|
View unanswered posts | View active topics
Author |
Message |
lordairgtar
|
Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 8:40 pm |
|
|
Super Poster |
|
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 8:50 pm Posts: 992 Location: Muskego, Wisconsin Been Liked: 0 time
|
http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/d ... id_he.html
Read this link, dumbdrums. According to how the planes were situated on deck, the tails of the planes were facing off the side. No way could a wet start (even if he could) have caused that, plus the Pratt and Whitney engine of the A-4 was single stage which CANNOT be wet started. The P & W engine has no after burner. The only thing one could say about McCain is he broke a lot of expensive planes. The sites that say he did start the fire are "swiftboating at its best".
|
|
Top |
|
|
MorganLeFey
|
Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 9:17 pm |
|
|
Extreme Plus Poster |
|
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 3:26 am Posts: 7441 Location: New Zealand Been Liked: 8 times
|
ericlater @ Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:24 am wrote: My Sheree,
Good questions about associations of McCains. I'd love to hear more about the people he associates with whose character you believe should be questioned. The only reference you made that I am really familiar with is Liddy. I do know Gordon Liddy was a burglar, and did time in jail for his crime. So, I guess you can say that he did the crime and paid his time.
Now, I don't know if it there is any significance to the fact, you say, that Liddy referred to John McCain as "his old friend"? I know McCain is old, but does he refer to Liddy as "my friend"? And doesn't John McCain refer to everyone as "my friends"
As to who is contributing, including G. Liddy, to the campaigns of each candidate, I don't think the average voter could handle the facts. They have no idea as to of all of the dubious people and dubious organizations that make political contributions to campaigns every election cycle. What do you think the purpose is for an organization tot contribute to opposing campaigns, simultaneously? If we could all easily retrieve donor records to assist in selecting who to vote for, we'd finally come to the correct decision ---- "NONE OF THE ABOVE"! That's why I believe we should only allow the idle rich, the independently wealthy, people with no financial ambitions and only the public's best interest at heart to run for office!
Lastly, I'd like to believe that at this juncture, we've heard about each and every dubious relationship either candidate has been in. But I'm willing to be made aware of any substative inappropriate relationship - one that strikes at the judgment and/or honesty of the candidate!
And maybe there is something "there" regarding John McCain's relationship with Liddy, but I don't see any basis to parallel that relationship with Obama's relationship with Ayers.
see I am not that forgiving...no-one should have the right to hold office if they have a criminal record and those that associate freely with criminals should be a tad more circumspect if they hold office
Nz goes to the polls in just a few weeks...I would simply like to vote no confidence...neither of our major political parties and the candidates that lead them could lie straight in bed. They lie through their teeth to get your vote then shelve any plans they spouted forth during their campaign till 3 months out from the next election in 3 years time. They have done it before, they will do it again.
what bugs me is why dont we do performance evaluations regularly on the people we have voted into office and are supposed to have our best interests at heart
_________________ "Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."
|
|
Top |
|
|
Babs
|
Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2008 11:40 pm |
|
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2005 11:37 am Posts: 7979 Location: Suburbs Been Liked: 0 time
|
ml_texas @ Tue Oct 21, 2008 4:51 pm wrote: lol Matt! Gezz! I had no idea I was writing so much. I would crucify one of my students for that! I was just typing and stopping to deal with students and not paying any attention to the fact that I did not use paragraphs! That is disgusting! Sorry folks! Even the teacher makes a few mistakes along the way! --Mike Babs, That is really strange about Blue Cross Blue Shield. We use the same company for our insurance and I have great meds coverage. My generic is only $5.00 and increases slightly from there. There are some plans available if you do a google search that offers some decent meds. policys. You might check some of them out. I think you can even take out a meds. policy or rider for your insurance. --Mike
I realise we have 2 conversations going on here, but I did want to respond. There is no problem with med coverage if you use a generic. Unfortunately there are no generics for the meds she needs. She receives ins. through her work. She knew going into it she would need the full coverage ins., but it isn't cutting it and it is very expensive. She pays about $150 a month. Now for a 21 yr old that is a lot.
_________________ [shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown] ~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]
|
|
Top |
|
|
karyoker
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 4:32 am |
|
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 3:43 pm Posts: 6784 Location: Fort Collins Colorado USA Been Liked: 5 times
|
The Obama campain mngr called and was asking for a contribution and my response was Im leaning the other way I like Obama a lot but I,m an old vet. He said well sir I thank for your service to our country but reminded me of Bidens experience versus Palin. I wished him good luck and actually it was a very pleasant conversation.
_________________ Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!
|
|
Top |
|
|
KJBigMike
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 4:53 am |
|
|
Novice Poster |
|
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2008 5:49 am Posts: 18 Location: Pittsburgh Been Liked: 0 time
|
I hope this don't make people mad that I post this. Joe the plumber asked a simple question. "If" I buy the company I work for your plan will increase my taxes. Obama's reply was simply yes it will spread the wealth. I take that as Obama wants to steal from the rich and give to the poor... how noble!
I offer my opinion on this. who is really going to pay for the increase? Do you think Big Business is just going to absorb the extra cost and take it from their profits? Lets look at the big picture. Big business employs people who pay taxes and the top people of the big business make over the $250,000 and the people below that pay taxes too. Because of big business so many people pay taxes and Obama wants to penalize them for their success. When all it's going to do is cause them to not give raises to their employees and increase the price of their service or product. It's called the trickle down effect.
Look at it in just numbers alone. Someone makes $100,000 that means they pay $36,000 in taxes (Dramatization) but if they make $100,000,000 instead of 36,000,000 in taxes they have to pay ANOTHER $3,000,000 like their contribution of $36,000,000 wasn't enough. not to mention all the Taxes the corp brings to the government from all of it's employees. Why shouldn't they get a tax break instead of an increase. they bring in the lion's share of the money. Even if they got a 50% reduction in Taxes they will contribute more taxes in a year then I would in a life time.
It's easy to say tax the rich they can afford it but then we wonder why those big businesses start doing more over seas... you would too if it was cheaper. Lets give big business a reason to stay here and not more reasons to go else where.
<Big Mike steps down off the soap box>
|
|
Top |
|
|
karyoker
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:15 am |
|
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 3:43 pm Posts: 6784 Location: Fort Collins Colorado USA Been Liked: 5 times
|
Why do you think all the manus moved out of country? The drug industry is another one that has congress in their pocket. No business can afford the health insurance or the high taxes. They pay far more now than any industrialized nation.
It is totally corrupt in corporations and congress. The choice of president is not going to solve the problem. We have to get all those old corrupt cronies out of congress on both sides and in the house and senate. That is the change we need but I dont see it in the very near future. We need to gripe to the liberal pres and tell them to start telling the truth. They have blamed Bush for everything under the sun but dont say anything about obama They are all over ur arse.. Frankly i'm tired of it.
The economy they talk about is all plastic. The economy we deal with is enuff for rent etc.
Along time ago Mcain was on the Enterprize as a pilot in a jet ready to go to war again. We had a blockade around Cuba I was on the Little Rock at GQ 12 hours a day with over 50 nuke missles ready to fire. Subs around russia were on the ready. Who am I voting for?
_________________ Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!
|
|
Top |
|
|
dumbdrums
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:38 am |
|
Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2003 6:21 pm Posts: 945 Been Liked: 1 time
|
lordairgtar @ 10/21/2008, 10:40 pm wrote: http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/did_mccain_crash_five_planes_did_he.html Read this link, dumbdrums. According to how the planes were situated on deck, the tails of the planes were facing off the side. No way could a wet start (even if he could) have caused that, plus the Pratt and Whitney engine of the A-4 was single stage which CANNOT be wet started. The P & W engine has no after burner. The only thing one could say about McCain is he broke a lot of expensive planes. The sites that say he did start the fire are "swiftboating at its best".
if you notice the story changes AFTER the inquiry. If you dont think for one second ol daddy Mccain didnt sweep his sons mess under the carpet, you need to wake up. My version of the story was given by men on board the deck that day. Funny how an Admiral that wasnt there could all of a sudden make all their testimony mean nothing. It6 is a fact that he ran for his own life and did not help the others up top. Most of the men who died did so fightting the fires and trying to move the undetonated ammo away from the blaze. By the way, it is fact that Mccains load dropped onto the deck which was due to his negligence and was the primary explosion on board. Go ahead and believe the inquiry notes if you want to. Ill believe the men who were there.
_________________ Gladly helping Kappy to become cyber immortal !!
|
|
Top |
|
|
leopard lizard
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:05 am |
|
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:18 pm Posts: 2593 Been Liked: 294 times
|
So as not to confuse the Rolling Stone article on McCain with other claims--I don't recall them accusing him of causing the incident on the carrier with a Wet Start. It says he was sitting in his plane when a misfired missile from another plane hit it. But what it does say is afterwards, after a few tentative efforts to help, he got himself to safety and watched while others risked their lives rolling the burning planes off the deck. Then while the crew had the grim task of getting the damaged ship back to port, he went on vacation.
The article does say that in another incident he flew his jet too low in Italy and took out some power lines causing a major blackout. After being shot down in Viet Nam, he crashed a third plane when he got back. That is when he broke his arm again, adding to his POW injuries.
|
|
Top |
|
|
timberlea
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:22 am |
|
Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2002 12:41 pm Posts: 4094 Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada Been Liked: 309 times
|
Babs, even in Canada where we have universal health care, we still have to pay for our prescriptions, and most have insurance to do so. But even with the insurance, not all drugs are covered (esp new drugs). Our heath care costs us a lot of money through our taxes (so the myth of free health care in Canada is just that, a myth). To add prescriptions to it would break the bank. Some provinces do cover some of the more expensive ones but not as a rule. In Nova Scotia where I live, 41% of the province's income goes to health care, plus about 10% of Canada's income. So over half my taxes goes to health care and I still have to have medical insurance whichdoesn't always cover everything and still havea 20% co-pay. Further, our health care does not cover dental care. That's all private and private insurance.
_________________ You can be strange but not a stranger
|
|
Top |
|
|
karyoker
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:24 am |
|
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 3:43 pm Posts: 6784 Location: Fort Collins Colorado USA Been Liked: 5 times
|
It is obvious that neither one of have been aboard an Amercica fighting vessel and dont understand the duties between enlisted personnel damage and control and the duties of a Pilot who by the way is An Officer. Pilots do not fight fires aboard ship. BTW it is called leave and not a vacation.
While the Navy pilots are risk takers and all they are the best pilots in the world. On the flag ship USS Little Rock I have been in the same flots with the Forrestal and the Enterprize. You want the opinion of somebody that was there here I am...
_________________ Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!
|
|
Top |
|
|
Bill H.
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:26 am |
|
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2008 9:23 pm Posts: 1173 Location: PNW USA Been Liked: 0 time
|
Babs @ Tue Oct 21, 2008 11:49 am wrote: I would love to hear your input on what I perceive of these programs. I realise my opinion is just that and freely welcome others without argument.
Here's my personal experience. I've been self-employed practically all my life. Getting insurance for myself and family has only been a struggle in the last 10 years or so.
The last insurance we had was terminated a few years ago for non-compliance reasons. Less than two months later my wife lost her life in a rollover accident. Not only did I have to deal with the incredible pain of losing the only woman I have ever truly loved with all my heart, but the resulting medical bills and incessant calls from creditors made me wonder if I should continue living myself.
Here's where this great country of ours is right now regarding health insurance. Half the people are on one government plan or another. The other half is not only paying for the coverage of the first half, but scrambling around trying to find coverage for themselves. It's insane. No other industrialized country in the world is set up like this.
Neither candidate has a plan I really like but Obama's comes closest. I'll be voting next month not for myself but for my kids.
|
|
Top |
|
|
karyoker
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:40 am |
|
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 3:43 pm Posts: 6784 Location: Fort Collins Colorado USA Been Liked: 5 times
|
Quote: Neither candidate has a plan I really like but Obama's comes closest. I'll be voting next month not for myself but for my kids.
Just remember Bill the liberals have these ideas without consequences but their thoughts are more important than Nation. The liberal education has the last generations believing that they are responsible for the economy and their protection and their way of thinking. I come from the days that a man or woman either one could work 40 hours and support family. We had the highest standard of living in the world. I have watched it deteriate for over 60 years. Im glad I lived in America when it was America.
_________________ Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!
|
|
Top |
|
|
dumbdrums
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 7:07 am |
|
Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2003 6:21 pm Posts: 945 Been Liked: 1 time
|
karyoker @ 10/22/2008, 8:24 am wrote: It is obvious that neither one of have been aboard an Amercica fighting vessel and dont understand the duties between enlisted personnel damage and control and the duties of a Pilot who by the way is An Officer. Pilots do not fight fires aboard ship. BTW it is called leave and not a vacation.
While the Navy pilots are risk takers and all they are the best pilots in the world. On the flag ship USS Little Rock I have been in the same flots with the Forrestal and the Enterprize. You want the opinion of somebody that was there here I am...
with all due respect to you and the debt we owe you for your service, if Mccain is gonna run on the title "Hero" then I would expect him not to follow protocal in saving lives and fighting fires. A hero runs back into the burning building not away from it. And according to Mccain himself he neither called it "leave" or "vacation"...his word was "R and R"
_________________ Gladly helping Kappy to become cyber immortal !!
|
|
Top |
|
|
karyoker
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:46 am |
|
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 3:43 pm Posts: 6784 Location: Fort Collins Colorado USA Been Liked: 5 times
|
Quote: with all due respect to you and the debt we owe you for your service, if Mccain is gonna run on the title "Hero" then I would expect him not to follow protocal in saving lives and fighting fires. A hero runs back into the burning building not away from it. And according to Mccain himself he neither called it "leave" or "vacation"...his word was "R and R"
I am not going to enter into an argument someone with childish statements and stupid liberal lies on the internet or press. These facts are for from real life and experience,. Have you ever stood on the flight deck of a carrier? I have I have landed on them in choppers. A few burning planes on the flight deck is not life threatening What they were doing was trying to deep six the planes before the fuel caught which is easy. They were not pushing them off by hand they were using tractors and booms. A fire aboard a carrier is not critical unless it is on the hanger deck or below. You have 3000 men on a carrier and you expect a pilot whose plane just hit with a missile to engage in damage control and then you begrudge him leave back in port? Son if you were presenting me with this in person I would have you on the floor in 2 seconds. Btw I have fought fires aboard ship in Naples when the aft switch board shorted This was below decks. Fighting fires at sea is a whole lot different than on land. It is very life threatening.
He has medals and so do I Do you
?
_________________ Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!
|
|
Top |
|
|
Babs
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:17 am |
|
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2005 11:37 am Posts: 7979 Location: Suburbs Been Liked: 0 time
|
timberlea @ Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:22 am wrote: Babs, even in Canada where we have universal health care, we still have to pay for our prescriptions, and most have insurance to do so. But even with the insurance, not all drugs are covered (esp new drugs). Our heath care costs us a lot of money through our taxes (so the myth of free health care in Canada is just that, a myth). To add prescriptions to it would break the bank. Some provinces do cover some of the more expensive ones but not as a rule. In Nova Scotia where I live, 41% of the province's income goes to health care, plus about 10% of Canada's income. So over half my taxes goes to health care and I still have to have medical insurance whichdoesn't always cover everything and still havea 20% co-pay. Further, our health care does not cover dental care. That's all private and private insurance.
Wow - That is my fear. We'll end up paying outrages taxes to cover the healthcare program Obama is proposing. His healthcare plan sounded really good until I started really looking at it. He is saying people who don't have ins. can get it through being added to the federal ins. program and preexisting conditions won't matter. But where will the money come from to pay for this? http://www.thehealthcareblog.com/the_he ... -anal.html He has stated it will cost 50 - 65 BILLION DOLLARS to pay for the program. It looks like it is the American tax payers picking up the bill again. He has said he will pay for this from the federal government savings. And from illiminating the tax cuts for anyone making over $250,000. The program is to be run by people's taxes ! I don't believe for a minute we won't in the future see higher taxes to pay for this system and on top of that we will have no choice but to choose the fed. ins program if it's horrible or not. So we may be paying for a ins. program we don't even like. Like in Canada.
Do I trust the government to handle my insurance or would I rather get $5000 to go buy my own insurance. Hmmmm
_________________ [shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown] ~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]
|
|
Top |
|
|
karyoker
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:20 am |
|
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2004 3:43 pm Posts: 6784 Location: Fort Collins Colorado USA Been Liked: 5 times
|
True R & R is when you get out of the airports where people are spitting in your face and calling you a baby killer and you could kill them 40 different ways before they hit the floor. You get back to the farm where it is normal again for 30 days . Then you have to go back. DO NOT MENTION R&R TO ME.
_________________ Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!
|
|
Top |
|
|
Babs
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:22 am |
|
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2005 11:37 am Posts: 7979 Location: Suburbs Been Liked: 0 time
|
Bill H. @ Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:26 am wrote: Babs @ Tue Oct 21, 2008 11:49 am wrote: I would love to hear your input on what I perceive of these programs. I realise my opinion is just that and freely welcome others without argument. Here's my personal experience. I've been self-employed practically all my life. Getting insurance for myself and family has only been a struggle in the last 10 years or so. The last insurance we had was terminated a few years ago for non-compliance reasons. Less than two months later my wife lost her life in a rollover accident. Not only did I have to deal with the incredible pain of losing the only woman I have ever truly loved with all my heart, but the resulting medical bills and incessant calls from creditors made me wonder if I should continue living myself. Here's where this great country of ours is right now regarding health insurance. Half the people are on one government plan or another. The other half is not only paying for the coverage of the first half, but scrambling around trying to find coverage for themselves. It's insane. No other industrialized country in the world is set up like this. Neither candidate has a plan I really like but Obama's comes closest. I'll be voting next month not for myself but for my kids. I hear ya Bill. It sounded good to me too until I realised we'll be paying for it in the long run. Read what Timberlea wrote about Canada's healthcare system. Quote: over half my taxes goes to health care and I still have to have medical insurance whichdoesn't always cover everything and still havea 20% co-pay. This is what we are headed for. With McCain's proposal at least we can choose what healthcare we want, with the money the government will give us, with no taxes added to anyone to pay for it.
_________________ [shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown] ~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]
|
|
Top |
|
|
Bill H.
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 10:51 am |
|
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2008 9:23 pm Posts: 1173 Location: PNW USA Been Liked: 0 time
|
Babs and others forgive me but I'm going to go OT just a bit here because it's a subject that's of extreme interest to me.
Universal health care doesn't mean nationalizing the health care industry.
Universal health care doesn't have to look anything like the Canadian health care system.
We have an advantage of sorts if we go into this now because we can see what's working and what's not. The best systems throughout the globe have these things in common:
All citizens are covered.
Government sets the prices and makes the payments.
Doctors, clinics, and hospitals stay private.
We still get to choose our doctors and clinics. What we lose is:
Privacy. Our health records are on a credit-type card that can be read by anyone in the system. Bookkeeping is 25% of our overall health care costs. The most efficient systems (Japan, Taiwan) keep this figure below 5%.
Malpractice suits. They're practically unheard of.
|
|
Top |
|
|
Babs
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:03 am |
|
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2005 11:37 am Posts: 7979 Location: Suburbs Been Liked: 0 time
|
I like talking to you about this. You have valid points.
Do you think the tax payers will pick up the bill? So aren't we in essence paying for it anyway.
_________________ [shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown] ~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]
|
|
Top |
|
|
dumbdrums
|
Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:16 am |
|
Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2003 6:21 pm Posts: 945 Been Liked: 1 time
|
Quote: A few burning planes on the flight deck is not life threatening What they were doing was trying to deep six the planes before the fuel caught which is easy. They were not pushing them off by hand they were using tractors and booms. A fire aboard a carrier is not critical unless it is on the hanger deck or below Tell that to the 137 men that died that day. No big deal? now who is being insensitive to veterens? karyoker @ 10/22/2008, 12:20 pm wrote: True R & R is when you get out of the airports where people are spitting in your face and calling you a baby killer and you could kill them 40 different ways before they hit the floor. You get back to the farm where it is normal again for 30 days . Then you have to go back. DO NOT MENTION R&R TO ME.
ok i get it, people spit in your face and called you a baby killer. Did i not just thank you for your services? You are one of those Veterans that will forever dwell on the negative things this country does to and for you rather than the positive ones. Did I spit in your face or call you names, no, but that seems to be your only argument to a topic you cant defend. Im done talking to you. I think its ironic that being called a baby killer offends you and in the same breath you threaten me with being able to kill people 40 different ways. If you dont like to be called a killer i suggest you stop talking like one .
_________________ Gladly helping Kappy to become cyber immortal !!
|
|
Top |
|
|
Who is online |
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 592 guests |
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot post attachments in this forum
|
|