Karaoke Forums

Just an observation here but it seems like so many people seem to have a hard time finding good paying gigs in the karaoke business and there seem to be so many KJ's having shows with low turnout at them lately but there are a whole bunch of primadonna's here who are willing to walk away from $7,800 to $10,400($150-$200 per night/52 weeks a year) because some "woman" didn't get thrown out on her (@$%&#!) for complaining about something that the HOST admits to in his first post. THE BASS WAS LACKING!!!

I would keep taking the money and I just would NOT let the woman who "assaulted" my "tough guy construction worker KJ" (LOL) to sing any longer at any of my shows until she apologized to me and my KJ. CASE CLOSED! Stopping someone like that from singing is far worse to that type of person than having her banned from the bar. There would be nothing better for me than to see her sitting at the bar and I was controlling her evening. I would also tell my "tough guy construction worker KJ" to keep the police on speed dial if she ever "assaulted" him again.

500W going to a Sub does not sound like a bass problem to me.

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FlipSide Karaoke
Scott

No question in my mind about that. If it was just some goofy woman you wouldn't worry much, but when they have boyfriends and other friends watching it is another thing. Besides, that doesn't even matter. I wouldn't want him taking a dive for assault, or getting into an altercation.

Bottom line is that he felt threatened. She grabbed his jacket and threw him (weighing 120 soaking wet) into the pool table. Twice. With two male friends watching and not saying a thing. He did well not to get into it with her, in my opinion. The goofballs who are claiming stupid things are just that -- goofballs. They have proved it by trolling many a thread before, making outrageous statements just to get a rise out of people. I just ignore them and don't reply to their ridiculous baloney.

I think it just isn't a nice enough place for us. The people there are friendly enough, but they let their drunks go too far and now we have seen that is policy. We are well out of there, despite the fact that we will miss some of the people. I know our 10-15 regular singers will probably miss us. To show how little a fuss he made about it at the time, most of them had no idea anything had happened and will no doubt learn about us leaving over the next couple of weeks.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

Bruce, the problem wasn't her complaining. The problem is the assault. An assault is an assault, regardless of the size or gender of the people involved. I've seen some smaller female police officers whip guys who were 200lbs+. A female is as capable of causing harm or death just as a man can. Complain all you want. Try to assault me and you're getting a face full of carpet, wood, grass, or whatever is underneath us and my knee on your back.

Complain all you want but don't try to get physical.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

I try to get a picture in my head of what transpired and I picture this woman bitchin' at the KJ and he keeps backing up from her and he eventually winds up with his backside against the pool table while she is still barking at him. It seems more like a verbal assault than anything else to me. I don't get the impression that anyone threw any punches or put their hands on anyone. I'm not exactly sure what "roughed up" entails in this scenario. I don't think it could have been that bad if the KJ let her keep singing all night long.

With all due respect, since you weren't there, how do you know what really went down? What guy wants to admit that he was frightened by just being pushed by a girl?

But I concur if that's what REALLY happened, then I would have a talk with the bar owner and put another host in there. But not throw away the baby with the bathwater.

Just my opinion.

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[font=Lucida Console]DangerousKaraoke.com[/font]
[font=Lucida Console]"Sing for the day, sing for the moment, sing for the time of your life!"[/font]

Maybe Brucey likes being manhandled by a 250 lbs moo cow.

Thankfully I've never had to deal with anyone like that but I do have 'cues' that are invisible to the crowd, directed at security or the guys who like to consider themselves my private security - one cue and they'd be on someone like that ... quietly, persistently, and the chat would be continued outside. I am certainly capable of decking a woman very easily (and at times have been tempted) but the last thing I need is an assault charge. Problem is if people don't see the whole situation transpiring, it is all open to interpretation - 50 different ways. What are the chances that the TRUE story will be told in defense of the KJ. How ludicrous that your situation got that far.

I believe my guy. He was stone cold sober and has no axe to grind. He is not the type to blow something like this out of proportion. He is interested in doing gigs, making a little money, and having a good time.

It would be nice to have that level of regular support, but we have only been doing it in the area for four months. If it had been in the open instead of out of sight in the back, I have no doubt it would have played out different. But no one except for a couple at the table on the way to the bathroom was there to see it.

If she was a singer, it would be one thing, we could remove her from the rotation. But she was not.

I can't do all the gigs myself, which is why he does them for me. He has to handle it, and I have confidence he can. But not without support from the venue. If someone waylays him in a dark corner, and is not tossed, then we are gone. I already have a line on a *much* nicer place -- the club for a golf course -- that could replace this as a Friday gig.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

On the surface, stopping the show appears to be a good approach, and as a customer I wouldn't be troubled by that if it was just a temporary halt in order to extricate the offending customer.

However, as customer, and particularly at a fairly new show, I would be inclined to avoid said Kj in the future if the show were terminated abruptly for the rest of the evening! I would be inclined to "blame" the KJ and not the venue under those circumstances, though in this case that conclusion would clearly be an incorrect one.

You didn't read his earlier post where he said there were a couple of witnessess to the incident.

Mcky - You show a lot of integrity and loyalty to your workers and I think that is commendable.

You made a decision to terminate the gig because the bar did not back you up. The bar manager decided to believe a drunk disorderly bar lush over a sober loyal employee. That speaks mountains to me.

Regardless of what type of assault and the asking of "86ing the patron, there is the problem of the bar establishment saying we are going to take the side of the patron. You tried talking to the bar manager about the incident to rectify the situation and they blatantly told you nothing is going to be done we don't believe you. How can you even come to a compromise with that?

I would have spoke to the bar manager and compromised we'll let this one slide, but in the future I need the bar to back us up. Then I would lay out what I'd like to see happen when certain circumstances arise. But you couldn't even get that far with an attitude of total denial. At this point it would have depended on how badly I needed the gig. If I had to have the gig to survive I would have left for the night and contacted the owner in the morning hoping I could lay out some rules for the future.

I do believe your worker should have contacted you immediately by phone if possible. This situation was dire enough to merit it.

I don't believe we as entertainment have the right to ask that someone be kicked out of a bar, but I think the bar should have the common sense to address the situation when they've been told something like this has happened. If it is a customer that they value highly they should at least have a talk with the person explaining if they cause any more disturbance they will have to leave. (At the very least !)

It is hard saying what is right or wrong in a situation like this when none of us were actually there. I don't know the tone of the conversation between you and the manager, but I can't imagine it was a pleasant conversation being told basically your guy is a liar and we aren't doing anything about it. I think you made a decision you felt comfortable with and that is all that matters.

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[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

After reading everyone's thoughts on this incident and what their own philosophies regarding working in a bar are, heck I'll throw out mine too.

1. I don't tell an establishment how to run the bar. That includes telling them when they should be throwing someone out.

2. However if the establishment doesn't throw someone out if they've got physical with an employee (including me) then I would probably not stick around. There's not enough security in the room to keep me and my equipment safe.

3. The KJ didn't do anything wrong by continuing the night. Actually he should be commended for it. Most of us wouldn't.

The thing that puzzles me about this incident is provocation. I've been KJing for almost three years in a rowdy bar. So far no one has ever hit me, but when things get heated it's always over only these three things:

Not letting someone sing when they think they should.

Telling someone to get off the stage when they are uninvited by the singer.

Killing the mic when someone decides to give a little extemporaneous speech.

And nothing else!

But there's always a first for everything. And I'm not doubting Micky but I still have a nagging feeling that there might be more to this story.

Violence is pointless and stupid. If one is going to have a job that puts him/her in the public eye, one had better be able to out-think someone who is pointless and stupid. It's a job requirement.

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Okay, who took my pants?

I have a wierd feeling about this one too Bill. I wish I was a fly on the wall to see how this employee handled things. I believe he was probably man handled by the woman that's not what I mean. Where I'm confused is how it got so out of hand.

I've been shoved into my amp before because a guy was unhappy I turned his mic down. He was screaming at the top of his lungs. He shoved me not once but twice and then was ejected from the stage. I had the power not to let him sing any more, so action was taken. Then I told the bar staff to keep an eye on him he's a loose cannon.

I realise this woman did not sing, but there are ways to talk to people to difuse situations. My funny feeling is if MCKY was there and handled it himself this wouldn't have gotten so out of hand. I know as an owner you can't be every where all the time, so I don't blame him, but I'd be questioning exactly what happened and instructing the worker how to better handle it next time. I'm still confused as to why the worker didn't notify MCKY right away instead of waiting until he arrived and the situation was over.

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[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

Um...as a big guy myself and a size acceptance advocate, that comment was thoroughly unnecessary.

If the host felt truly threatened and valued his paycheck more than his personal safety, perhaps he's in the wrong line of work. Just like a comedian deals with hecklers or a bartender deals with drunks who come on strong, a KJ should know how to diffuse these situations with words so it never gets physical. And again if indeed he was assaulted and the bar owner did nothing, why didn't HE call the cops?

Sounds like it was more about drama than getting beaten up. If he wants a genteel environment, this KJ has no business working in a bar. Evidently the bar owner didn't feel that what transpired warranted throwing out a customer who, as I mentioned before, may spend tons of cash there every week and has a number of friends who do too. KJs are easier to replace than good customers.

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[font=Lucida Console]DangerousKaraoke.com[/font]
[font=Lucida Console]"Sing for the day, sing for the moment, sing for the time of your life!"[/font]

Baloney, Dan.

I've been in this business for MANY years, and I still got into an altercation, and not one I started.

I've had people jump in my face, and in most instances, they were defused.

But not EVERY instance will be that way!

IMO a kj has no right to tell who can & cannot come into the bar. If the bar manager did not feel it was worth 86'ing the lady, then I would bet it wasn't as bad as it was led on to seem. Kj's can make suggestions and control the show as to who can & can't sing, but that's as far as it goes. We are hired entertainment, nothing more.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

I have to respectfully disagree, Lonnie.

Even if you don't let someone sing, they can hang around the bar and be a general pain in the watoosie! Spreading gossip, and being FAR worse than what you wanted them kicked out for in the first place.

I'd rather not have to deal with that at ALL!

That may be true, but to demand someone to be kicked out is completely out of line, again IMO. But then I have never been in a bar that people that were causing trouble haven't been dealt with accordingly.

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