Karaoke Forums

Ok here goes, I start taking sign-up slips about 15 minutes prior to the show starting . I usually have about 10 singers ready to sing at the show's beginning. I always do the first song(on each rotation) and keep taking sign ups until there are no more. This on many occasions have built up to as many as 30 singers on the first rotation. I begin my second rotation and some new singers come in and I alternate them between the first rotation singers, is this bad or should I make them wait 30 singers before they can sing. I have the compuhost software which shows the scrolling rotation on the bottom of the monitor so singers know where they were on the first rotation and notice real quickly when they get bumped down the list as I insert new singers, fortunately for me they don't complain too often about it but I would like to know how the rest of you kj's do it. Thanks so much for your input on this.

There are several variations that the people here use.

1. Some make the people wait all the way to the end... Your last person in the 1st rotation has sung, and you are starting a new rotation. Assuming everyone from the 1st rotation has remained (and handed up a song request), you start with the 1st person in the rotation. As the newbies hand up a slip, they are put at the end of the rotation.

2. Some use the insert method.... As stated above, you start the new rotation. as nebies hand up their slips, you insert them in between the others waiting to sing their next song. thus, you have Old Singer, New Singer, Old Singer, New Singer, etc...

3. Some CAP their rotation. 30 people would be about a 2 1/2 hour rotation. Some KJs cap the rotation at 2 hours, and then start from the beginning again... 24 people have sung in the 1st rotation, and now you are starting back at the top. The people that did not sing in the 1st rotation are now inserted in between the ones that have sung. Any newer singers fall into the rotation after the older singers (who didn't get to sing in the first rotation), also still using the insert method.

Whatever method you choose to use, be consistant. Don't vary it from week to week or show to show. If you do, the Regulars will not stand for it.

Like said there really is no right way, just be consistant in your format.
I personally insert new singers simply because if I didn't, and stuck them all at the end, the rotation, would pretty much never end seemingly. At least inserting them gets the singers that HAVE been there up a little sooner than continually waiting on ALL the new singers that may be put at the end of a round.

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Good point, Lonnie, when one chooses the method of just adding singers on to the end - that, in actuality, punishes the first arrivals if the rotation continues to grow and grow, AND those arriving later - and if someone arrives after the end of the first rotation, they probably won't sing at all if the rotation is very long. I have always done the 'insert' method - 4-5 singers down the line for the new arrivals - original singers continue to get to sing (rewarding them for arriving early?), and the later arrivals at least get to sing as well.

The best thing to do is to keep the show moving - work on getting 15-16 singers an hour up - if people see the rotation moving, psychologically it seems like it takes less time for them to get up and sing. A slow rotation with extended periods of dead air between singers is a death knell for a karaoke show IMHO.

Oh, and NEVER take a bribe to insert someone...at least not in front of everyone!

Don't show more than the next two singers up. I don't have Compuhost, but if I did I would really limit that display so I could continue having breathing room as a KJ to insert.

There are always creases in the rotation between tables, spouses, friends. Insert there. Don't break up a group that came in together.

Get more nights. Spread this group out. Even my most casual singers would complain if they only got to sing twice in a night on a regular basis.

Congratulations on your very successful show!

Funny, haven't had a big enough rotation yet for this to be a problem, but my thinking was, if I get a new performer, I will add them to the bottom of my screen whether the bottom of the screen is the actual first singer, 5th singer, 25th singer. They wait until everyone else on the current list has sang once. I don't think it would be fair to someone who is halfway up the list, but the first singer in the rotation and I insert the new singer at the end of the rotation list.
In this manner, Marla could be following Joe one round and then Carl the next round. I would explain this to Marla if she asked, but again, just need to be consistent.

In this manner, after you have sang and drop to the bottom, no one is inserted above you making you wait more.

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

After running pool leagues, dart leagues and such I have watched each being ruined by a big book full of rules. However there are some basic rules unless enforced will ruin it too. Sloopy rotation or playing favoritism will kill a host or bar in short order.

There is no set way I have run shows with 10-15 singers that didnt care if they sang every round just when they wanted to sing. Nobody cared including the audience they just wanted music and lot's of it. Other times when you have 20-30 singers it is more formal and rotation order is important

It took concentration and time before I could use the computer for order versus slips. But it is easier to track and is sort of a helping hand. If it is hot and heavy I will let the program insert new ones at the bottom of the liast and they wait for an entire rotation and I dont offer any excuses. This is more in the first 2 hours. In the last hours esp in the last rotation I will insert new ones in the middle. But at this tempo my singers know we are in high gear and overdrive. If they taary7 getting to the stage they are skipped. So it really depends upon the situation. But as long as the singers understand whats going on (you have a mic..) there is no problems.

I agree with all the above posts. Pick a method and stick with it no matter what.

I would suggest using the "sing-one, bring-one" method rather than a true rotation and maybe if you have that many folks waiting to sing you shouldn't. I have found that slipping new singers into the rotation early tends to promote bar hopping.

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Okay, who took my pants?

I don't sing every rotation. I sing the first song and maybe one during the night, unless the rotation is less than around 8 singers. People get angry when the host is singing every rotation and they have to wait 2 hours to sing. I find way to much pressure to get in as many singers as possible then to worry about myself singing.

In the beginning of the night I add people to the end of the rotation as they hand in slips for the first hour.

After that I use the the insert method. I don't put people at the end of the rotation. If people have to wait 2 hours to sing they usually won't wait around to sing again. I just use common sense were to insert them. If I have a lot I'll do every other starting down the line 6 to 10 people. Usually it is only a few at a time. Maybe 1 or 2 new singers every once in a while, so it isn't a big deal. I have the least amount of complaining doing it this way.

But like everyone else said the most important thing is find a method that works for you and stick with it. Good luck !

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I agree with Babs. Most nights I sing only once or not at all. That makes room for one more each round.

I prefer the insert method after the first rotation, its ok putting new ones at the bottom during that but after if you making new singers wait until the end they could get fed up and leave,they maybe not regulars and have come halfway through the night but treat them fair as the other singers have already sang once or maybe twice then they maybe become a regular.stick them at the end they get fed up and leave and dont come back.
like as already been said do which ever way but stick too it and try to be sensible .

Why is it okay to make someone wait an entire rotation(or longer) to sing their second song but so many people have a hard time making someone who shows up later in the night wait the same amount of time to sing their first song??? If the second rotation starts and there are 20 people in it; the first singer will have to wait for the other 19 people and any new singers to sing before he or she gets up to sing again while the new singers will be slipped in in about 4 or 5 singers. To me, that is totally unfair. If 10 new singers come in during that second rotation, that first singer will have to wait for 29 singers to sing before he gets to sing another song while the new singers don't have to wait even half that long. That singer who got to your show early should just sing his second song and leave to find a show where he can be a "new" singer and get preferential treatment instead of being treated like a second class citizen for being a loyal customer who gets to your show early and often. This kind of insertion method is what leads to people who jump from one show to another so they can get the "new singer" special treatment over and over again. If the regulars are willing to wait an entire rotation to get to sing another song; then the late comers should be willing to wait the same amount of time to get up on stage for their "next", "first" song.

There's nothing worse than having to wait for an hour or more to sing a song and then you see a bunch of people come in an hour after you last sang and they all get up to sing before you do and by the time you get up to sing again, all of those same people are gone and they are at the other karaoke bar down the road singing their first song there. So many KJ's seem to worry about these late comers getting annoyed if they don't get to sing right away. My opinion is that if they had to wait longer to sing, they'd show up earlier the next time they were in the mood for karaoke.

What most of these late comers do is they go to a different show first and sing a couple of songs there until the KJ starts letting the new singers cut in line ahead of the early birds so they leave to go to a different show so they can be the "new" singer. Then they leave and go to another show ....rinse and repeat. The KJ's are the enablers in this situation. They worry about losing the late comers instead of worrying about losing the customers that would be happy to support your show from start to finish. Everywhere else in society, people seem to understand that you go to the END of the line when you show up for something. For some reason some karaoke singers seem to think that showing up late should be rewarded with special treatment. I'm not saying that someone should be punished for showing up late. All I'm saying is that they should have to wait the same amount of time as everyone else has to wait to sing a song. If I can wait an hour and a half to sing another song, then someone who shows up at 11:00PM can wait an hour and a half also. If the rotation is an hour and a half long, that's about 22 singers, and 22 singers is a pretty damned good show in my opinion. Why would anyone want to risk ruining such a good situation by pissing off your regulars by giving preferential treatment to a small number of people??? If you had a short rotation of 7 people, then the new/late comers would only have to wait 30 minutes or so to sing their first song. If they can't wait 30 minutes to sing, they don't belong at a karaoke bar because waiting and listening to others is a VERY BIG part of the karaoke experience.

Agree with Bruce.

Those that came early shouldn't have any songs inserted in front of their next turn for other singers or new singers. Put the newbies at the end of the list, not the end of the rotation, but the list. They wait the longest.

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

Those that come early will always sing more than anyone coming in late.
And if you think about it, if you put new singers at the end - ALL of the people that were there early are now going to have to wait through ALL the new singers. If they are inserted in the next round - the newbies are the ones that will have to wait a little longer, while they are interweaved with the singers that have already sang, the older singers will start getting back up quicker, rather than having to wait through a ton of new singers all in one sitting.
I had a rotation on Fri that started me out with 12 singers by 9:15. By 9:30 I was down to the 9th singer & was handed 8 more new singers, yes they walked in about 3 minutes before & handed me their slips. So I worked them in the next round. By 10, I had a total of 32 singers as 12 more new singers between 9:30-10 handed me slips, they all got interweaved after the 8 new singers that were just put in.

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Also remember a bar is there to make money. They don't make money, you have no job. The first rotation is the first rotation. Now when do you stop taking slips for the first rotation. Say you have 20 in your first rotation already, you're at number 17 and 5 more people come in and sign up. Do you make them 21,22, etc or make them wait to the bottom of the second roation or insert them into the second rotation? The first two ways will keep them there and buy drinks while waiting. The third method will make them leave without buying anything (and yes singers will put their slips up before buying to see how long the wait is).

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You can be strange but not a stranger

I have read all of the replies on my question about rotation delima and I just want to say 'Thank You" it is nice to know there are so many great kj's willing to submit their ideas on this matter. Keep up the graet work..chris clay

well i think there are plus and minus's to all but as said i prefer how lonnie does it ,either way people are going to have to wait somewhere down the line ,the one thing people do forget even on a real busy night you may only have 50% of the crowd singing, by inserting and maybe getting more singers through the 50% that dont sing get a more varied night not listening to the same singers all night of which they may be real bad singers ,not that should make a differance.
I think this is something that everyone here would agree to disagree .

It shouldn't but it does. Never fear, though. The singers that are most likely to show up early, in my experience, are the better singers. They want to practice and perform, and when you want it you get better.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

I meant first and thirs. Can't read my own typing

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You can be strange but not a stranger

I don't have the bar hopper problem. I don't know why anyone would go just to sing one song and leave, but I'm sure it happens. Drinking and driving to several locations just doesn't make sense to me.

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