Karaoke Forums

I have no musical training whatsoever. I wouldn't know F sharp from B flat if my life depended on it..........BUT I do know that I need the key dropped one on the DK version of Bed Of Roses and dropped two on the Sound Choice version. The reason I know this is because I have tried to sing them both at my home and after trial and many errors, I found the adjustments that works best for me. Many computer driven karaoke shows don't list the manufacturer name with the song in the book so I don't know which version I'm getting until the logo comes up on the screen. At the last minute I may have to ask the KJ to drop the key one more step if I see the SC logo instead of the DK title screen. Does that make me a DIVA or just a knowledgable Karaoke aficionado? I do not BARK! I request.....and I rarely suck.....with the proper key change. Give me the SC version with no key change and I butcher the song. Some KJ's seem to worry about the lousy singer blaming them for being lousy singers. Why would they accept that responsibility is beyond me. The KJ should know that it is not their fault. One other funny thing about this situation is that almost ALL KJ's want EVERYONE to clap for EVERY singer, even th ereally bad ones, but they don't want to make adjustments for these same singers because they will suck anyway. I see that as a bit of a double standard. You want the audience to treat the lousy singers as if they are great singers but you won't give them the same treatment(sound tweaks) that you are willing to give the great singers....or you give it to them but resent having to do it for some reason.

Sorry, but I disagree with most of you.... If there is a singer that insists on bringing in their own discs (especially when I already have that exact track) and they start barking orders, then they ARE a diva.

You have to ask yourself, "why are these people here bringing their own music?" Are they there to "have a good time out with their friends?" or are they there because they think everyone loves to hear them "perform for the crowd?" From a business standpoint, I do not prefer the "disc-toting performers."

Granted that no one wants to have a "bad performance" of any song and that there are usually tons of alternative tracks and a host to clarify any confusion, but IMHO, it's about the same as watching someone at an amusement park who makes a big deal about bringing their own safety harness and helmet to ride the rides....

I've had some of these "performers" be the ones that bring their own discs and think they don't have to spend a dime in the place because they are "entertaining the crowd for free" like we should appreciate their gifting us with something substantial.

I don't have a problem with the person that might bring a single disc of a track that I do NOT own.... but I do have a problem with those that bring in a 100-disc Case Logic bag and sing strictly off their own discs all night.

KJ's want everyone to clap because it is as much an acknowledgment of the effort as it is the appreciation of a performance.... it's simply more of an acknowledgment than appreciation for the "challenged singers."

A KJ's job is partially to protect the "feelings" of the performer... If a KJ allows an audience to "boo" a bad singer then they are not doing their job. And from a technical standpoint, there are some singers that -no matter how much 'tweaking' you can possibly do - can't be helped with any adjustment on a mixer. A KJ is a technician as well as an entertainer, but we are NOT magician's. You can tweak all you like, it ain't gonna help in many cases.

All things being equal, I'd rather hear a bad singer trying earnestly to be a good one than a good one purposely acting like an idiot and sounding like a bad one.

So if you adjust the key for a singer, do you have to adjust it back for the next singer, or does the equipment automatically do that?

It depends on the unit. Almost all software players reset after the song, and the famous triple-tray does too. I have a "karaoke mixer" (spit!) which I bought which does not, and another which does.

Why would anyone get upset for someone asking for adjustments? I don't get upset, though it doesn't often happen. The normal run of KJ is pretty incompetent, and very insecure. They feel threatened, I guess, and get upset.

I don't often get compliments for the way I adjust at the time, in fact I can't recall one prior to last night. I had a girl singing Don't Stop Believin' (and doing a fine job, I might add) come up to me after the song and thank me for the adjustments I made. It wasn't at her prompting -- I just changed the reverb and tweaked the EQ like I typically do. She said "Thanks for the adjustments, it made a difference. I don't see many that pick up on it".

I do get all the time people saying "It sounds so much better when you are doing it" or "I have trouble hearing myself at the other show".

So if someone is the set and forget type, do they have *any* grounds at all for bristling when someone asks for an adjustment? Why would anyone get upset? It is pretty normal to run into KJs who don't do anything, and better singers might actually ask for something when they aren't used to getting it.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

How do I know that you have the exact track that I want to sing from before I leave my house to come to your show...and why is the singer always portrayed as BARKING orders when he or she is just ASKING for a little help????

People bring their own music because it is what they feel the most comfortable singing. If I'm used to singing BED OF ROSES from a DK disc and you have the Sound Choice version , I'm not going to be able to do the song as well because they are recorded in different keys. Why do some of you KJ's resent it so much that some singers want to do well and not just have fun by screwing up on their songs??? I'm a disc toting singer who went out Friday night in a group of 5 people who spent well over $200 on dinner and drinks. I'm sure the bar owner that you work for would love to know that you try to chase groups like that away from his bar because someone likes to sing songs that he is most familiar with.

I only bring a handful of discs with me when I go out to sing and would never bring a book of a hundred discs but why does it bother you if someone does? How does it negatively affect you if some singer sits at his or her table with all of their CDGs? Maybe they just don't know what songs they want to sing when they leave their house and they wait until they get to the karaoke venue to be inspired by what other people might be singing. Maybe it's a night where most of the crowd seems to be in a Garth Brooka mood??? It would suck if the singer left his favorite Garth Brooks songs at home and you didn't have them? Singers want to keep their options open. Why is that such a terrible thing to do in the eyes of a KJ? Do you feel that it makes you less of a KJ because you don't have every song in the karaoke universe? Nobody has every song and if a singer brings his own music and the crowd enjoys it; that is all that should matter. If the crowd doesn't like it, is it any different than if the singer sucked singing something from the KJ's library??? Sucking sucks no matter who owns the discs.

THANK YOU for making my point clearer Rosario- that's what i meant!

Of course we are there to make changes in every song and for every singer and that's part of the job, and i don't mind it, DUH Bruce, but making it more difficult to the point of it becoming ridiculous just gets annoying!

And STOP looking into my posts for things that aren't there and trying to pick it apart and find fault with it, like you do with everyone's posts. It gets OLD quickly friend.

IF you were a toll booth operator and people handed you money, great. Even the ones that need change, no problem. But YOU'D BE THE GUY that didn't pull close enough to the booth, wouldn't have YOUR money out,, would dig through your wallet WHILE complaining about having to pay the damm toll, need change for a hundred dollar bill, make the attendent step out of the booth to reach you, ALL THE WHILE making others WAIT ON YOU, and you wouldn't even be the wiser. EVERYBODY ELSE would just pay and go with minimal requirements, while you would NEED your hand held.....toll booth diva!!!

Bring your discs or not. Frankly to me it's just a few adjustments that are done in seconds. Not a big deal. You want it up or down, more or less reverb, I don't really care, I make the few minor adjustments (and that is what it is), which take only seconds to do and I have a happy camper. It's not rocket science, it's not a problem that takes hours to figure out. I don't know why hosts get all bent out of shape about it.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

Maybe, just MAYBE Tim we are doing MORE than just being a sound engineer. Some of the best hosts i've ever seen in action, and there are VERY FEW that can do it, are great multi-taskers and never miss a beat with:

1. adjusting the mix perfectly to what's being requested WHILE..

2. taking in new songslips simultaneously WHILE...

3. Answering questions about songs, how to sign-up, location of books, etc... WHILE

4. cueing up the next karaoke track or filler-song, eyc... WHILE

5. Reading the crowd or welcoming new people into the venue, etc....WHILE

6. remembering to announce future singers, bartendeds/servers names, drink specials every3-4 songs, karaoke schedules and the venue's name, etc...WHILE

7. SMILING, having GOOD BANTER, BEING PLAYFUL ,FUNNY, AND ENTERTAINING, DANCING, GREETING, THANKING, APPLAUDING...
and NOT missing a beat, all within the span of a 3:25 song WITHOUT REPEATING themselves too much! I'm sure i missed a few other skills!!!

with number 7 being the MOST dfficult to pull off and appear natural.

I would think it is indeed an ART FORM that takes years to accomplish without appearing stressed or bothered, or someone may have been born with these these type-A skills...MOST are NOT.

I believe that MOST kjs i've seen either waste too much time THINKING they're funny, are too slow in getting the next singer up, CAN'T READ the crowd properly to change and keep the mood upbeat, DON'T UPSELL the venue or their servers, BELIEVE THEY are the life of the party when the AUDIENCE ACTUALLY IS (they may need a kick in the pants every once in awhile).

SO I HAVE a healthy respect for those FEW that really have it down pat. The rest think they do but really don't. ALOT of us can/do ALL of these things, just not with constant FLOW of having it appear it's EASY, because it's not.

We all know exactly what we do but few compare it to the real pros or know what and how they do what they do. A LOT of karaoke shows out there are Crappy but could become better, but never great. An excellent Emcee or Host usually have uncanny skills that are difficult, if not impossible to duplicate.

and THERE is no instruction book on HOW TO BE the ultimate funny and entertaining host, emcee, technical director, stage manager, etc... that i know of.

Most kjs do their own thing, it is accecpted because there's no choice BUT TO accept it, don't venture out open-mindedly to the FEW GREAT SHOWS (where are they?) and LEARN instead of criticize them, in my opinion.

I expect now in my imperfect post that a few egos will shout back, but very few, if any, will admit to their own imperfections or shortcomings.

GRANTED, i have been deejaying 16 years, am semi-retired at doing this, have run karaoke shows for 10+ years, have been a professional actor/stuntman for 8 years, but I STILL DON'T have it down pat. It's nOT that i don't want to, I AM always learning new things, but maybe i need more THEATER classes or COMEDY TIMING classes to bring out MORE of the personality i already have. I definately NEED to learn MORE about sound equipment, but i CAN dance and instruct circles around most djs/kjs and can run a pretty fun auction event!

All in all...PERHAPS I JUST NEED TO BUY COMPUHOST!

As a singer, I have my own discs which I bring. Most of the shows I frequent have been disc generated, not many laptop ones. I usually do not request key change unless it's some really "far from my range" song. (Paradise? ) I would think that in a disc generated show, it would be easier for the KJ to just take my disc than go thru his library. IMHO, if the KJ is complaining about tweaking a few adjustments for someone, then the singer is not the Diva here.

Jesus John!!! Do you think that your show is perfect and can't be improved in any way??? Don't shoot the messenger. All I do is give my opinions from a singer's standpoint on how a karaoke show might be improved. It's amazing how defensive many of you get when someone points out that there might just be a better mouse trap out there. When I say something like "I don't like ANY filler music at a karaoke show", it doesn't mean that a show that plays some filler music is a horrible show and that I would NEVER go there because the KJ is clueless. It means that the show is a good show but in my opinion, it would be a better show for me, and some others, if they didn't play ANY filler music. It's not an insult to the KJ or his show. It is constructive criticism. If a KJ runs his rotation like Lonnie does, it doesn't make his show suck, but if he ran his rotation the way that Matt(knightshow) ran a rotation, I would have a better time that night. That is all I'm saying. being a KJ is not a PASS/FAIL situation. If someone makes a suggestion on how you might improve your show, it doesn't mean that your show is a failure. It just means that the person making the suggestion thinks that it could be better than it already is. I hope that it makes you feel better to try to insult me because you have deep seeded feeings of insecurity about your show. I'm sure that you run great shows. I'm also sure that there could be some room for improvement in just about every show. Someone else might think that you need to play more filler music while I might think that you should play less. So many of the KJ's seem to detest anyone suggesting that their show could possibly be better if they changed "something" whatever that "something" might be.

C,mon John, mixing is a basic. It takes a few seconds at the beginning. You still have more than enough time to do the rest. Sorry, to me, it's a cop out.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

Bingo! We're in a service business.. Anything thing that the customer wants me to do-that I can- I do. With a smile and a "no problem". Just a couple of extra seconds...

Customer discs? Don't know or prefer the versions I have available? Gee, I think my ego can take it.. I'm disc based, so this is actually LESS work for me- nothing to pull out.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Sometimes I think SOME people around here like to disagree with ME just because it's ME. Don't hate me because I'm usually right. LOL :D

I DONT ask to have key changes.

Often I tell them I need to have a strong bass groove tho.

Sometimes they dont have the volume or the mic up---so I tell them to pump it up(Most times they do that on thier own if they are not familiar with the song or dont know the strnength of my voice as they are pretty good mixologists).

My BELIEF is that a song should be sung as it was originally created---ie in the original key. To change its key is to change the character of the song and in so doing makes it sound odd, weird, funny and not what a person is used to hearing---it becomes something different than its original state.
So if Im not capable of singing in a song's original key or hitting the original singer's register then I simply wont do that song IN PUBLIC----I may try it and practice it AT HOME(like last night I tried Led Zepplin "Whole Lotta Love" and "Ramble On"............but simply cant get up into those high vocal registers like Robert Plant. So I probably wont ever sing those in public.

Now different arrangements I love----For example: "SUMMERTIME" on SGB-1 disc is about my favorite version of the classic eveyone is used to.
But this version is a swinging BE-BOP jazz version that NOBODY SINGS, much less has ever heard. And I'm always looking for that sort of song.
Another is on SGB-53 is "PURPLE HAZE", but its not the Jimmy Hendrix version everyone knows----its BUDDY MILES and has a very unusual FUNK groove to it.
Ill carry that disc with me also.

I will always carry discs with me.

LET ME REPEAT THAT: I WILL ALWAYS CARRY DISCS WITH ME!!
(no not a rediculous 300 disc carrier but a small 12 disc cd carrier).

THERE SIMPLY ARE VERSIONS OF SONGS THAT EVEN THE 375,000 KJ's dont have and have NEVER EVEN HEARD OF(try PITBULL "KULO"---Reggaeton music--Latin HIP-HOP---on the Latin OKE brand lable)

I've not found even 1 lappy based show that has THAT ONE. Yet its one I sing and havent once had a negative reaction to it by the either the KJ or Crowd. In fact they are usually AMAZED and ask me where I got that song.

From a KJ standpoint-----------I'm down with key changes etc---if thats what they want then thats waht Im there to do!

As to people bring discs---Im glad to have em! My only complaint is if they brign them all scratched and dinged up or with no label or some other physical damage.
Plus I WILL NOT CHOOSE THE SONG FOR THEM. AND THEY ARE REQUIRED TO FILL OUT A SONG SLIP. Other than that bring em to me all night long. The more the merrier!! This is what makes them happy and will keep them coming back to see ME AT MY SHOW and buy food and drinks repeatedly at the bat!!!

WHICH REALLY IS THE BOTTOM LINE OF MY JOB AS A DJ/KJ----KEEP THEM IN THE BAR ALL NIGHT BUYING FOOD AND DRINKS AND KEEP THEM COMING BACK TO THE BAR TO SPEND MORE MONEY BUYING MORE FOOD AND DRINKS REPEATEDLY AND BRING MORE OF THEIR FRIENDS AND FAMILY WITH THEM.

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

"Don't hate me because I'm usually right. "

Bruce----THATS WHY THEY DO HATE U!!

(Actually thats not HATE----Its REVERSE LOVE)

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

I have to do the same thing, the DK version is recorded 1 key down from the original version so I have to drop it 1 as well. The SC version is recorded in regular key and needs to be dropped 2 as well, although I prefer the DK version. This just shows you know which version you are using and the KJ should make the adjustment once you see the title screen.
If the kj's would list the manu info, there wouldn't be an issue. You would just write on the slip DK version down one.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Except for my JVC player, every other player i've owned automatically resets for the next song.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Nicely put! Adjustments are quick & simple to make.

Even if someone brings in a disc from the same manu as the version I already have, I have come across customers discs that have been redone for either bad swipes or sounded better than the version I have from the SAME manu - I have an original SC version of Family Tradition which the sound is not great, had a customer that brought in a new disc, same SC number, however the music is MUCH better so it was either re-eq'd/remastered or whatever, it was a MUCH better sounding version than the version I had from the same manu, same disc number. Doesn't happen often, but have heard the difference or seen the difference. I could really care less if I already have the song in my book, you want to use your disc, it's your time on the stage, I will let you enjoy it your way.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

As predicted, OUT come the Bob Hopes of the world!

Bruce, you sound like my lawyer! Although he's a good one, he has this uncanny ability to state one thing then contradict himself afterwards. GO reread the first and last lines of your post to me. One second you put words in my mouth implying i think i run a perfect show, then you talk of "deep seeded" insecurties i may have about it. Which is it? Have you been to my shows?

I am not a drama queen or king and you shouldn't be either.

YOU MALES here seem to gloss over what you want to read, attack ,then make it sound like you run a great show. HIGHLY UNLIKELY. The ONLY Show that has gotten RAVES about it that i'm aware of is Lonmans, and according to BFFL, his rotation method isn't perfect.I don't know, haven't been, BUT WILL eventually attend to see how it's done BETTER than most. THERE IS NO ONE perfect show, but room for improvement in ALL. Is Lonman an emcee with hilarious banter and an accomodating Hosting-style that keeps your attention and keeps you laughing between songs? I Don't know and i haven't seen posts that stated such. I WILL go to witness better sound, and pick up on things he does better than i do, but to HAVE FUN first! I would hope to have a moment to ASK him questions on sound.

I have dealt with MANY djs in my time who beleive they are the S#IT, onlt to be let down. I WILL TELL YOU NOW that MY SHOW is imperfect by far, but at least I'M HONEST, mature enough to admit it, will ask for advice, won't downplay someone else if they don't know something, and HAVE LOST my work-EGO in order to improve and get out of my own way. THIS IS HOW you succeed at getting better.

AND EVERYONE is at a different STAGE of learning. WHAT Lonman, DJTony, & LondonLive know extensively about sound took them YEARS of learning, testing, fiddling, and ASKING to get their acquired knowledge of such.

The writing skills and indepth understanding Karen K, Chip Staley, and Diafel exhibit isn't just college writing courses, WHILE most of you guys can't even SPELL the word ridiculous! THEY have many years of writing experience and have learned to be excellent in most of their posts, in my opinion. And YES, i misspell words..or is it mispell or misses spell?? Ha!

HOW MANY OTHERS have taken classes or invested years learning sound, acting classes or stage presentation, comedy classes, stage lighting, music history, and can COMBINE them all into a great show-NOT just pushing buttons and smiling like MOST SHOWS?? I know I Haven't taken MANY classes so my knowledge is limited!! SO IS YOURS! And NO, you don't NEED clasees, but they SURE would help you and give you pointers!

I've been to a few Mobile Beat Conventions and reluctantly took classes that were offered FREE to me and my djs. I thought this would be GOOD for them, but ended up learning A LOT of things myself, and applying it. Before,LIKE SOME of you here, i was getting (ego) in my own way and not being open-minded to learning more.

Admittedly, i too, gleen over posts as well, but NOT to pick apart someone and make them sound like an imbecile or foolish, but to quickly learn.

SO it would be helpful if some of you STOP STATING THE OBVIOUS, DUH-STUFF, like "making adjustments is easy", "i can do it no problem"," we are there to help the customers and make them sound good", and get past the karaoke-101 phase.

I may not be graceful at writing, but DON'T pick me apart like i'm a preschooler or a newbie. Enlighten me to newer more inciteful information!

My ORIGINAL POINT here was that although disc-bringers are welcome to my shows anytime and have always been, the ones that REQUIRE extra hand holding TAKE UP MORE TIME and require MORE attention, that's all. Can I Do it? Absolutely.

Should i vent about it? APPARENTLY NOT here on a karaoke forum where MOST of us experience the SAME exact working conditions and CAN RELATE, BUT DON"T, because they're too busy telling everyone how perfect they are!

No Offense to anyone in particular. Bruce nothing personal, but try and understand what someone is trying to say here, although not eloquently like me, but please stop adding Crap that wasn't even there to begin with!

Aloha everyone and i state all of this with L-O-V-E Love.