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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:12 am 
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The one thing I do like about Taylor Swift is she seems very appreciative and humble still. She always seems genuinely surprised that she's up for these awards.

It seems that with these award shows there is always problems with the equipment and sound engineers. I've heard on several occasions different singers saying their ear pieces didn't work. This is especially a disaster for multiple singers trying to harmonize and they can't hear each other.

When I watch American Idol I get frustrated with the sound. A professional show like that should have their act together.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:51 am 
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Long after Taylor Swift's singing career is over, she will continue to write popular music for others because it is the song writing that is amazing... and I can PROVE how amazing she is by technically dissecting one her songs.

Let me also point out, that one of the the things that makes Taylor Swift so popular is her "realness".... she could've opted to lip sync her live performance like so many others these days... her CMA "wet" performance was exactly that... a performance... and a very entertaining one, although I didn't the a "wet t--shirt" factor there. :?

Taylor Swift Song Writing 101

I have pointed this out many times to others, and as a KJ its easy to recognize. Taylor's music and lyrical syncopation is very non-traditional, and the way she hits a note, a beat and a lyric syllable is classic good song writing.... but then she changes up right in the same verse to a non-traditional style. At the very same time she also creates a vivid mental image, and tells a story:

Example (and sing it as you read it):

"I was riding shotgun with my hair undone,
In the front seat of his car
He's got a one-hand feel on the steering wheel
The other on my (unexpected pause) he-art"

How many karaoke singers have you seen tripped up by this sudden off beat lyrical change? Musically, this is fun to listen to because it keeps the listener involved and paying attention because you can't automatically anticipate what comes next.

Can you see the image she's created in your mind's eye? This is brilliant song writing AND dramatic story telling... and while it may appear to be simple... this is one of the most difficult things to accomplish with lyrical prose.... and here she has opened the story, and provided a setting (the car driving down the road) AND introduced characters (herself and her boyfriend) in four simple lines!!

Next verse:

"I look around, turn the radio down
He says, ?Baby is something wrong??
I say, Nothing I was just thinking
How we don't have a song... and he says"

As with any good dramatic story, you must introduce a conflict (we don't have a song)

Now, as she goes to the Chorus, in just eight simple lines, she introduces an attempt at conflict resolution while further fleshing out the characters in the story, their history, and giving us an idea of what their lives are like:


"Our song is the slamming screen door
Sneakin' out late, tapping on your window
When we're on the phone and you talk real slow
'Cause it's late and your mama don't know

Our song is the way you laugh
The first date man, I didn't kiss her and I should have
And when I got home, 'fore I said amen
Asking God if He could play it again"

For a story to draw in the reader it must have elements that the reader can relate to, and elicit an emotional response through the truthfulness of those elements. Certainly, this tale of young love has enough things for that. A person might remember things in their own life. I personally, get both a smile and a little misty eyed at the sweetness and innocence of young love here. A younger person surely relates to the song differently... thus creating a wider appeal for the song.

Next two verses introduce additional conflict and attempts resolution while further fleshing out the two characters:

"I was walking up the front porch steps
After everything that day
Had gone all wrong or been trampled on
And lost and thrown away

Got to the hallway, well, on my way
To my lovin' bed
I almost didn't notice all the roses
And the note that said:

Back to chorus, and then to the bridge to more closely define her conflict. Here, as with any good bridge to a song, she complete changes the rhythm and syncopation of the lyrics, while maintaining the lyrical style of the song AND continuing the story:

"I've heard every album, listened to the radio
Waited for something to come along
That was as good as our song"

Back to the chorus, with an additional "'cause" to finally resolve the story with a return to the first verse with a twist:

"I was riding shotgun with my hair undone
In the front seat of his car
I grabbed a pen and an old napkin
And I wrote down our song"

Musically, the song is Pop, with strong country influence through the use of traditional country instruments such as the banjo and fiddle... however, the introduction of the story elements raises this out of the the traditional Pop mold, and more of a folksong. In addition, the song is 3/4 time like a folksong, as opposed to 4/4 time for a pop song.

More importantly, the material of the story is very relateable, and appealing to the listener... as most people young or old can find appeal in a sweet story of young love. Furthermore, she amazingly maintains the three Act format of a dramatic story:

1: Introduce the setting the characters and conflict (exposition)
2: Attempt to resolve the conflict and introduce additional elements (Climax)
3: Resolve the conflicts, and bring the story to a close (Denouncement)

For someone to write ONE good song like this is amazing. Taylor Swift does it on a regular basis, AND the songs are popular and make money. Note that "Love Story" while a completely different song also follows the format presented above. THAT'S why she's won all those awards... and deservedly so... she's an amazing talent. I can't wait to see what she does when she gets some real life experience in her.

Cute too. :D

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 1:06 pm 
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DAYUM!! Nice analysis Koyote. I agree she will likely be around as a writer long after her singing career is effectively done. The only question that remains to be answered is will she be able to write songs that others will be able to sing? Right now I honestly believe that her songs would not be half as powerful (and therefore popular) if you had someone else singing them. What sells for her is the total package and that includes her humble nature as someone else mentioned. Even if you don't like her singing she's still an extremely likable person and has a good heart. It comes out in everything she does. That combined with her song writing make her and her music something that almost everyone can identify with.

In this way she is much like the Beatles. I've long been a believer that if you put those songs in the hands of any other group, they'd have gone nowhere. However, the Beatles' personalities along with some astute marketing and the song writing formed a perfect storm of sorts that lead to their explosive popularity.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 2:43 pm 
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Cute girl, she's got the package, hella good songwriter, bet she'd be a very cool person to know personally- she seems sweet, funny, and humble..... maybe, with more years and practice behind her, she'll get the "singing on key" thing more downpat.

I first saw her on Jay Leno when she was new, and I thought Holy #@%$ cow... she was gawd awful. But then, I've heard her other times where it wasn't so bad.

I agree with the fact that she's too cute all packaged up to just ditch her entirely... but then again, I really think you should be able to sing to be "a singing star". But like I said, maybe that will level out in time.

For the first time.... EVER.... I missed the CMA's. I'm in the middle of switching cable tv/internet companies and didn't think to go to my sisters. I didn't want to miss Miranda Lambert... she's my fav of the day. But I'd have liked to have seen it all.

:crying2:

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 3:25 pm 
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Taylor Swift is great at the crafting of words. Just like Koyote says. I do think she is more "pop" than country. Maybe even Alt, but not country at all. The performance on the CMAs, I didn't care for with the whole rolling around on the ground thing. I can appreciate her writing ability but I just don't care for the voice at all. Aside from my own personal feelings on this, I think to give her entertainer of the year is a bit much. So many others with better shows and vocal talent IMO. In concert, I've seen George Strait, Shania Twain, Sugarland, Toby Keith, and a bunch of other C&W stars.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 4:41 pm 
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Well, ya know, I didn't initially catch Swift's CMA performance as I caught it during the acceptance speech that Kanye interrupted. After watching it, I immediately picked up what the problem was, and its very typical of a live performance... which is why so many artists choose to lipsync.

It seems obvious that the stage monitors were poorly placed, and she couldn't hear herself well. Been there, done that myself... and been off key on a song I knew very well.

In addition, the music seemed poorly mixed... I suspect that the live performance came off much better... and the poor sound was a result of the "television mix".

The mix for a live performance is completely different than the mix for a broadcast... and its very difficult to mix for broadcast as your feed is a secondary feed coming from the live mix. How many SNL performances sucked over the years... even from artists who proved to be quite good (head over heels by the Go-go's comes to mind. My age is showing).

so, I wouldn't hold that performance against her... :D

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 6:53 pm 
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Whatever our opinion is on her singing talent, one thing is for sure, she is one of the most KARAOKE-FRIENDLY artist around. For that we all should support her and maybe more western artists will follow her method of releasing her CD album with a karaoke CD.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 7:24 pm 
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Jian @ Thu Nov 12, 2009 6:53 pm wrote:
Whatever our opinion is on her singing talent, one thing is for sure, she is one of the most KARAOKE-FRIENDLY artist around. For that we all should support her and maybe more western artists will follow her method of releasing her CD album with a karaoke CD.


VERY good point!

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 7:41 pm 
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Yeah, true Jian... actually, I don't see why most artists wouldn't jump on that. (wouldn't they reap the profit from it rather than karaoke companies, and wouldn't it eliminate some of the legal schmegal, since the cdg comes from the artist?) Hmmm... wrong thread Charm:)

I just got Miley Cyrus' "The Climb", was absolutely pizzed off, it's just the music track, and the only words on screen are "music break". :| I mean, I can use a printed lyric sheet to learn the song with, I don't need a "bouncing ball" scenario, so it's no big deal... but if I ever sing it out live, WHAT will I have to stare at while singing? Look the audience in the eye? *shiver*... no can do. :shock: .... :roll:

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 7:48 pm 
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BlueStainedShoes @ Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:41 pm wrote:
Yeah, true Jian... actually, I don't see why most artists wouldn't jump on that. (wouldn't they reap the profit from it rather than karaoke companies, and wouldn't it eliminate some of the legal schmegal, since the cdg comes from the artist?) Hmmm... wrong thread Charm:)

I just got Miley Cyrus' "The Climb", was absolutely pizzed off, it's just the music track, and the only words on screen are "music break". :| I mean, I can use a printed lyric sheet to learn the song with, I don't need a "bouncing ball" scenario, so it's no big deal... but if I ever sing it out live, WHAT will I have to stare at while singing? Look the audience in the eye? *shiver*... no can do. :shock: .... :roll:

Karaoke Version has it in karaoke format. They do a pretty good job. I got Journey's "After All These Years" and it is a great version.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 7:54 pm 
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karaoke koyote @ Thu Nov 12, 2009 6:41 pm wrote:
The mix for a live performance is completely different than the mix for a broadcast... and its very difficult to mix for broadcast as your feed is a secondary feed coming from the live mix. How many SNL performances sucked over the years... even from artists who proved to be quite good (head over heels by the Go-go's comes to mind. My age is showing).


I'm not sure what you mean by it's a secondary feed. In a situation like this, you'd use a splitter snake which would send the same signal from the stage to both the FOH Console and the Broadcast Console (the same way they also feed the console in monitor world). They're two completely and independent mixes with the same signals coming to them. I do happen to agree that mixing for broadcast is more difficult than mixing live, but it has nothing to do with where the sources of the the signal come from.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 8:22 pm 
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letitrip @ Thu Nov 12, 2009 7:54 pm wrote:
karaoke koyote @ Thu Nov 12, 2009 6:41 pm wrote:
The mix for a live performance is completely different than the mix for a broadcast... and its very difficult to mix for broadcast as your feed is a secondary feed coming from the live mix. How many SNL performances sucked over the years... even from artists who proved to be quite good (head over heels by the Go-go's comes to mind. My age is showing).


I'm not sure what you mean by it's a secondary feed. In a situation like this, you'd use a splitter snake which would send the same signal from the stage to both the FOH Console and the Broadcast Console (the same way they also feed the console in monitor world). They're two completely and independent mixes with the same signals coming to them. I do happen to agree that mixing for broadcast is more difficult than mixing live, but it has nothing to do with where the sources of the the signal come from.


What I meant was the feed is secondary to the primary mix.... you can't actually mix correctly for broadcast because the end output is completely unknown. One guy has a 1000watt surround sound system in his basement, and another guy has 1 speaker from his tv. Either way, the audio system from the TV will "remix" the mixed audio from the TV station... so what you hear at home is never like what the audio tech in the control room hears.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:39 pm 
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Ahh gotchya, now I see what you were getting at. And yes I totally agree that is an aspect of broadcast mixing that makes it more challenging (similar to mixing down for recording).

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:49 pm 
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Taylor Swift is a musical prodigy and deserves all the acclaim she has been receiving. I don't really dig her music, but its' pretty much pop country which is not my thang anyway. Even if I don't appreciate it fully, I can tell its' pretty d*mn good for what it is. Nineteen years old...

Broadcast TV has always had a tendency to make any live band sound like cr*p in my opinion. I think the engineers are usually just not up to the task of making live music sound good. It makes you wonder sometimes if they just have a mike out in the audience to get their audio feed.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 7:57 am 
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At the risk of bragging, it is possible to make a band sound pretty good on TV. Check out this video on YouTube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8pnhV02x-s

This is one of the local bands I work with on a pretty regular basis. They were on one of the local news morning shows a while back and we mixed them. The TV station basically handed us two XLR's (L and R obviously) to send them the mix from our console. So I posted this video using what I recorded with my DVR. Now of course it's only YouTube so they convert it to a pretty low quality video, but you can still hear how good it sounded off the air. If anyone's really that interested I can look to see if I can find the original WMV I created (It's pretty big).

A side story, and this is where the bragging becomes shameless (so look away if that bothers you):
I swear this is a true story. Before we went on the air, the control room engineer upstairs asked us to have the band play something so he could set his levels. After they started playing he called down to the studio engineer and told him to tell us not to play a CD but have the band play. His response when the studio engineer told him that was the band was simply "Wow".

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 9:20 am 
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I prefer Taylor Swift's music, Letitrip. No offense


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 9:59 am 
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DannyG2006 @ Thu 12 Nov, 2009 7:48 pm wrote:
Karaoke Version has it in karaoke format. They do a pretty good job. I got Journey's "After All These Years" and it is a great version.


Heyyy... thanks, I've never even heard of that place (as far as I can recall). They actually have 2 Miranda Lambert songs in the works that I've been wanting. (Dry Town... I didn't think they'd ever produce that one on karaoke, but it's in production... :oh yeah: ... and I'm anxious to try out the new "White Liar", which is also coming soon there) I joined up and got quite a few songs on the "notify me" list.

So, yeah, thanks...

I did find some video's of the awards show on YouTube. Wow, the Zac Brown Band sure did a number on "Devil Went Down To Georgia", that guy's fingers were like lightning on his guitar solo:)

No comment on the female performers I saw. (most especially a couple of TS's)

:|

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 10:01 am 
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letitrip @ Fri 13 Nov, 2009 7:57 am wrote:
At the risk of bragging, it is possible to make a band sound pretty good on TV. Check out this video on YouTube:


I'm no techie, lord knows I have enough trouble with my own settings on my home system... but it sounded good to me, thanks for sharing the link:)

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 10:13 am 
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Tony if you ever make it to my venue I hope you don't mind me asking you to help me with my settings. I'm afraid I'd put you to work. LOL Drinks on me. :D

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 11:02 am 
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BruceFan4Life @ Fri Nov 13, 2009 11:20 am wrote:
I prefer Taylor Swift's music, Letitrip. No offense


LOL None taken.

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