Karaoke Forums

Why is it that the "majority" here seem to be inferior no matter how you look at it. I am new here but I get a bad taste left in my mouth after reading so may posts and replies here when so many people here contidict the actual statements they make by being the ones who put down or disregard others for being individual???

Everyone is entitles to their opinions in general, but when it starts being directed against others I think thats when it has crossed the line. There is no need to "put down the lame dog" so to speak, or talk bad about anyone because they are pompass or self-rightious.

I think there are a few others here on this site that are so full of themselves I wont name names, but its obvious when all that comes from them is directed negitive comments against other KJ's or others in general. Why not talk about how bad a speaker is, but not the host for the decision to use it. Or lets talk about getting the manufacturing companies to start producing better music, not the host for actually wasting their money purchasing it.

I mean it is rather disgusting to read all the contridictions here, and realize that people are not coming together here rather biting eachothers noses off because someone does not like a point of view, then the comments directed after that are personal and to obviously be at hurtful intent.

What ever happened to "if you dont have anything nice to say dont say anything at all???

As for those individuals that complain about every other host and how bad they are, and how bad the music is, and how bad their equipment is ect. ect. ect... have you actually ever talked to those people and gave them your comments personally? Have you ever made suggestions to them about what might make them better? Have you ever given the time of day to maybe consider there is more to it than just "your" opinion???

Because in my opinion unless you have then you need to poitely shut your mouth and quit trash talking other hosts.

And the reason why you have not is because you "are" threatened by them, and why make them better than you? Why give them the edge, obviously they are doing something better than you, and to just give them more would be a career suicide for you... right??? Get over yourself.

This industry is a family no matter what, its like having cousins you hate, or that really annoying uncle that you just cant stand... or the sister that wont quit stealing your shoes and make-up. No matter what they wont go away you just need to get use to it, or accept that there are other out there you cant stand. Dont make yourself look bad because you cant help yourself but comment in a derogitory manner.
This forum should e a place to help others not criticize them and chastize them because they are not as "perfect" as you.
(ha ha ha!)
So why dont everyone really find something better to complain about rather than another person here, or other hosts, or things that you dont like.
Better yet, go open a forum for just that. Karaoke KJ Haters Corner!
Anyone who wants to be hurtful and hainus can go there.

Sorry if anyone disagrees with me, its just I have only been reading posts here a short while, and joined recently and I am dumbfounded by a great deal of this and rather saddened by the mentality that has gone along with it.

General statements here.

Have you ever been undercut by another KJ to steal your job?

Have you ever seen KJs handing out their business cards and calenders at your show.

Have you ever found out another KJ was telling other bar owners you charge $100 more than you actually do, so they wouldn't call you?

Does Sears help Target?

Pepsi help Coke?

Your idea sounds good, (Karaoke Union, or Association, or Alliance) but in the real world, it is dog eat dog.     Karaoke is cut throat.    Only the strong survive.

You sound like you have good intentions and you are actually trying to be a good KJ.    But most of the KJs i know couldn't care about anything but making a buck as cheap as possible.     Cheap meaning their equipment and cheap meaning they charge half of what i do just to get a job.    This ruins the top price good KJs can get.     You should have seen this in the last 10 years.  

I have had KJs back stab, front stab and side stab me, every way possible.    Do i have a bad taste in my mouth?   It's just like any other business, the good survive and the bad ones die.    If you choose to compete with the rest of the KJs, it takes money, lots of it.   It take good business sense.   I have helped and been helped over the years.     I have replaced many a bad KJ.    I have been stabbed repeatedly, from jealous "KJs."    

I am not affraid of any of my competition.    But if they can't figure out how to be good and competitive business people and do everything needed to do that,  I'M NOT HELPING THEM.

They all want the business i have, but they don't want to buy and learn what's really necessary.   They think there is an easy, cheap way to get here.   Should i just tell them stay home and i'll split my money with you?

kjmelrose, welcome to KS and may I compliment you on your post. You raise some very valid points. I believe we all tend to forget the impression newbies gain when there is so much inhouse bickering.

Hope you find a reason to stick around

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"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

The thing is this, Yes, I have been personally attacked, I have had many many bad things happen to me over the years, and in regards to "Only the strong survive" that may true in many cases, but in these circumstances it comes down to a lot more than just how much you spend.

Comment: As long as the bar is seeing the revenue that they would like to see, they dont care about the show

Reponse: Bar owners I know have actually said, "The karaoke is good they have a great set up we just dont like them, if you know someone you think could work out here let us know" So really this was about hosts that had a great setup, it was the negitive attitude and the constant talking themselves up that the Owners did not like, and they ended up being replaced.

As far as other issues with being underbid, or other hosts coming to your shows... it happens all the time, and the loyalty of people we have shines each time. People will go where we go, I am not afraid of that, and you know thre are those hosts out there that are just like that. Then you have the ones that no one cares about but you never know what may happen...

I started hosting for $20 a night when I worked for my first boss... that was over 10 years ago. My second boss let me go because people were requesting me instead of her and she got upset by that and let me go. (I think she should have been appreciative of that not upset) My third boss that I worked for, was fair and taught me a lot of things, and basically handed it all over to me. I was never paid what it was worth to be running his business, but I made the best of it for 6 years. My pay when I left him was only $75 a night we were charging $300, and I did all the work, and hauled and set up and booked the gigs and got contracts. So you see why I started my own business.

I have been more than fair in charging the same rates if not even a little higher, and as for the underbidding, heck yes it happens here all the time, my rates are not cheap, I am not the most expensive, but far most not the least eaither. There is a couple who own a karaoke store and do KJ they underbid all the time and they underbid to the point it makes everyone wonder why they even do it to begin with.
But eventually they dont stick anywhere for any term. They actually told me they were "helping out" this one bar and only taking what they could afford to give them, and there were nights they were lucky if they even made $40! Now exactly, why would that place ever hire anyone who charges $200 or more a night if they can get away with paying someone nothin???

Well, I have seen a lot of what you talk about, and I agree with what you say to an extent. The only thing is, I will always offer my advice or suggestions to anyone that asks. I am not worried about it. I may be able to give suggestions that actually make a difference. God knows if I need help I ask.

Well, I have been burned, but I will always remain optimistic about things and people. I do feel sorry for others that feel its necessary to try and run me down. I work too hard at building my business up to allow anyone to bring me down. And like I said I dont have a computer based system, I still run everything off CDG, and I am not so sure I want to get into the computer based system thing as of yet. There are investigations beginning here in washington soon and I want no part of it. Until I know if people are getting busted for using them, I wont do that to myself. Its too big of an investment for me right now to have it all taken and used for evidence.
Not to mention the fact that there are plenty of people reportedly not paying for music but downloading it from online, or ripping it onto their HD off of cdg's, which I was infromed is what some of this is all about.

So my issue is this, why would I spend another $10,000-20,000 and let someone just come take it for no reason? It would put me out of business, completely.

And I dont steal music which makes it very hard for me to stay up with the newest possible selections. I pay for my disks each one at a time, and when you do this on a fixed income it is rather hard.

My intention is to not create a debate over what is right or wrong, because your way works for you, and you have been sucessful, thats great. I am sucessful too, but it takes time to upgrade so to speak from the  Atari to the XBox, in my case.

I dont have poor equipment, and I dont have bad music, I am just not up to date like everyone else that looks down on me. Therefor, in their oppinion I am not that great. And thats okay, they may have the best system, but they lack obvious self respect when it comes to trashing other hosts because they feel there is a reason to downgrade anyone else that is not them.
(Referencing comments I have heard other hosts say about me)

The truth is, no one can really have anything bad to say about me, I dont do anything that is of bad character, and certainly not against anything I believe in, I host karaoke I am not a rockstar, I am not the star of the show, I am not trying to set a karaoke standard for anyone else to follow. I am simply giving people the opportunity to have a good time, enjoy their friends, enjoy singing and I make it fun for them. Not a whole lot to it. I want nothing more out of it than to be able to make money doing what I love, and for some thats not why they do it at all.

I could write all day about this, but really I dont have bad things to say about others unless I am telling them to politely "shut up". I dont like hearing bad things about other people no matter if I like them as people or not, I dont like hearing the trash talk no matter what. It does not mean that I dont get upset and a little hot under the collar. But what right do I have to turn around and do as they do?
What would that make me?
And why would I lower myself to anyone elses level and try and make everyone else look bad?

As I said before those people are seen for what they really are and in time they will burn their own bridges, it doesnt matter how much money anyone has spent. It is all about integrity and honesty.

(breath) so I guess I should end this now and see what this opens, I personally think that for every one bad thing you say about someone, there can be two more said about you. (refering to anyone)

Melrose

crikey  :shock:

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"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

[font=Verdana] I am new here myself, and must say I have been bothered by negative posting, but it seems you find that on any forum.  It's easier to be nasty when people can't see your face. Having read through this thread, all I can say is Negative people can't help thinking and acting in a negative way!.  For 3 years my granddaughter showed equestrian in 4H.  I was at many of her shows and was always impressed by the positive helpful attitude and sportsmanship of these kids.  They never worried about giving each other pointers, lending equipment, etc , though the very same people they were helping were the ones they were competing with.   The reason I keep coming back and participating is the fact that I have learned a lot from the positive, helpful people that are on this forum. As my Mama used to say, "you have to take the good with the bad."[/font]

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Dusty Rose
Blue Rose Classic Karaoke
More Sound! More Selections! More Fun!
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when you get tired of sidewinder's rhetoric, THEN come back and speak with experience.

Always cracks me up to see the newbies doing the loudest complaining.

For the record, WELCOME aboard to the newbies.

Families fight all the time to alleviate stress and SOME in-house fighting and bickering here is actually "comical" to some,... like when someone posts in a drunken state (won't mention who ) or feels the need tell someone their posts are pompous.

It's true we sometimes lose sight of manners and it can get "a bit old" for some to read, but it usually rebounds and things AND people actually get "to know each other" better and start accepting the people for the ways they are.

In other words, the TRUTH comes out , good OR bad, and over time you feel-out the real persons' personality.

Being NEW...well my opinion is you gotta EARN the RESPECT to speak-out against the forum as a whole, not come in and play Dr. Phil. No offense. but there are hundreds of members and alot of them have been here for MANY YEARS so what has been established is the way it is. The MODs are perfectly capable and knowledgeable about the goings-on here and they will usually speak to members by PM- so as NOT publicly humiliate a problem-person.

I see the desire for new people to come in and expect a happy family and everyone getting along famously, but people don't share the same opinions about nearly everything, because of different experience, backgrounds, locations, preferences, etc....but i agree we all should read Miss Manners and behave !
Problem with that is a lot of people post AFTER a show when they might be tired, aggrivated by customers or worse, bar managers...or the undercutter down the street. Or a member's post strikes a sour chord with you-

At least you seem to have Vicki (Morgan LaFey) agreeing with you..i think. She's well respected here and been here awhile.

Me? I'm fairly new and have added to the bickering lately..
Sidewinder's Fault!  Kidding. I just couldn't keep my mouth shut after months of reading his pompous posts. Perhaps he will "get to you" one day Melrose and you will will decide not to say anything nice, but WILL say something unbecoming of yourself. Never say Never to anything i've learned.

I do give SW credit for appearing to "play nicer" with his posts lately. He is fairly intelligent but has this need to be right. No one is right all the time. Life 101.

I see a lot of Steven's style post these days.

Well said JR


And welcome to our "newbie"

You will find posers, braggers, bullies, inebriated posters...

You will also find KJs who are in here to talk shop, find out from each other what's working and what's not, and give (and ask for) advice.

Welcome to the forum!  Very much like all public forums. A hang-out for all types.

What you get from it is what you make of it. Exactly where you fit in all this is uncertain right now. You seem to have a number of issues to deal with right off the top. And more than one axe to grind.

Melrose: Read Bill H's post several more times. Very, very true.

I will add this: Each of us has come from a different position. Some quietly go about their work; others, when asked, will respond honestly if not always succinctly; others will feel a need to respond to that response. Forums are not vanilla pudding by any means. It is unrealistic to expect, the same way you would not if you walked into a room full of strangers, that everyone would be polite, considerate, respectful, and restrained. It just won't happen in a room full of strangers, the same way it won't happen here.

When I get on here and seem to be "criticizing" another show, it is with this intent: Hosts and singers come here for advice and suggestions, and sometimes just to crack a joke, or reestablish forum friendships.

If I go to a show and see room for improvement in an area, I will mention it. For example, too much time between singers...or equipment that isn't being utilized to its greatest potential...or a drunk host. These are not criticisms just for the sake of criticizing. These are things that detract from a show, and are aimed at people who may be just beginning to host, or maybe are even just contemplating getting into the business.

It would be great if we could all visit each others' shows and see how many different ways there are to do this; however,  there is a standard that most maintain in the hopes of returning karaoke to its previous glory days, when we all got paid what we were worth as far as investment and talent.  Who knows? We may all be dreaming, but I will never stop trying to make it better in whatever way I can.  

If I go to a new show and singers there recognize me (there is a good possibility of this happening since I have been in the biz for 12 years, in about a 25-square-mile area), they will often introduce me to the host. Sometimes that new host will ask my opinion about their show. The last thing I want to do is just say what I think they want to hear, to keep their feelings from being bruised. Most of us learned this biz through trial and error - maybe starting with a stage career or a singing career, or just from being a karaoke singer...however we started, we all have honed our skills to where we feel comfortable in making suggestions to others. I am more than willing to accept suggestions from other hosts - it hasn't happened yet but I am ever hopeful!

Enjoy reading the threads - and like any other forum, read with thick skin. All of us eventually bare our characters through the words we write here, and you will find some you may establish a virtual kinship with; others will rub you the wrong way. There is nothing wrong with that, just like in real life.

Welcome. Looking forward to more of your posts.

k

Many good observations here. Would like to make some more I too have been guilty of inebriated posts here but my over reaction was not from topics here. I might have just came from the discussion board on the web site of the local newspaper both letters to the editor and soapboxes. As more and more radicals liberal conservative whatever find discussion boards or forums they flood them with radical views which they expect everybody to accept and live by. It is useless to try to reason with, discuss solutions, argue with, reach a middle ground or ultimately come up with anything that promotes or helps our business or impression to the general public.

As one who has been in many professional vocations it is apparent to me  that 90% here have never been a board or business meeting and discussed ways to improve the business. Many strike me as karaoke fanatics who have a very well defined set of rules which they want to apply to every karaoke business in the world They have a very closed mind and mutual discussion or any opinion not resembling theirs is totally unacceptable. The overall ambience of certain posters show or hint of inexperience, ignorance, megomania at the least and an attitude whic most have that live in a bubble.



I recently made a post about attracting crowds and certain formulas for becoming a professional KJ or DJ. These concepts are so different than their limited radical thoughts that they dont even comprehend them. Over the years as a TV repairman we got our shops to form an alliance and quit dogeating When we did the business gained and everybody started making a profit. How many shade tree auto mechanics do you know? Professionals understand and attract each other and unite to evolve their profession into what it can become.

I personally welcome the new blood here Lets get off this legal illegal crap and this is the only way to do it and start discussing ways to get rid of the negative attitude or general impressions that the public has about our profession. Lets have a meeting of the minds and make some positive strides. Others might be stagnant or stalemated here but I will guarantee you this old man aint.

90% dont know wat's happenig on.. 9% know but don't care..the remaining 1 % are making it happen

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Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!

Well, since they own a Karaoke store, they're probably doing their shows so cheap, so that they can plug their business at the shows and get new/more customers.

errr yep in fact I am wavering and wondering if I should retract my initial statement...melrose should perhaps have sat back and left that statement stand as a thought provoker. he/she has since shot her/himself in the foot by falling into the same trap as so many others do...using the forum to unburdon themselves.
Melrose please take my advice. Forums are like any other communities. 1. It takes time to fit in. 2. until you have developed relationships with your neighbours, no-one could give a toss about your private history.

jreynolds I thank you sir for the kind words they are much appreciated  :hug:

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"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

. Truth is I have been spending so much time agonizing over learning how to sing, I seldom post anymore.

But it's true regarding the fighting .  After I was struck in the Karaoke Scene lounge last month by stray bullets during that nasty drive-by shooting episode , and knifed  four times while reading posts in the Singers forum, I decided this place wasn't safe anymore so I went on the road and became famous.

Funny how sometimes a catastrophe can truly be a blessing in disguise. OK, back to trying to figure out if "Sounds of Silence" must be song all in chest voice, or whether or not it's OK to falsetto the upper notes..

Btw, Is Phill still planning on getting metal detectors at the front gates of the site ? I think MANY would feel MUCH more secure when those arrive.

Btw, not my style Jian, I construct my sentences more carefully, use more sophisticated adjectives, and spell pompass "pompous", and of course currently have no complaints about KS.. Yet was told my name has come up here  Seriously


OK, NOW my feelings are hurt !  How can you think this was me ? I am FAR superior <grinning> !  HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Seriously though,  I'm not a KJ in Washington and while it's tough to objectively detect my own posting style, IMO (outside of her posts being long posts) there aren't too many similarities. We both tend to separate paragraphs however.I only have one identity in here.  Can you imagine (given my post count) if I had aliases in here ?  People would wonder if I have a life.  The fact that I don't is moot, they'd still wonder !  Chances are quite high that during some of the OP's posts in here, I have an alibi, likely singing in a different site, or posting on it's singing threads (that's where I was ALL day yesterday)  and I'll bet that can be easily determined.

That aside, need some coffee, sore throat



Kappy <---- would've used *denigrate* instead. You folks should know all this by now !
                   You should be ashamed of yourselves !    LMAO

Seriously though, Don't I tend to use many more commas within my sentences too ?



and what am I ?  Chopped liver ?   OK, no need to answer !  LOL

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Speaking of chopped liver.  I now have roughly half an octave of extended upper singing range !  Things are starting to happen (not sure what, but they are none-the-less)

KJMelrose-  don't mind me. I am a sarcastic a@@hole, and I'm damn proud of it too !  Anyway, yep, there is bickering and condescension among many on this site, because the regulars are a group that have gotten to know one-another and like to play "Pin the Tail on the Donkey".  Since I've gone elsewhere for awhile, The pinholes on my (@$%&#!) have since healed, and I can finally sit while typing. Now I spend time singing elsewhere, and the difference there is,  they are trying to use me as a Pinjata and knock my teeth out, however in this case, I can't blame them... That aside in ANY site where a core group has bonded over around a 6 year time period,  there's going to be a pecking order. It's the e-nature of the beast.

You folks know I don't get into "KJ" related banter regarding wages, or KJ aspects. If I were to reappear, I'd not have a "KJ" prefix before my name. That not my style.. I'd go for a witty type SN.  :handshake:   Anyway, with the exception of the "Kappy" thread, I've not been active here lately. I've really been trying to do this singing thang doncha know

There's one thing I DO find wrong however (when glancing the bboards here).

Seriously,  I KNOW some folks here can't stand Sidewinder, and despite the fact some of us do get along with Sidewinder -CLEARLY, the treatment he has been receiving (meaning the overt and relentless attacks directed at him, as well as threads started targeting him) while knowing if he were to defend himself he'd be thrown out've Karaoke Scene in a heartbeat, well, it's wrong. Where's the balance and why the ongoing attacks ? Because you don't like him and think he should divulge location ?  That's personal, but not TOS.  Sidewinder now has three warning stars, but he's not defended himself or targeted anybody with ad hom attacks ONCE. Folks find him annoying and obnoxious, I know, yet annoying posting style isn't a TOS.  Threads started attacking him are clearly wrong, coupled with the current imbalance slanted against him noticeably attempting to set him up. It's blatant bullying. HE'S the only individual accumulating warning stars, while his arms are bound not allowing him to fend off punches that come at him on a continuous basis .  

JMO.  I'd be a dishonest insincere jackass with no ethical makeup assuming I didn't state what I feel in this particular case.  Isn't it time to at least let up on the guy ?

Seriously, I have no clue who the OP of this particular thread is.

OK,  now back to hurting the ears of living things with my lovely voice

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

My post was not directed at any one particular person or in the defense of anyone in particular, only my observation of a community that I felt should be about helping others not tearing them down.

I came here because I honestly thought that there might be others here who can share experiences, and possibly give feedback, or even helpful advice, but not without doing the whole me me me thing, because I can say I have seen hosts out there who arent that great and I have seen hosts that are phenominal!

The point is this, there is not one person here who can claim to be the best, there will always be someone better. But that is why I came here to learn from others who may have other views, or even be able to give suggestions on changing things to make them work better.

All I read for several days was hurtful remarks, aqusations, and meaningless stabs against others, and sure some of the things here are completely annoying, I dont discredit that at all. But its obvious for whatever reasons, everyone is here for one thing... right???

And sure friendships or other here are great and welcomed, I would only hope that instead of being negitive and saying everything thats bad, why dont people give suggestions from experience to make things better.

If I had a really poorly sounding system, well then instead of another person stating how bad it was or saying how improperly I use it, approach me and tell me what you would suggest doing instead, the advice will go longer ways than the opposite, and instead making you look like a complete a**.

Thats all...

Take it how you want to, and if you are upset by my post then maybe you should consider evaluating why. Did it hit a sore subject with you. Like what was stated, Truth comes out here, and that was my observation. It was not meant to be offensive just a way to maybe sooth whatever pains were going on here, its obvious that there are hated people here, and its obvious that there are the ones who seem to think that being an a**hole is the way to be. Fine.

I am not an a**hole, and if anything only seeking others who are not negitive but helpful.

oh and cheers!

It's genetic. Some consider it a knack. I prefer the term nuance-specific. Never worked at it, honestly !  I'm a natural.  Wish singing came this easily



All kidding aside KJmelrose.  I agree with you insofar as nobody should tell you "Your equipment sucks",  or mock anything about you because that certainly is not constructive.  Also, assuming you like your equipment,  people don't join these sites to end up discouraged.   Your points (at least in my opinion) are valid. Unfortunately there's a tendency when regs on a site get to know one-another after perhaps 6 years (chatting for a few hours at a time several times a week) they do at times become less tolerant of others usually forgetting how they felt as newbies on the site.  It's how things seem to be all over internet land, folks often depersonalize others they don't know forgetting that they too are human. Not saying it's right, it just seems to be prevailing behaviour in all but the heavily moderated sites.

My other rant here is just how some friends know me in here when I drop in (as a nutcase clown with ADHD). Since I was informed my name came up, I had to drop in and do my song and dance.  With the exception of my paragraph pertaining to "one individual I get along with in here" (being attacked IMO), the rest of my content was of course just making my currently less frequent appearance and letting loose (not unlike a loud fart in a sunday church service,) but hey, that's just the type of person I am.

So, my playing around is not in anyway a reflection as to whether or on not I believe your content has merit, your content does have merit.  That aside,  while your points are valid, as a new person you might wish to let what you've stated stand,  rather than get too absorbed with the negative behaviour, because not all are negative here, but it's good you called it as you see it rather than just quit.  You've made your point, and I'm sure many agree with you.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".