Karaoke Forums

hey Billy here take one to give to milo too  :hug: loves you both

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

Yes...."Sustain the Note" .......& try to use less vibrato!  :yes:


...When you force vibrato it makes it harder to focus on the story line & emotion of  the song.  

It is more important to sustain notes that need to be carried out a bit longer....And...."As your vocal chords get stronger over time"....vibrato will begin to show up without you even trying to do it.....

"It will be a natural thing that happens....Rather than something that is being forced".


The above....Just my 2 cents...


      Having Billy & Vicki as your coach....." Now thats Awesome"!!!!!

 My little 2 cents worth was just a thought as I was reading through while thinking about my experience while listening to you Steven, and this stuck out in my mind and is the only reason that I felt the need to state the above....."Again"

I would have said it earlier, but I kinda got the impression that I should keep to myself for some reason.....

I will go back to my corner now.....

Cheers

MUCH appreciated !!  Please, when it comes to your opinions of ANYTHING that might improve my singing, there is NO ego here !  I've shelved that..  Please do not feel you should keep anything to yourself,  if my timbre sucks, or is wimpish sounding (like I already feel it is) TELL ME,  also let me know how I might transcend this area... NO EGO... WHATEVER IT TAKES to try to improve BEFORE I start to consider myself "A singer".. If I *can* sing fine, if it's not in the cards for me, I tried AND I'm not worse off than I was November 2007, thing is, I want to try to become a singer, this isn't "Karaoke" for me, it's singing but I respect the Arts, and if I can't do certain things within the arts, it Isn't going to break me, just enable me to appreciate singing THAT much more, now that I've tried it, that's all.. I either stand a chance, or I don't.  It's that simple...

Keep NOTHING to yourself, and I mean that regarding my attempted singing.. The reality is, if I ever become a singer, and I suck... I am a sucky singer..   NOW is the time to find this out !  I do not want to ever get to the point where I start to believe I am able to do something in an area of the arts that I can not do, and as stated, we can't hear ourselves with objectivity, so I rely on TOTAL honesty, blatant also won't hurt me believe it or not regarding an area of the performing arts, I've grown up with it, and get it from my family even-still, however my folks aren't in pop music, so it's a different genre than classical ! So, It's all about OPINIONS on what will work for me from more experienced singers (assuming anything will)..

It's unbelievable that all along I felt I could mimic a song, and sing without "Feeling it" or "listening to the lyrics" yet I have !   Thanks for letting me know this can't be bluffed, I thought I could fake it up until your posts informing me otherwise..  I'm trying to process this now, and actual consider what the lyrics are about, I ENTIRELY took this forgranted !

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I consider many (most actually) in the Showcase to be "singers". In reality most that sub in such a public venue would be those that already Sing.  Therefore I respect most as "singers".  I am just somebody trying to learn to sing, and although I've worked with singers from a VERY different perspective (an outsider following song composition, and knowing some composition theory musically) learning to sing, and actually singing involves MANY characteristics never learned, or visible to me before this.  The application vs the viewing brings with it areas I'm learning from all of you (helpful enough to share your experience), most learn them VERY young singing in chorus, I never did.  Most of these areas of the craft are also not apparent, to those of us that've worked alongside singers never watching for these traits, phrasing, cadence, and melodic flow as well as areas of song composition are crucial to those of us that follow, much becomes a 6th sense as I always felt it to be, but what the singer must "feel" when singing ( because it shows) was always something taken forgranted.. I think the biggest factor I'm finding is that with playing a musical instrument you translate emotion in a more camouflaged manner into areas of the instrument. I can play an instrument wearing a mask (so-to-speak), Yet as a singer, emotion in lyrics is raw emotion, and you can't hide behind the instrument being a "copycat".  I've always in a sense felt the security of hiding behind you "Frontmen".  There's a VERY big psychological difference trying to learn to be a "frontman".

Hope this makes sense,  in some ways the mindset can be diametrically opposed, and what I mean is that although I can be a flambouyant instrumentalist during instrumental breaks, I still have the security if feeling I'm hiding as an accompanist (who's just poking his head out and can soon retreat).. Some of us that became cover musicians, are just musical technicians, We play to sound like Steely Dan, or Boston, and we can "escape" being "us".. I hide when I play bass and guitar, and what I show is acting.

Musical follower vs musical leader..  (I've found a niche in following), and the biggest struggle is learning to "stand out", as opposed to blend, and we all know this is what shows here.. Hiding.

I honestly thought singing others material was about "cloning" or "reproduction", not unlike a playback device.. assuming the goal is to "sing someone elses material"..It's all I've ever known when doing anothers compositions.  "my own emotion" is a tougher thing to integrate than I thought, reason being, I feel exposed.  Is this normal ?

Billy, I now think I understand what you meant when you suggested I "just try to sing a simple song at first".. Meaning "sing it", don't just melodically try to hit the notes ?  Actually feel it ?  Listen to the message ?

By what Vicki stated can I asssume "light and shade" is "contrast" meaning tone ?  or is it more than tone in accordance to story-line ?  Displaying contrast tastefully and poetically ?  See,  This is very new to me.

Btw, I wouldn't know how to read a poem.  That'd be knew to me too.  So this is quite interesting. "Story line"... Just never considered that.

I was thinking of doing
/trying Gilbert O'Sullivans "Alone Again, Naturally", but I think there are a few songs that are just too painful if one enables themselves to "feel the message".  Is this true ?  Are there songs some of you can't and won't sing because to "get into storyline" is too profound, and painful ?  To redo Honey, and actually "feel it" would even be too tough for me.  I need to go search for a song that's a little less profound, or something that "lyrically" I can somewhat Identify with. That's a good start..  Figured "Behind Blue Eyes" would be good, but that's likely too tough at this point.

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

of course that is true steven. I cannot get right thru he aint heavy. The song suits the timbre of my voice but it was the song used by police here in NZ when they advertised community policing etc back in the 80s, My brother was a police dog handler in the 80s...he committed suicide. Even this far down the track I cannot sing that song right through, for both the association to his occupation and the fact that the lyrics hit home.

light and shade hmmm well billy has it, but the most amazing example of it is (and you will probably hate listening to it cos its old) is Bing Crosby. His story telling is exquisite and of course we all know his ability with song.

Lets hope you tube has an example of the happy prince...listen REALLY listen to how he tells the story...or get an old movie of his out

if all else fails listen to the duet of him and Bowie doing little drummer boy and you can hear the light and shade in both speaking and singing.

Bing Crosby is the most influential person in my life. As a tiny little child I recall listening to the sunday request session in bed and listening to the happy prince...it occurred to this little girl that I wanted a story telling voice like his. From that thought grew my desire to be on radio

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

this is a great example of two people famous for the light n shade in their voices...DM especially makes the most out of his drunken story-telling...what he sings can be taken different ways by a simple catch in the voice and a roll of the eyes.

These are great examples of "light & shade"

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

He's HUGE,  can't argue with huge in the industry.   I'll check out you tube to find examples of him Vicki.  I remember so little about him offhand to be honest, except prior to Elvis and the Everly Bros, (and soon after the British Invasion) he was the biggest name in the industry, and a HUGE seller.  I know enough to know how influential he's been.  A MASSIVE name in music.  Yet since my parents weren't much into that style music, I didn't have exposure as a youngster.. It was classical in my home at that time, not popular.

Most of the Balladeers were story-tellers, JT being a big one, Harry Chapin being another, how and why I took forgranted storyline and emotion eludes me, yet I did.. Probably because of my own limited perspective.

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I am off curtain hunting so will be gone most of the day

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

Please give any and ALL feedback on Every Rose Has Its Thorn.
Don't be gentle. Give it to me straight or don't bother!
That said, some info about this sub. It's my first sub, so more-or-less just experimenting to see how to upload, etc. So apologies for the sound quality and mix. Didn't bother with more than one take or equipment or effects for this. Used a web cam for the mic. Yuck

The critique I'm after is on the singing, not the hardware and user. Am I on key at least 90% of the time? Is it at least mildly entertaining? Etc.

Thanks in advance for being honest

honestly? If I had the confidence in my ability to have sung as well as that with a naff webcam mic and no efx, then I would give up my day job...nice tone Randy!!

I havent responded on your sub yet and wont tonite as I need to sleep and havent got the time to listen to everyone. Monday tomorrow here of course.
Time to get yourself a little recording setup at home sir...a mixer and a nice little recording prog. Look forward to hearing more from you.

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

Giving it to you straight.....  :yes:

Other than Quality of the Mix & Not using any effects......

(Q)...Is it at least mildly entertaining? (Answer).... Yes!!!  

(Q)...Am I on key at least 90% of the time? (Answer).... Yes!!!


With that being said...."You must realize that it is only my opinion"

With better Mixing...&..proper effects...& Quality of effects & proper amount of
effects meaning... Not too much or Too Little...."everything being balanced"!!!  
The recording would be much more enjoyable....But You know that already!!!

As far as your singing!!! .....with "DRY VOCALS" .....

...You have a better Vocal sound than I have heard from singers...who are PRO's!!!!

Listen to this guy on the link below.....Remember he is...."A PRO"!!!!!

Here is the link....You be the Judge!!  Can you sing better than this??

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=n2EkE-WFU ... re=related

"SOME PEOPLE"... Cannot Sing"... without there Vocal Fx!!!!!

You Sir...."Randy"...You Can Sing!!!!!  :biggrinthumb:


My Suggestion.....Your phrasing sounds a bit choppy, but maybe thats just your way of trying to make it your own.   I would suggest that you let it flow a bit smoother or ....Less choppy....is the only way I know how to describe what I am trying to say.   Other than that....I think you done just fine.

"As far as the Video example above goes".....Anyone who has ever recorded in a studio where the singer is in a sound proof booth...knows how they sound without there Vocal effects!!... and it can be very similar to that Video example!!!

That is why for myself....I MUST HAVE MY VOCAL FX!!!!

Neo,

thanks for the critique! The choppy phrasing is how the original artist did it. I may try it again someday with my own smooth phrasing. Thanks for the suggestion!

Vicki,

thanks for the kind words!

I've been a live performer (karaoke venue) for almost 2 years so the ability to do my own mix, effects, and multiple takes is foreign to me. I think I'm gonna like it.

Thanks for the reminder that my Mac comes with Garageband. I always assumed it was strictly for instruments. Guess I forgot about the instrument in my throat.

Been playing with Garageband...Very cool. I can drag the karaoke files to it and then add my singing track. Then mix the tracks, or add effects to just the singing, it even adds the karaoke graphics in its own track and displays in a little window while I'm recording my singing.

Haven't figured out if it does pitch-bending, which I need for most male pop and rock songs (can't hit the high notes, no comment on how deep I can go  L O L  )  But my karaoke software can export pitch-bent MP3 so all I need now is a good mic

well dude you can troll the tech forums for examples of mics that folks use. Just get yer butt subbing cos you sound great

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

Singer: Me
Song Fooled Around and Fell in Love
Artist:  Elvin Bishop


Yes, I know, I know, "Kappy, why are you attempting songs that few that know how to sing will even attempt to undertake?", you ask.

Well,  Dunno     I suppose it's all part of the wannabe complex.  In all seriousness however, loved this song when it came on pop radio 1976, and at that time said to myself,  "When I grow up, I want to sing like this guy"..  Which is exactly what I am still saying "When I grow up, I want to sing like this guy"

Tough song,  brutal song, poorly done, BUT... I'm proud of it

http://www.singsnap.com/snap/watchandli ... y/b0dbe7a1

(Which confirms what I've stated all along, I can't hear myself, nor do I have a clue. BUT, this was one of the better mishaps), I can honestly rank this a 3.5 !!!   I'm getting there !!

Well with the exception of the yelling higher range following the guitar break, see, that wasn't me..  A neighbors cat got it's tail stepped on and it jammed out my great singing unfortuneately!

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

kapster I couldnt hear you the music overpowered apart from "since I metcha baby" that had me reaching for clean underwear  LMAO

if I may pm?

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

Yeah, neighbors cat... Ruined my perfect recording ~

I just had to attempt this song, and attempt it, and attempt it.  I don't know WHY I attempt these songs, besides the fact that I like them and I suppose I am trying to break the tedium of just doing songs within the baritone range (by mixing in some of my classic favorites).  The fact that I'm unable to hear myself also contributes to some of these major horrid songs,  I try to transform into these original singers, I just don't understand that I'm not a Chamelion, and I'm having the darndest time respecting my LIMITATIONS, and staying within the confines of what might work..I'm REALLY having a tough time breaking away from my "cover habit", and since I can't hear myself I can imagine that much of what I think I'm doing is abominable. ..  

One thing I did notice however, is that when I sing louder I sound less like Elvin Bishop   (Now naturally that'd be an indication to MOST people that they ARE NOT Elvin Bishop,  but me ?  Well, I'm dense, or still need to learn to HEAR MYSELF)

WOW,  our hearing can be select in this area too, I can only either hear that which I know and like, or hear what sounds awful, but I can't hear me, I haven't a clue yet,  Thanks much Vicki !

Yeah,  some of this was gawd awful.  Maybe I should call it a parody  LOL

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Singer:   not yet
Song:  San Fransico-   Ribbon in your hair
Scott McKenzie





Opinions please:   Can my voice work on this type song.  I am aware this is quite rough,  it's a second take.

Dynamics are off because of higher reverberation levels, and while standing I've been tensing up and moving the microphone (handheld) VERY unevenly either too close or too far from my mouth causing awful dynamics, Yes it is pitchy, just a second take, BUT before I put effort into it this,  I'd like to know if it has potential, I didn't want to go all out and push, in the event it's a lost cause, yet I can do this in real voice.. Should I attempt it ?   If not, that's fine too.. I can't tell what does and does not work, as I've stated numerous times, so I haven't a clue if this should be worked on or scrapped

I know reverberation isn't well balanced
I know the volume changes and is VERY uneven..

Just wish to know if my voice might suit this song assuming I put a little more effort into it ?

http://www.singsnap.com/snap/watchandli ... y/bcf32641

.

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

my opinion is yes your voice will be well suited to this song. once the issues you have mentioned of levels etc are worked thru. Mic is a bit hot...bit of feed back

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

Thanks Vicki,  Here's why..

Bass cut on Alesis to roughly 1 or 2,  treble boosted to 9, mids around 7, gain around 7, FX (29 I think but on the heavy side), clip light ocassionally reading red, singing LOUD into microphone anywhere from 2 feet to 3 inches from mouth depending on involuntary muscular action and tension worrying about hitting notes while eyeballs protrude from skull...

Not using headphones so in order to get audible sound from computer speakers, it's a very hot setting as you stated, and a very trebly setting with reverberation.

BUT,  I got a timbre almost

Dang,  I'm such a Diva  :(   Unfortuneately I believe that if something sounds nearly acceptable, there's a stunt involved someplace.  Wait til a sub my Macy Gray stuff !

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".