Karaoke Forums

Phil,
Thanks for all the work you've put into the last series of changes for SS...I love the Views!! Kudos to you, you're awesome!
/HUGS
Emma

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In front of a mirror with a hairbrush in my hand...SING!!!!!

Phill,
Since you have made the swichover and wiped out the old scores... I have been working to figure out who has been giving the 10's... so far it's been a "REAL" easy thing to do.. THAT'S THE UPSETTING PART.

YES, to your question. I'm definately FOR going back to ALL The membership (paid and unpaid) to ranking subs because of this.

Because of the type of ranking that is going on.. some of the 10's and 9's..we all know should be 8's and 7's. This hasn't changed a thing at all.

yadda yadda...

I know.. maybe I should just pack up my mac and just go back to Nashville right?

Well if the pattern fits, and this what we all have been trying to fix.. Then I need to call a duck a duck, and a fish a fish. So there it is.

This just don't seem right for some reason..

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Brian D.
(BHB)

Oops, I haven't gotten around to eliminating the old ranks yet.

That will take some time with over 6000 comments!

How in the world could you determine who gave what rank? I can se them and I can't figure it backwards.

I have to run all modifications across the "powers that be" prior to implementing. But I will see what I can come up with.

Phill

Still not able to comment on subs...bummer

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Gotta' Sing , Gotta' Sing !!!

The common denominator is those who frequented those ranked songs and who didn't after those dates...

P.S. I also find it disturbing that 13+ members or people can look at a song and not comment... it just adds to the frustration.. My position has changed rather quickly on ranking and membership.

This is rather ugly.


Tonight will be the last sub I will put in 'til this gets fixed.. and maybe my last at all. Please don't miss me.


Not that I have a point to prove, I'm just really frustrated and need a break from this.

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Brian D.
(BHB)

Maybe, They are just revisiting and listening to them again. I know I have listened to several songs on here numerous times.

KJ Denn -

Are you logged in? Contact me via a PM, let's see if I can figure it out.

Thanks

I don't understand what all the fuss is about. I had no problem with the old system, but I enjoy the improvements on the new system. I don't like the ranking thing, but I understand that some people do. Before I could choose not to be ranked or choose to ignore the rankings and enjoy the wonderful comments given by all the wonderful people out there. I am glad to be able to see how many times my song is listened to and appreciate that there are people out there listening. If they choose not to comment I don't care. Maybe they didn't like the song. Some people don't like to be critical and I respect that. I also respect the people who make critical comments to help me improve. I'd rather have them say nothing than to tell me it's good when it isn't. Maybe they do like I do sometimes I listen to a bunch of songs and go back and listen again later when I have time to really concentrate on the message I want to convey.
Maybe they just want to listen and have a good time. If you are moved by it either in a good or bad way I'd love to hear it. I don't want anyone to feel pressured to comment on my song.

I am not a paid member at this time and do not have the ability to rank. (I havn't ever tried) I probably will become a paying member at some time but I will still choose not to rank. I think if someone wants the ability to rank it's not too much to ask them to become a paying member. I think it's fair. I don't see the issue here. Do you think that the paid members are not qualified to rank??

BHB said....

How is this going to be resolved by allowing everyone to rank. You will just end up with more people giving 10's and 9's when they aren't deserved. This is a problem that you cannot fix. Some people will always give high ranks even if not deserved.

I enjoy this site and appreciate that I have somewhere to go to feed my ego or check my ego depending on the day. I am glad to hear from other people and hear what thier views are and to chime in with my opinion now and then.

I say thank's to the webmaster for caring enough about our opinions to take the time to ask and respond. When I do become a paying member it will be money wll spent.

First, thanks for the compliment.

I appreciate yours and everyones comments. As I have said many times before - Feedback from the members is what helps make this site what it is.

This has been one terrific topic. I hope that the latest changes are well received. I know some will and some won't like them all.

I am still working on a view more items to be implemented. These make take some time. (Who's Online, Search capabilities, etc.)

Q1: For those that wish to be ranked, should the commentor have the option not to rank or should they have to provide a rank?

In the meantime:
Q2: What is it that you like most about the Singer's Showcase?
Q3: What are the best features?
Q4: What could use some improvements?

This should help me in developing a section that everyone can enjoy, even more.

Thanks again,

Phill

Wannabe,
I had a "Realtime" chat session via Instant Messenger with the "Webguru"
late last night/early this morning and also there was an opportunity to see honestly where he was coming from.. I have had a few bad days and as some here may or may not know with a very new and quite spendy studio add on to my house, as well as a live show that went bad due to a storm caused power outage.. So, we all do get carried away from time to time and find a convient target and vent them elsewhere than where they were supposed to be.

and I do appologise..

But I still feel that everyone should be able to have the choice to ranked abd those who do so, do it honestly. not the massive amount of 10's or no ranks and if you visit a sub, and listen..PLEASE comment on it.. and rank it. Appropriately.

Thanks,

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Brian D.
(BHB)

The problem with ranking is that I believe everyone is ranking appropriately according to their own criteria. Everyone gets something different from the same performance. That's the nature of music it is all subjective and open to many kinds of interpretation, unfortunatly when you try to standardize any form of art you take away the very thing that makes it unique and exciting. These issues will never be resolved to suit everyone because someone will always feel that another person is being unfair either by ranking too high or too low. Who are we to demand that other people use our standards to rank performances?????? Who gets to decide what criteria is used and what is acceptable.

I personally try to judge based on singing ability since this is a karaoke site. Some of you would rather be judged for mixing abilities as well. (something I'm less qualified to judge) I could make the argument that every one deserves a 10 just for the effort it takes to put yourself out there and try something that's difficult for you to do. Is any of this wrong ? I don't think so.

Maybe we should all embrace our own gifts and limitations and learn to judge ourslves. Your opinion of yourself is really the only one that matters after all. Let's just relax and sing and don't take the ranking so seriously.

I do have a queston............

If I leave a comment and decide not to rank then does that count as a zero or negatively impact the overall rank??????

When you decide not to rank the rank is counted as a null rank and does not effect the overall ranking.

I have the script calculate only those ranks greater than "0" then it divides the sum of all ranks by the number of ranks.

Currently, only paid members can rank. And there must be at least 3 ranks given that are greater '>' "0" before the overall rank is displayed.

Rather complex and that is why I was having such troubles with it. Not to mention the fact that sometimes I just get "stupid"

Phill

Thanks for the quick response. I was just curious I'd hate to mess anyone up.

As to your previous questions...

Q1 I would prefer to do away completely with ranking and stick to comments only

Q2 I love hearing such a variety of songs and styles and to have the opportunity to be heard.

Q3 I like the comment feature and enjoy getting feedback.

Q4 I like it the way it is and i liked it the way it was. I take what I can use and leave the rest. I may not use the ranking feature but others seem to enjoy it and I have a choice. It just seems to me it provokes more negative feelings than positive ones.

Keep critics in perspective. In any job, you'll be critized at some point. While nobody wants critcism, there is a smart way to assess it. First, consider the source. Should this person's opinion matter to you? If it does, take a few minutes to consider if you can learn anything helpful from the criticism. Others often see things that you have overlooked. Use their observations to your advantage if you can.

Second, remember that critics serve their purpose. In most cases it's not worth the paper it's written on.But if it is, and if it's in a paper people are byuing and reading, then realize that if people didn't find you interesting enough, they wouldn't be taking the time to criticize you in the first place.

PS: Phil, keep up the good work!
PSS: BHB, if things go rough and you need to blow off steam, go ahead. We all do that now and then, and we do understand, cause you see............it happens to all of us sometimes.

Gee Allstar,

That gave me warm fuzzies...

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Brian D.
(BHB)

My happy face comes from finding somebody out there that thinks exactly like me about all the issues that have been dicussed here. So to you WANNABE, you have all my humble backing. I'm sure there's more of you that think the same way.
WANNABE mentioned that everyone ranks according to their own criteria. There's no arguing about that. Not even the 3 judges from American Idol agree all the time. Same thing with the judges on the show Fame. Even the "PROS" disagree with one another. Why should anybody here be so concerned about the rankings???
Let me tell you about an experience I had last Saturday morning. That's when I first noticed some of the new changes. Most ranks were erased but a few 10's. Those were songs that I had not listen to yet. I listened to the first one and already 9 members had given it 10 plus comments like "brilliant", "excellent", "great job", etc... you all know how that goes. As I listened I heard pitch deviations in more places than I would have allowed myself to get by with, and the timing was off in about 3 spots. Now, How can 9 persons before me, overlooked flaws that were so ovbious and sitll commented and ranked as if it had been a perfect rendition
Can somebody tell me what is behind all that I could understand if it would have been 2 or 3 persons, but 9
I don't mean to sound ignorant for I know the answer to all of my questions. My purpose was to bring a real life experience to try to illustrate some points. Hope you see where I'm coming from.
WEBMASTER PHILL, you are doing a tremendous job

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I dream of songs of love, peace and harmony.

Tony,

Now ya see where I came from.. and why I went looking for a pattern in this.

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Brian D.
(BHB)

As for ranking. It's an opinion (everyone has 'em.. not all share 'em) based on their own criteria, and yes it's wise to consider the source before reacting. Some folks rank higher for the emotion they may feel 'vs' the overall technical presentation. What is considered a "flaw" to one could be "raw emotion" to another. That's the beauty of art. I've always felt the purpose of music / singing was to evoke/elicit emotions?

I hope that makes some sense. I understand your logic... however, some folks are more "emotionally" influenced than others... Sometimes you can detect in the way they express themselves:

I FEEL that ranking is subjective. 'vs' I THINK ranking is subjective.

The important thing is if you are going to rank, then please rank HONESTLY and leave CONSTRUCTIVE feedback.

JW |;>

OK John, Tony Allstar, and wannabe,

I'm posting this in the middle of another thunderstorm so I'll be brief..

This may be a lame example but... If figure skating is scoring on emotional expression, technical merit and other factors.. and some consider that an art and a skill, why can't we?

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Brian D.
(BHB)

I strongly believe that a 10 performance is a perfect one and that "EMOTION" is only one the factors to consider. What about singing on key and staying in time. Seems to me that if we want to seriously get into ranking on a medium like Karaoke, in the end there would not be nearly as many 10's as we had on this site, by a very long shot.
I also got frustrated by the example of bad ranking practices exhibited here and that is why In my case I'll be happier not ranking anybody or myself.
The most logical explanation for such a high % of 10's IMO is that too much emphasis is been put on the emotion factor, while in many cases, forgetting about the other factors mentioned before. You can not consider yourself a singer if you can't detect whether you are on or off key.From what I've heard here,there's some very good singers on this site but even more that are just having fun and using this platform to practice and hopefully get better at it. Don't misunderstand me, I support and applaud their efforts,But to ask a rank from people that still don't have the ear to detect flaws is not fair for those that want a competent judgement. It just WONT WORK

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I dream of songs of love, peace and harmony.

Tony,
With the new equipment & recording platform I have now, I DEFINATELY can tell if I'm off or on, but this showcase is a platform for me to practice, rehearse, and have some fun. Just like you referred to. Personally, I would like that input to back it up.

And really it's not as serious as a heart attack if I fail here..

It's only something to work on.

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Brian D.
(BHB)