Karaoke Forums

I have to agree with swingcat on this one. Most people couldn't care less about the "quality" of a karaoke show. The fact there is noise is more important than anything. And there are the owners that the "almighty dollar" is the only thing that counts. So, my best advise is ,,,move on and learn how to be better than them, (other hosts) and hopefully you will prevail in the end.

Swingcat, this is sort of what I have been worrying about lately. There are a few big clubs in our area with rocking shows with good sound, etc. but it is almost like they are the exception and karaoke is getting a bad name. More and more places that used to have karaoke seem to be heading in the DJ direction.

Thats what I have been arguing about for 2 years. They want high energy noise whether it is karaoke or not...

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I'm sorry, this is 100% not a true statement. People do care, and loud noise will clear a bar faster than anything.

Run a good show, provide solid sound, a good time and the folks will follow you.

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Good music, good friends, howling good times!

On a funny note, for a good few months My Way by Frank wasn't on the his system , but yes, most karaoke addicts would note that it's mainly dupes and I personally won't go near this show because chances are I'll end up singing Backstage versions of what was once a good song.

But bar owners now look at the bottom line, and if that owner isn't a singer, who frequents other shows, how is he to know what is a good or bad show. . . and if a KJ comes in who can talk up the benefits of 40,000+ songs why wouldn't a owner assume it was a good thing.

I've heard through the grapevine that Mr 40,000+ is soon to be leaving and replaced by another KJ who also owns a 40,000+ hard drive.

I'm more frustrated that the current trend in my area, is large hardrives filled with songs that keep crashing mid night. . . Surely if you are going to break the law, you should do it well The other draw back to these systems run by morons, is that the customers are now becoming lazy, many just shout out their requests and have no understanding as to why a host may need a track code and large majority of customers can't grasp rotation.

Just a couple of questions:

I saw a few quotes in here like "DJs/KJs are a dime a dozen", "good quality shows are fewer & further between", "The market is saturated".
So does anyone think that this is being caused by the proliferation of pirate KJs? And if it is, then isn't it in all our interests to fight with them?

I have to say, I have come accross a few pirate KJs and never made anything of it because I got better things to do and anyway, what exactly would I do about it?
But, after a doing a gig that went on till early am once, I put all my gear in my shed overnight and wouldn't you know it, the whole lot was stolen. I made it my absolute mission to find it again, even leading the police to the scumbag who nicked it all (Thankfully, I got back the whole lot). Turns out I knew the guy and he iis now facing prison.
I got no dilema here though, he had no problem taking the tools I use to support my family, gear I worked very hard to get, so to hell with him.

Whether a theif steals my gear or steals my gigs, the end result is the same.. £0 for me.
I do agree that a lot depends on how good you are, my library is only around 7,000 so far, but I got all the gigs I need. But to think that all pirarte KJs are lousy hosts is a bit naive, that won't always be the case.

So when a good host with a pirate drive replaces an average host with a smaller library, should he just 'move on'?
What about if a good host with a pirate drive replaces an equally good host with a smaller library by simply undercutting him? Should he just 'move on'?

I guess ultimately what I'm asking is can you rely on being a better host to compete with the pirates forever, or will they eventually drive the value of karaoke down so much that those who do it legitimately eventually find themselves in an ever diminishing market?

Yes. I do believe the satuation of the market is caused by multi rigging and illegal harddrives. Piracy has lowered the start up costs and the running costs, and has lead to more people setting up companies, with the big dream of earning £250 per night.

In my experiance all the pirates I have met run a poor show, with sticky out of date books, cheap equipment and generally they have few qualities that you would associate with an entertainer or a passion for music. This is certainly not always going to be the case.

It is in our interest to fight them, but as individuals we have very little power and the powers that be in the UK have little understanding of the situation and how to deal with it. (Ref: Produb) I have a lot of respect for the Karaoke association scheme, but feel they are on an up hill struggle.

I've lost work to pirates before and fear little, because despite their harddrive, my 6000 different songs , customer service and general obbession for music and entertaining, i've always found work to replace it. I move on, because I've seen good hosts become very bitter towards their job due to pirates. I love what I do to much, and I can sleep at night that i am doing it fairly.

In my opinion the long term problem is far greater, good hosts with a legal system will not always be able to compete as more and more good hosts with illegal systems appear. People will stop purchasing discs (including the home user, five in my area have brought a hard drive off Mr 40,000+ for £50) and then the companies we know and love will move on to other projects, leaving poor quality backing tracks and innacurate lyrics, produced quickly and cheaply.

Edited to add: the current economic situation will filter out a lot of poor hosts, as our prices keep falling, eventually ebay will be filled with disco and karaoke gear for sale as those who aren't passionate sell up and move on.

As with all markets, this will balance out over time. Those who are in it for the cash, but not the passion will NOT get the best gigs and leave the business.

I offer you Craigslist and ebay as evidence. How many times have we gotten equipment off of there due to some DJ or KJ "getting out of the business?"

Those who host the most entertaining shows will rise to the top like cream, and the chattle will fall away... Competition is good, and forces innovation.

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Good music, good friends, howling good times!

This business (and life, really) is all about relationships. Do a good show, make the customers happy and form a tight bond with the manager and staff, and you become part of their "family".

Do this, and they won't dump you for a $50 savings any more than they would their top bartender or chef.

I tend to agree with Barry. Any half-inteligent owner or manager will know where there bread is buttered. And like he says its all about being part of the "family" or "team". Now if the mgmt is shady and not very bright, then this probably wont hold true. But then they will probably be out of business soon enough anyway as they will be making poor decisions in all aspects of their biz and operations.

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

In my heart of hearts, I agree with Coyote about how the business will/should go. But I think we are in for a bit of a rough ride to begin with. I don't fear losing an existing show to a pirate. But I fear losing new venues to them (economy makes owner want to cut corners) and then the owners getting soured on karaoke if it doesn't work out. But I think we will hang in there and try to ride this out.

Right on!

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What about 2 laptops running at the same show?

It's the same show, it's not being run and making money in two different locations. They are at one show!
You do realize that most of the manus out there no longer have a problem with computer ran shows do you - as long as the user has the corresponding set of discs for the computer being used at the time. Even if someone had two laptops at the same show, only one is being used at any given time - no point to run both. A set of discs needs to be owned for each computer being used in different shows.
Sound Choice even recommends & endorses PCKJ for commercially ran karaoke shows. Pop Hits Monthly sells their monthlies in an mp3g format disc to be loaded & used on computers for commercial shows now as well. Both of these companies were addiment about computer karaoke, now they are both accepting it & endorsing the use of them, as long as original discs are owned.

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Hey LL, I agree with you - a lot of places get talked into pirate karaoke because it's less costly (if I had only $2000 invested in my entire setup I'd probably charge less, too - but my music alone cost me probably close to $20,000) -- of course pirate karaoke fails miserably and then when you approach them later, they say very matter-of-factly "Oh, karaoke doesn't work here." Well of COURSE it doesn't.... Geesh.

I think Kameragurl is just afraid of being lumped in with the blatant piracy thieves, so she's looking for any arguement to make it seem as if the computerized KJs are the bad guys. This is NOT a diss on her or others that are like that who think like that. In my personal opinion, it's about clarifiying the position of the LEGAL kjs...

I have two hard drives of my system. I have only one set of discs and lasers. Both of my hard drives reflect what I own. One is a backup of the other.

Two laptops with the same setup is the same thing as two hard drives. They can literally boot the 2nd laptop up in case there's ANY kind of problem with the first one. It's the same thing if I have a backup USB drive for mine. In fact, it's safer to have the dual laptops... I'm no laptop guru, so I've avoided doing this.

But I honestly understand the appeal. I don't carry a backup motherboard, power supply, etc... I DO have a secondary system at home that could be swapped out, but I don't bring it to the venue.

In today's age, a computer CAN fail... I've had to replace motherboards, power supplies, memory... cpus... they can and WILL fail. Not that OFTEN, but they will fail!

And not having your hard drive duplicated is insanity!

CDGs can and will get scratched. You can be the best kj in the world and take care of them, but eventually, they'll get scratched, and possibly broken. And many manufacturers aren't producing karaoke anymore.

Right now I have 3 hard drives backup. If I dont have one backup I cant sleep at night!!! Refer to my response to the windy PA thread. Years ago I shifted to computer on account of these conditions. Ever had a miller fly out of your cd player? Also they are a lot easier to use at night and with my format now I could not use cd's.

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Actually I have seen 2 laptops running at the same time with 2 people running them.

If a person uses two different laptops at one show, could be recording with one and playing with the other. Maybe?

Its just me downloading searching songs for customers yakkin on KS checking email putting pics or video on hdd etc.

There is nothing wrong with having 2 laptops hooked into the mixer. If I am at your show no gigs that night and hook into your system with my laptop there is absololutely nothing wrong with it. BTW every time I did it the audio was vastly improved over the cd player.

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