) San Diego.  TONS of "normal" karaoke nights and tons of young folks.  I've got a ton of people who like the tongue-in-cheek themed nights I put together.  Everyone I've told about the paying for "badd" songs loves the idea.  There's no cover at my night and the most popular place in town charges $5.  I'm sure it'll be off-putting to some but part of the reason that a lot of these people don't go to karaoke nights is because they have to sit through a lot of folks singing songs they can't stand without a trace of irony.  I love the way karaoke brings random folks together but it can be pretty trying sometimes, especially if you don't drink, which i don't!

Thanks for the Selectatrack tip.  Someone just recommended them to me.  I thought it'd be cheaper shipping to use mycdg.com and with the $20 Sunfly discs (which I misunderstood until it was in my shopping cart $25 cheaper than expected), it ended up being so cheap (free shipping to boot) that I made 3 mixes last night instead of one.  Pretty excited!  Hopefully i'll have my laptop set up soon enough to go nuts at buykaraokedownloads before our premiere.

Wow...really?  :shock:  I don't know your area, but...as has been mentioned in other posts, your main business is going to be "the average" karaoke enthusiast.  Why turn away business?

If you advertise that you have a large selection of Indie music, you will attract that crowd anyway.  Personally, I will frequent shows that have a lot of showtunes.  These things kind of work themselves out...your selection will attract a certain kind of singer.  Once you have been there and established your show, you will probably get the kind of singers you want for the most part with the occasional "bad" song singer.  That shouldn't ruin your whole evening.  Also, as someone else mentioned, if you REALLY don't want to hear a certain song, just don't put it in your book. *shrug*

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"I hold the key to an open door....will I ever be free...?"

But then also who votes for what is not the norm?  I have songs done nightly - some to naseau levels that probably many people have never heard ie Sneaker Pimps, Rammstein, Poe, for a couple of examples, i'd have to put these in the catagory of overdone songs - yet these are probably the songs you are looking for.  I can tell you, most of the songs listed in this thread, other than Picture & Dreams - NEVER get done at my show.  Achy Breaky Heart hasn't been done in over 4 years here as far as I can remember, never heard We Are Family, rarely get any Beatles except maybe Oh Darlin, Come Together, Across The Universe - Golden Slumbers is starting to become fairly regular lately.  Many of the songs you listed as your prime examples of unique are pretty much regular songs here.  Paranoid, Rebel Rebel, Punk Rock Girl, Whip It, Scorps, Buddy Holly - all of these are pretty much you can hear them sometime during the week sometimes even nightly.  So all of these i'd vote off as being overdone.  I honestly would WELCOME some of the so called overdone songs from other areas - because I don't hear them often.

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I love a fresh new idea to bring people in, but I can't imagine why you'd want to turn away singers for any reason. Most karaoke depends on it's regulars and regulars are your enthusiasts. I would think the type of people who would enjoy this type of thing would be limited and would probably come in for karaoke any way. While your karaoke people who wouldn't like it will go somewhere else. It's a matter of determing if you have enough of the type of people who would enjoy it to keep business lucrative.

I always think it is worth trying out a new idea, but I wouldn't commit to it until you know it is a sure thing. I would be more inclined to do it on scheduled nights. This way you keep both types of crowd.

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I still don't understand the whole paying to make people sing certain songs.  If I don't want to hear someone butcher "Black Velvet" for the umpteeth time, how does knowing you ended up with 10 bucks in your pocket make it any more tolerable for me in the audience?

And I'm still not sold on the voting thing.  If I go out to karaoke it's for karaoke, not to see a comedy routine by some lame comedians.  From the way you describe what you're planning, I can't imagine I'd ever even consider coming back to your show after checking it out once.  I think you're completely off base and way out of touch with the realities of the karaoke audience.

Karaoke by the modern-day fad is where ANYONE can sing ANYTHING they want... not specific shows, specific songs, etc... you want that, call it something other than karaoke. Karaoke related, but NOT for the unwashed masses!

What's funny is I was near Lonnie's show, attended a few times, but some of the songs he said he never heard, were done on a near monthly basis ("We Are Family" for one)... so we were REGIONAL and still had a difference of type shows... then there are some across the country that are different than the ones I ran or attended...

There was a guy on here a few years ago that ran "spotlight" shows on one night, and an hour before his shows... where specific singers/songs were showcased... but again, I felt he shouldn't call those "karaoke" by name, but instead, something else. If folks see "karaoke" they're going to think that anyone can sign up, and can sing anything... not what appeals to a sector.

Hmmm.  More interesting stuff to see.  Again, my target audience is MAINLY people who are "too cool for karaoke", which obviously isn't me because I wouldn't want to host.  I'm sure I'll get some "average" karaoke enthusiasts who really don't care whether or not they hear anything more obscure. They'll find hundreds and hundreds of songs of all different eras and kinds of music they can sing...for free.  If they still want to sing stuff that I think most music snobs won't like, they can donate to a good cause.  If most people don't think they should pay for certain songs, they can vote and shape the night themselves.

The list of songs I posted wasn't meant to be obscure or rarely played, just a good mix of stuff you'll hear at my night.  I think people who don't go to karaoke often assume that there's still people singing "Black Velvet" or "Achy Breaky" nightly.  The voting will help shape the night, for better or worse.  People giving me that kind of feedback will help me know what to buy more of.  Plus people just love to complain and voice their opinions, pro or con.

What I think is kind of silly is that so many people don't think there should be a night that tailors to a certain kind of music.  That's like saying that every band should play ALL kinds of music to appeal to as many people as possible.  If it can be done, then that's great.  Again, live band karaoke night gets people WAY more excited than a typical karaoke night where people mostly sit calmly.  Our night will still be very musically diverse.  99.9% of karaoke nights are MOSTLY people just singing fairly popular songs without any gimmickry and that's fine.  There are plenty of karaoke nights in this big city where they can do the same ol' same ol'. I think this will be a good way to do something different.  I live to drive purists crazy so if folks get mad that what we're doing "isn't really karaoke" then I'll probably giggle a little.....or a lot.

LMMFAO!!  LMAO  LMAO

I don't think anyone is disagreeing with having theme nights once in a while to change things up. It sounded as if you were changing everynight to this and with our experience it isn't a good idea to elliminate singers for any reason. Your crowd may find it fun to do something different once in a while, but not on a regular basis. Like I said before, try it out, but I wouldn't commit to it until you see how it pans out.

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Nothing wrong with one night that tailors to a certain kind of music.  The way I have read what you are saying, however, is that this is how you intend to run your show at all times.

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"I hold the key to an open door....will I ever be free...?"