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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:19 pm 
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I notice that Carvin has the LM153 3-way passive speaker which looks very attractive, light weight (35 lbs) and affordable ($310).
https://www.carvinguitars.com/products/ ... duct=LM153

- System Type: 15-inch 3-Way, bass-reflex
- Frequency Response: 50 Hz – 18 kHz (-10DB), 58 Hz – 17 kHz (-3 dB)
- Coverage Pattern: 90H x 45V
- Crossover: Speaker Guard™ HF protection
- Crossover Frequency: 400Hz, 3.5 k Hz
- Power: Continuous / Program / Peak: 475w /950w /1900
- Recommended Amplifier Power: 400 – 1400w
- Sensitivity (1w @ 1m): 97dB
- Maximum SPL: 123dB / 129dB peak
- LF Driver: 15-inch Neodymium Woofer
- MF Driver: 6-inch Neodymium Woofer
- HF Driver: 1-inch exit 1.5-inch VC
- Neodymium Titanium Driver
- Nominal Impedance full range: 8 ohms
- Suspension/Mounting: 1-3/8-inch pole mount cup
- Connectors: Two Neutrik Combo 1/4-inch / Speakon
- Dimensions (H x W x D): 27.875 in x 17.875 in x 13.125 in
- Net Wt: 16 kg (35 lb)


Questions:
- What's your opinion on the LM153 3-way passive speaker?

- What would be your preference b/w 2xLM153 (3-way passive) + AMP vs. 2xLM15A (2-way powered)?

- Would the Carvin DCM1500 amp be able to handle two of these LM153 3-way passive speakers or is it too under-powered?
> DCM1500 (8 ohms: 300w, 4 ohms: 500w, 2 ohms 750w per channel - $350)
> https://www.carvinguitars.com/products/ ... ct=DCM1500

- If DCM1500 is too under-powered, which other Carvin amp model would be more suitable (at a minimum required)?

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:36 pm 
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Program power is what you want to match as close as possible. It's rated at 950 watts program @ 8 ohms so your amp should push right around that within 100 watts or so.
Opinion on the speaker is very good, this was one of their speakers that my band used (on top of a dual 18" sub) - the other was their dual 15" 3 way.
The 1500 alone would be underpowered. Two of them - 1 bridged per speaker would be ideal but not very compact. The DCM 2000 bridged to both speakers would be a good match if you don't mind running in mono - which in most clubs mono is actually better since speaker placement is not always optimal for the entire audience to get the stereo benefit.
Personal preference I will 9 out of 10 times always pick a passive/amp combo over a powered speaker. Better flexibility & expansion opportunities for future upgrades.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 5:38 pm 
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Lonman @ Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:36 pm wrote:
The DCM 2000 bridged to both speakers would be a good match if you don't mind running in mono - which in most clubs mono is actually better since speaker placement is not always optimal for the entire audience to get the stereo benefit.


So, if I understand correctly, the DCM2000 bridged would send out only one output line (mono).
Never bridge before so would you please elaborate as of how to bridge the mono output to both speakers?
Does it mean that the two speakers are connected to the amp in series or parallel?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 6:32 pm 
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wildfins @ Wed Jan 07, 2009 6:38 pm wrote:
Lonman @ Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:36 pm wrote:
The DCM 2000 bridged to both speakers would be a good match if you don't mind running in mono - which in most clubs mono is actually better since speaker placement is not always optimal for the entire audience to get the stereo benefit.


So, if I understand correctly, the DCM2000 bridged would send out only one output line (mono).
Never bridge before so would you please elaborate as of how to bridge the mono output to both speakers?
Does it mean that the two speakers are connected to the amp in series or parallel?


Bridging basically combines both outputs to one combining the power of both channels to one. The Carvin amps have a bridged output built in. The speaker plugs into that output. Then you can just daisy chain the 2nd speakers together.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 6:41 pm 
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Lonman @ Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:36 pm wrote:
The DCM 2000 bridged to both speakers would be a good match


Lonz, wouldn't that bring the RMS continuous up to 2000W?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 6:50 pm 
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JD @ Wed Jan 07, 2009 7:41 pm wrote:
Lonman @ Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:36 pm wrote:
The DCM 2000 bridged to both speakers would be a good match


Lonz, wouldn't that bring the RMS continuous up to 2000W?


Yes, 2000 watts at 4 ohms. And when you tie 2 8 ohm speakers together in parallel, it brings the load to 4 ohms. 950 watts at 8 ohms, will double at 4 ohms, so 1 8 ohms speaker that handles 950 watts at 8 ohms would now require 1900 watts at 4 ohms when both are tied together.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 7:12 pm 
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Isn't that high for the speaker rating?
@ Power: Continuous / Program / Peak: 475w /950w /1900

here's a cool article link for all about amp power
http://www.qscaudio.com/support/library ... puzzle.pdf


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 7:21 pm 
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JD @ Wed Jan 07, 2009 8:12 pm wrote:
Isn't that high for the speaker rating?
@ Power: Continuous / Program / Peak: 475w /950w /1900

here's a cool article link for all about amp power
http://www.qscaudio.com/support/library ... puzzle.pdf
Like I said when 2 8 ohm speakers are tied together it bring the comined speaker ohms to 4 ohms which also double the speaker rating. 950+950=1900 watts at 4 ohms.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 7:41 pm 
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Running an amplifier bridged is a widely used and acceptable practice, providing the amplifier is designed for it. In the case of the Carvin DCM's they will hold up just fine. The only draw backs, and these would be minor in normal operation, would be that the amplifier will draw more electricity, run hotter and you also may notice an increase of total harmonic distortion which you would probably perceive as ambient amplifier noise.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 9:44 pm 
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That's a really power hungry speaker. Considering the amplifier power required, I would say it's probably not a good choice for a MOBILE Karaoke host or DJ. The speaker may be fairly light, but your amp rack could be well over 100 pounds if it contains anything else like an effects unit, compressor, EQ and crossover. IMO there is something to be said for speakers with high sensitivity and low power consumption with a high SPL. Your mileage may vary.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 11:00 pm 
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Goshhh...
It sounds like passive speakers + matching amp is quite a science and as a newbie, I just don't feel like I am ready for this setup... yet.
I think that I will just get a pair of powered speakers such as the LM12A or LM15A to start with as it looks a lot simpler to me and fewer equipments to hook-up too.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:07 am 
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wildfins @ Thu Jan 08, 2009 12:00 am wrote:
Goshhh...
It sounds like passive speakers + matching amp is quite a science and as a newbie, I just don't feel like I am ready for this setup... yet.
I think that I will just get a pair of powered speakers such as the LM12A or LM15A to start with as it looks a lot simpler to me and fewer equipments to hook-up too.

Actually it's not that hard, once it's set up it can sound better than a powered speaker. Powered are definitely much easier and simpler to use.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 3:48 pm 
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I once saw a catalog that I believe may have been Carvin's, with a description of amps with linear power supplies versus switching power supplies.

The linear typically use a toroidal transformer which adds the weight whereas the switching transformer may weigh a few pounds if that. The plug was for linear because they deliver a greater peak punch. The switching however can have a lower ac mains power draw but replenish the power caps quite rapidly. The charge replenishment though was not enough as compared to the linear design to amplify signal peaks. All in all the net effect was that the linear was punchier with the sound.

I have heard the terms "bloated" and "transparent" used to describe differences of these types of amps. Both have advantages and disadvantages.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 3:50 pm 
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Just look for passive speakers that dodn't need so much power.
Example: Yamaha S115V 250/500/1000. Many mid power, reasonably priced amplifiers will power a speaker like that. A pair of those speakers can put out a significant amount of sound. A pair of quality speakers with 12" woofers can put out a surprising amount of sound, in most cases plenty for the average bar or restaurant. How loud does it have to be?

Take some time and look at Musician's Friend, Zzounds, Samedaymusic and a bunch of others. Speaker brands to consider are RCF. FBT, Yorkville, Electro Voice, Yamaha, QSC, certain Peavey products, Carvin, Community and a couple others that don't come to mind right now.

Stay away from JBL and Mackie. I know tons of people love those two, but you will overpay for products that long ago built their reputation but are not that good anymore especially considering their price. I'm sure lots of people will disagree, oh well . . .

Stay away from most entry level product lines like the Peavey PR. Try to go and listen to some different speakers if you can, even at local bars and restaurants. Go up and look at what equipment they are using. What amp, what brand and model? What speakers, what brand and model?


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 3:59 pm 
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The switching power supply converts the 60HZ to a higher frequency This results in a smaller and lighter transformer. Also the filters do not do not need the higher capacitance or size required by 60hz. The voltage regulators are more precise and the PS is shutdown with a direct short and when the short is removed everything is back to normal.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 12:11 pm 
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I read from other user audio forums that the discontinued CERWIN-VEGA PSX123 12" 3-way passive speaker 125w/250w/500w is quite popular and comparable to the Yamaha club series.
It was introduced at $370 ea back in 2003 and can be found around $200 ea these days ($400/pair).

A matching and small amp such as the Carvin DCM1000 2x225w ($300) or QSC RMX850 2x200w ($300) shall be able to drive two of these properly ($400+$300=$700).

However, I am wondering if it is not a bit under-powered as a speakers/amp setup even for home use only?
Or I'd be better off with a pair of powered speakers like the Carvin LM12A 12" @ 350w RMS for the same budget ($700/pair)?

In your opinion, which of the above setup (passive vs. active) would provide a better sounding?
What would be your preference?


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 12:15 pm 
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wildfins @ Fri Jan 09, 2009 1:11 pm wrote:
I read from other user audio forums that the discontinued CERWIN-VEGA PSX123 12" 3-way passive speaker 125w/250w/500w is quite popular and comparable to the Yamaha club series.
It was introduced at $370 ea back in 2003 and can be found around $200 ea these days ($400/pair).

A matching and small amp such as the Carvin DCM1000 2x225w ($300) or QSC RMX850 2x200w ($300) shall be able to drive two of these properly ($400+$300=$700).

However, I am wondering if it is not a bit under-powered as a speakers/amp setup even for home use only?
Or I'd be better off with a pair of powered speakers like the Carvin LM12A 12" @ 350w RMS for the same budget ($700/pair)?

In your opinion, which of the above setup (passive vs. active) would provide a better sounding?
What would be your preference?


In the above options i'd go back to the powered speakers. The passive/amp combo will give you greater expandability later, but for the same prices, the powered would be less connections & still sound great - especially in home.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 1:03 pm 
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Thanks Lonman... I think that I'd take the simple way and go with powered speakers based on all the feedback I received so far.

For $700 budget, I can get a brand new pair of Carvin LM12A 12" 350w or a good used pair of Mackie SRM450 (V1) 12" 400w from Craigslist.
Which option would be your preference and recommendation for home Karaoke?


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 3:18 pm 
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wildfins @ Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:03 pm wrote:
Thanks Lonman... I think that I'd take the simple way and go with powered speakers based on all the feedback I received so far.

For $700 budget, I can get a brand new pair of Carvin LM12A 12" 350w or a good used pair of Mackie SRM450 (V1) 12" 400w from Craigslist.
Which option would be your preference and recommendation for home Karaoke?


Out of those i'd go with the Mackies - provided they are in good condition & preferably made in USA or Italy. The Chinese made - go with the Carvin.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 1:19 pm 
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Thanks Lonman. I think that I'd just go with the Carvin LM12A for peace of mind as it's backed with 3 year warranty and made in USA by a reputable company.
As for the used Mackie SRM450, it could be a hit or miss (especially those are made in China) based on various user reports and I may end up with more trouble than anything.


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