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Hi all. I am currently using 25ft 12guage LiveWire, Speakon to Bannana Cllips. My Amp Supports Speakon and Bannana clip output. To be honest, the Speakon just looked like a more solid professiona connection. I don't really know.

Came across a gueat gig where I really could have used one of my cables to be much longer, maybe as much as 70ft. The occasions I would need a cable like this, would probably be less than 10% of the time. Would I be okay running one speaker with the 25ft 12guage Speakon to Bannana for one channell, and a say 16guage Bannana to Bannana on the other channell, the one of 70ft in lenth?

Thanks,
Felix the KJ

The longer the run, the heavier guage is recommended. You are going to have more resistance with a smaller guage on a longer run.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Actually the gauge of wire used is determined by the Ohms (load) of the speaker it's attached to as you want the wire's resistance to be less than 5% of the nominal impedance of the speaker it is attached to. For example, if you are running an 8 ohm load on your 75 foot run a 14 gauge cable would be fine. If you were running a 4 ohm load on the same run you would technically want to use a 10 guage cable to get the best possible sound out of your speaker and protect your amplifier. It's always best to error on the larger side.

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Quickness of mind will deceive the eye

actualy the impedence of the load is only part of the equation you have to consider the signal voltage drop also the 12 gauge wire has a lower voltage drop than a 16 gauge a 70 foot run would be best served with the 12 awg wire. the voltage drop of the 16 awg would cut signal voltage will decrease. dave

Hmmm, my first post does come off sounding a little techie. I was just trying to let the OP know that although generally the rule is the longer the run the larger the cable, but if you know a few of the rules it is possible to use a smaller gauge safely.

In regards to the Banana vs. Speakon, this is strictly my opinion as I've never done any formal research on the subject. It would seem to me that although the banana plug has a larger contact area where the plug inserts into the jack you are still limited in the rather small contact surface where the wire attaches to the banana plug itself. The Speakon type ends I have used have larger lugs where the wire attaches to the Speakon and of course the Speakon has a large contact surface where the plug goes into the jack. For these reasons and the locking ability I give the edge to Speakon type connections.

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Quickness of mind will deceive the eye

OK Mostly covered here, first of all you're ok running different lengths of cable to the two speakers, but as was mentioned for the longer run you're probably going to want a larger gauge (smaller number) cable. For 70 ft runs, generally speaking you'll want 12 or 10 gauge cables.

As far as connectors, the best part for me about speakon connectors is that they lock. Banana plugs can be easily pulled out of the binding posts. As far as actual connection quality, I've yet to see any performance difference between the two. I have heard some say they like to have connectors that pull out easy in case someone trips over a cable they don't pull down the speaker or something. To which I reply, don't put your cables in a location where they can be tripped over. Tape them down or use carpeted runners if you have to run cables across walkways.

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DJ Tony
Let It Rip Karaoke

Note that you can buy SpeakOn female/female couplers for a few dollars so you can hook two cables together for longer runs. My cables are all 5 to 50 feet, and if I need a longer one I have those couplers in my tool box.

You might think about just putting some amps next to those speakers and using a small snake or a couple of mic cables to send the signal to them. This will result in less signal loss, save you money on cables, and reduce amp power consumption for same sound output. If you don't have a snake or individual mic cables that are long enough you can hook several mic cords together trivially without any adapters.

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Jeff Wheeler, moonlight DJ/KJ

I have a some what related question. Would it be OK to link up 2 different gage wires with a speakOn coupler, say, 50 feet of 12 gauge and 25 feet of 10 gauge.
If it is OK, would it be better to get the 10 gauge to extend the 12 gauge I Allready have, or should I just stick with the 12 gauge for both cables

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[font=Fantasy][/font]LIVE IN THE MOMENT

Well you could, but it's only going to be as good as the smallest guage. I wouldn't do it personally, but if need be in a pinch, then it would work for a temp. If possible, always use the same guage with an extention.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Actually, in some ways it will be better than the 12 gauge because the total resistance will be lower.

As a bit of a devil's advocate, if you are not running into volume problems, i.e. you have plenty of headroom, you can get way with a smaller cable. It isn't ideal, to be sure. But 100 feet of 16 gauge wire at 8 ohms causes only an 11% power loss. 12 gauge will limit that to about 5%. A hundred feet of 16 gauge will cause a 0.86 dB loss, while 10 gauge limits that to 0.22 db. (Source -- Yamaha Sound Reinforcement Handbook.)

For me, the weight and cost of 10 gauge for my applications in karaoke just don't compute.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

Another option is to use a powered speaker for the one 75 feet away. Then you're running a signal rather than sinal+power to the remote speaker. This is practical if you need to have the remote speaker pretty regularly. Once a year? No. Ten times per year? Hmmmm, might be worth having a powered speaker IMO. This also gives you an extra speaker as a backupto your regular system or it can be used as a monitor.

So because I am using powered speakers, 16 is ok? Running about 20 feet.

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

Your running a "line level" through a balanced XLR cable Rip, you can run that as far as needed. Some of my runs in bigger venues can be 150 to 200 feet total when you figure everything in. Running "line level" is far different than running a speaker cable from an amp to the speaker.

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Quickness of mind will deceive the eye

Doesn't apply -- you aren't using speaker cables. You use XLR->XLR microphone cable, which probably is about 24 gauge. It doesn't matter, just use decent cables.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

Thanks everyone. I have a few options to consider. If what I am reading correctly, if I use 16 guage on the longer run, and 12guage on the shorter run, I will loose 11% volume compared to the shorter cable. I could just make up the difference on my mixer's master out, right?

I might just use a cheaper 12 guage cable than the LiveWires I am currently using, just because of the cost, and the fact I don't see using this cable very often. Gotten by 4 years without it.

Thanks,
Felix the KJ

Think of it as a water hose. The more you push through a smaller hose, the same result you'll get at the end. If you have a bigger hose, the more water you'll get at the end. Same principle applies to speaker cable. You can use a smaller guage, still get sound, but not to the fullest potential!

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Actually, you will lose about 5% of the power comparitively, as a 12 gauge drops 6% and the 16 11% (at 8 ohms).

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

Keep in mind 11% energy loss is not 11% less perceived sound. If you lost 50% of your signal in cables, that's only 3dB less power for the speakers. Of course if you lose 50% of your signal in cables you might be starting a fire when the voltage gets up there...

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Jeff Wheeler, moonlight DJ/KJ

One thing to remember for longer cables is that they can pick up interferance as well from other nearby electronics.

This can result in a background humm, especially if the the signal is a low power sent to a powered speaker

This can be a problem in especially older buildings or buildings with a lot of wireing already with a lot of em "polution".

It is not just a question of wire guage in this case, it is also a question of how well that wire is shielded. (This in addition to all of the other good advice above).

Sheesh, I love comments like this that are just wildly inaccurate. Signals sent to powered speakers are typically done so using balanced XLR connections. Balanced connections are used specifically to eliminate this type of interference and it has nothing to do with shielding. In fact, in most installations, there is little shielding on the cables. How do you think large concert halls and auditoriums can send 48 channels over lengths of 400 feet or more through a snake that is no more than 1.5 inches in diameter?

Folks please go read an article about balanced audio connections. I've seen some great explanations out there and it will help you understand how these connections actually achieve such long runs at low voltage levels with no interference.

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DJ Tony
Let It Rip Karaoke