Karaoke Forums

Yeah Matt. Going with the description above, if it was a packed night (which means that I've got a million things I'm doing anyway), and a singer told me that before they sang they wanted not just one but several adjustments to the system (lo and hi EQ and effect type in this case)... well I wouldn't cuss them out. But I'm mentally ID them as trouble that's for sure.

Like all of us I gladly increase or decrease effect level if a singer asks for it. For me it's usually increase, because I normally run practically dry. My room has a lot of natural ambiance and I personally like things dry.

And sometimes a singer who isn't used to a system with subs will ask me to turn the subs down. But that usually happens just once. When they hear the collapse of the low end, and experience everyone's lack of response to their song they never ask again.

Thanks for the encouragement. I realize that the critical nature of my rant is driven by the fact that I sincerely want to do well. I have a good job and my motivation in this is not just a means of supplementing my income. I could other things that would be more lucrative. For me, it's fun and I'm motivated by wanting people to the best karaoke experience possible whenever they're at any show I'm hosting. My friends tell me I'm very entertaining on a karaoke stage and I want to leverage that further. When I was at that bar and privately compared my intentions with this guy, it did make me irate because it seemed obvious to me his attitude rather than wanting to be the best was wanting to be just enough to get by. He's trying to get his foot in the door subvertly whereas all I'm asking for is an opportunity to show what I can do.
I have no doubt that once I actually do get a gig, I will probably change some things. I may decide that the sub is overkill and trade it, the amps, and the Yamaha speakers for a nice pair of Mackie SR450's or JBL Eon G2's. I may add additional stuff but I first have to put the horse in front of the cart and secure a gig. In the interim, I think I need to just:

1. Keep checking out shows and look for ways to learn and improve rather than merely looking for things to criticize.
2. Continue getting up to speed on my gear to make it sound as optimal as possible.
3. Network, talk to people. I may discover that someone I befriend knows of a place that just opened or is looking to add karaoke or someone I befriend may end up later coming to some of my shows. I may find a karaoke DJ that knows of a show that he can't take himself.
4. Expand my musical depths. My musical tastes are primarily rock/alternative/punk. I live in Texas where most people prefer country. I need to better learn what country songs people want to sing and how best to mix them.
5. Stay positive and not let those who taint the purity and sanctity of my karaoke whoredom/passion break my spirits.

Thanks everyone for the advice!

Adjustments to tempo or pitch, fine. A little more reverb, fine. More volume, yep. You start refining my sound, I might as well take a crack at refining your vocals.

BFFL ... Digital Rocks, and when are you going to get it. It is the KJs way ... If you ever start doing gigs, I suggest you become a house boy so the owner and patrons can dictate your every move.

I like the Cult too!!!!!

I guess I'd better get some Cult then. Right now I don't have any.

Sooner or later someone's going to ask for it.

I barely remember these guys. A British hair band from the 1980s right? So what Cult gets sung in karaoke bars? One or two to cover my butt here?

. Well said!

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Good music, good friends, howling good times!

I'd wear a thong, flip-flops, and sing it's raining men if I thought it would help.

Maybe I should try one of these catchy lines:

"Are you lonely and seeking temporary karaoke companionship?"
"Do you suffer from KD (Karaoke Dysfunction)? If you have karaoke lasting longer than 4 hours, you're welcome!"
"My karaoke is like my sex. I've recently become so good at it I'm ready to take on a partner!"

Cult karaoke tracks include:

She sells sanctuary
Firewoman
Love Removal Machine
Rise

Don't bother with Painted on my heart. The song was written by the same woman who wrote songs for Milli Vanilli. She wrote it for the soundtrack Gone in 60 seconds.

I appreciate the list, but I can look them up. What I'm interested in is... what Cult is actually getting sung out in the world of karaoke bars? If I were to order just one or two which ones should I get?

Firewoman for sure
Love Removal Machine

I'd include She Sells Sanctuary the karaoke track isn't that great. You'll be fine with the first two.

Do you ever come up with an original thought, koyote, or do you just parrot whatever croakdog says?? BTW I am completely digital already but I still have my CDG machine hooked up as well as an older laser disc player through an A-B-C switch from Radio Shack. Sometimes I'm just in the mood to sing ONE song before heading out to karaoke, so it is easier to just pop in a disc than it is to wait for my computer to boot up before I can sing that song. You two guys should think about getting married to each other. You could finish each other's sentences.

Check it out BFFL is playing matchmaker! Kewl! What do you think Croakdog?

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Good music, good friends, howling good times!

The Cult? Doesn't EVERYONE love Fire Woman?? That gets brought out at our shows every once in a while......

What do I think? I think BFFL is good comic relief on this forum.

As an added thought, so no one considers this a post gone to poop, I'm getting an MX-200 tonight. I've been thinking my Mackie CFX-12 just doesn't have a decent vocal effect.

Irks about as much as someone who hasn't seen the elephant telling me about how bad (@$%&#!) they're going to be once they get a shot.

My advice is to quit complaining about half-assed guys who have gigs and work to actually secure one. Saying "I have a sweet setup so I'm bound to succeed" isn't going to cut it. The guy you're ragging on is making money while you're dreaming about it. I personally can't fault his methods if that's what the owner wants.

It's all about the bottom line. Learn that if you learn nothing else.

It's not as easy as it looks until you've done it awhile and then it is.

Does that make sense? Probably not unless you've got a few hundred hours of hosting under your belt.

Cult? I've got two... She Sells Sanctuary and Rise. Now I'll have to listen to them!
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Look, DFW, I think your enthusiasm is great.

But let me discuss I one element of a karaoke show that you, IMHO, may be too focused on - equipment. But mind you, you are not alone in focusing on equipment. IMHO, in the places where I have most often frequented karaoke, equipment IS NOT the most important factor in creating a successful karaoke show.

Why do I say that? Well, again, because of my first-hand knowledge. I have pointed out on this forum that the person who at one time had, by far, the best equipment in my area did not have the most successful show(s) and that people with much lesser equipment often had more successful shows. And some of those shows used Fender Passports.

When I decided to go into business I created a business plan. The plan included an understanding where I would go to pursue gigs, how much I was willing to invest and was willing to lose if I did not succeed. Since there are small venues that would present karaoke, and since four hosts use Passports in the area, upon local recommendations, I purchased the Passport. My point? My plan worked just as I conceived that it would and my original investment in equipment has be repaid to me. BTW, since last year I have made additional investments in equipment and could configure 3 different systems with what I now have, which includes an 18" sub.

So.. my success has not been based upon the type, quality or the amount of equipment that I started with.

I'll leave it to you to figure out for yourself what element(s) may have trumped equipment as being the most important! But don't think that by setting up the best equipment in the world that you're going to automatically outshine someone with lesser equipment who has been hosting for 10 years.

AND... I must admit that I don't know what the deal is with video monitors being set at a 45degree angle to the stage? I find that at a lot of shows, including my business partner's, and it drives me nuts@

I dunno, maybe I'm just a grumpy old guy but I've always taken the view that we are in the customer service business. If some guy wants me to tailor his sound it not really much of an imposition for me. Generally I'm doing a certain amount of that anyway because the vocal characteristics of muliple singer is . . . well, mutiple. It doesn't cost me anything but I accrue good will as a KJ. Quite possibly that singer will come back to my show because I was cooperative and helpful.

I too am extremely proud of my equipment. I know that not everyone will agree, and maybe this is different in different places, but around here I don't believe too many singers have the ability to discern differences in quality between one system and the next. That includes both the serious singers and those who are just there for the fun of singing.

While most of the singers never notice my equipment they do notice if the rotation is screwed up. They would notice if I didn't have a decent selection of songs and those regulars who bring their own discs would certainly notice if I didn't have equipment to accomodate their needs.


Having high quality equipment is important to me but I don't pretend that sound quality is what gets and/or retains shows. Bar owners are in business to make a buck. Entertainment in a bar, whether it's karaoke, a DJ, or a band exists only for the purpose of enhancing the owner's profits. If we can't do that effectively we are of no value to the venue.

I believe we do a disservice to ourselves and the bar owners if we get so wrapped up in the details that we can't see the big picture.

I think we also need to look at our side of the business as a business as well. We need to turn a profit too. To that end, the investment we make in our equipment needs to produce a reasonable profit or it's a bad investment. I wouldn't counsel anyone to take a second mortgage on their house to finance the purchase of karaoke equipment unless I were very sure that I can make a profit that justifies the risk.

Getting new business is a marketing function. You have to sell yourself to whoever is doing the hiring. To sell my show to a venue that already has a show I need to be able to identify and quantify those points of difference that make my show a better choice. If I can't do that why would the owner hire me and sack the existing show? I can't simply say, "If you'll hire me you'll have bigger profits." I have to be able to demonstrate why my show is better to the owners satisfaction (this is generally a subjective rather than objective decision by the owner). I can't do that by tearing down the other guy.

I recently got a new show in a venue that had never had karaoke, because I was more flexible that my competition. The owner wanted to try a combination karaoke/open mic show. And because there had never been karaoke at this venue and the owner hasn't been in business long the owner didn't want to take all of the risk. She wanted to share some of it with the KJ.

Some of my competitors were not able to hear what the owner wanted. Their strategy was to tell the owner that the karaoke/open mic concept wouldn't work. Some of the others didn't want to share the risk.

I offered to do a trial run at a reduced rate with the agreement that if the show was able to produce the additional business the owner was looking for, my fee would be increased to the normal rate after the trial period. I also embraced the owners concept and made suggestions for how to make it work.

I got the show because I listened to the owner and because I was willing to be flexible and work with her to our mutual benefit. To me that's just good marketing. In this case I didn't have to identify the points of difference because the owner could see what they were. All I had to do was to fulfill the owner's needs. That's really what selling is about; identifying needs and finding ways to meet them. No one else was willing to do that.

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"Life is too short for diet soda and lite beer"

Good work lbister. If you're working a venue you're working for the owner and meeting them half way with their wants/needs certainly does make it a profitable partnership. I'll do what the guy paying me asks.... once. If it works I'll try it again, if it flops we both see the folly in it.

So there was this time the owner wanted me to promote some new musician...

Ibister

Marvelous, well written*, on the money (IMHO) post.

*(You covered a lot of "territory" with brevity and clarity!)

Bravo

I agree with Ibister. Equipment is important, but its not the only thing. Personality, fun factor, and hosting/ customer service skills rank much higher.

If you can't keep track of a rotation, get out into the bar and get people to sing, smile at dumb drunks, make Karaoke fun for the none singers, and take a little push back from idiots.... then don't bother. KJing isn't for you. I don't care how sweet your equipment is.

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Good music, good friends, howling good times!