Karaoke Forums

HEY!--Forget about piracy for a moment

Can the current demand for Karaoke Titles be profitable for any Karaoke Mfg never mind 6 or 7?

In my own experiance and reading some posts here it does not seem like KJ's or Singers are spending $100's of dollars a month on new releases like in the past. The demand for the hottest releases seems to be "venue" specific. Most seem to be purchasing on customer requests versus release dates. In the past I know I would have pre-orders on the books and wait patiently for them to arrive ..not so today and hasn't been in quite some time. The new releases just were not getting sung.
Some will argue that any decent KJ must buy every release as soon as it becomes available no matter what it is or what genre. Again ..not argument for this post
Truth is people are not buying Karaoke CDGS like they did in the past.

So how can a company afford to pay FEES for every song and then record and produce karaoke tracks without the huge demand like in the past ?

***forget about piracy for a moment***
If Piracy was gone today ..those KJ's wouldn't buy discs anyway..The damage is done. What for the future ????

I agree with what you are saying to some extent. Piracy has diminished these companies bottom lines significantly. Historically there has always been demand for past libraries of songs (60,s, 70, 80s...etc). I can see the market still existing for enthusists and professionals. With a level playing field then the strongest survive that is the way of the market. If in the end we are left with only the Walmart slocky alternatives (Madacy) then that is what was demanded.

A second major contributing factor is the cost of licensing. The excuse companies like Sony have used to quintuple fees in Canada is the cost of administring the licensing requests. Without piracy there is some opportunity that manufacturers could afford to pay these fees for the more popular songs. If there were any actions that could be taken to help reduce those fees or make them prorated to the number of copies sold, I would contribute.

I have already done my rant on Piracy and what actions I plan to take on the topic http://www.karaoke-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=18320

Both these issues are the perfect storm that is killing this industry and hobby.

_________________
Terryoke
Krazy Kanuck Karaokeist

Karaoke is the only social disease that you can get in public and not get arrested.

I think that the karaoke manufacturers are counting on the home users to keep the industry afloat. I don't think that the average singer will buy the quantities that a KJ might buy but they probably don't know how to get them for free and they don't mind spending twenty bucks to get a disc with some songs that they'd like to sing. They're probably not interested in buying a hard drive that is loaded with songs that they will never sing either. The only problem that these home users face is the KJ that refuses to play a customer's disc. In that situation, the home singer may decide that it's not worth it to buy his own music if he/she only gets to sing those songs at home.

I tend to believe that the average singer knows better than most KJ's were to get music for free.
I know as a singer my main concern was getting songs I liked no matter what the cost. ( either custom discs or new releases when they cost $24 ). Hopefully singers won't stop buying discs just because there local KJ won't play them. There are options out there for those singers as discussed in another topic.

If KJs didn't know how to get THEIR songs for little or no money, THERE wouldn't be so many legit KJs complaining about piracy costing them gigs. Do you really think that Sound Choice isn't targetting KJs with loaded hard drives??? Do you think that THEY'RE trying to nail some guy in his basement with 100,000 songs??? How would they ever know what an individual has on his home PC that never leaves the house?

FORGETTING ABOUT PIRACY FOR THIS TOPIC

Well we all know that all SC has to do if file a lawsuit against the guy because they saw him with a computer and knows that he sings karaoke. Then they can send a letter demanding to "audit" his hard drive and offer him a "settlement".
Sounds fair to me!

PS. I hardly buy any new songs now. I will wait to until the end of the year and buy the ones that seem to be longer lasting and less of a fad. I think if piracy was no longer an issue then there may be new KJ's starting out who would buy collections and those of us who need to purchase filler music. That could keep manus going for awhile. Also, if they concentrate on producing the "good stuff" (ie: popular stuff) rather than "fluff", then perhaps they could sell more and keep production costs down, thereby increasing the profit margin.

I don't know if you can really exclude the piracy issue since that is the main cause of manufacturer decline here.
However, when the discs were being produced that people were actually requesting - and specialty type discs (ie 70's, 80's, 90's, Movie Madness, etc), then I would buy them. But now it's coming to the point where the manus can't recoup their costs so they aren't producing the amount of discs they once did (or go out of business altogether & sorry to say what you don't want to turn this discussion into is the direct cause) - especially in the specialty type disc or specific decade type discs (that haven't already been done to death). If the manus could produce these discs again with good frequency, then I would probably buy them - but since they don't & focus more on the newer music today, I have to be more careful in the selections that I choose - and it's usually alot fewer than has been in the past.
I have never been in the position that I would buy every disc that ever came out, I did the first couple years of my company, but quickly learned that buying what the customers wanted was key, however I would get some of those specialty discs that I felt could have some staying power along with customer requests almost every month. Now it's just a couple new discs every month & a customer request buy every 2-3 months now.

_________________
LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Well no one can say what is 'killer' & what is 'filler', what is hot in one area may be 'fluff' in another. I know SC had thousands upon thousands of requests for songs that haven't been released, i'm sure they went with the most requested songs before anything else when they were in a position to do so.

_________________
LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

They probably did, but you have to ask yourself, just how many different manufacturers for a given song does anyone really need. For instance, My Heart Will Go On, Jailhouse Rock (or any other Elvis song), etc. I'm sure that the manus created songs that really might have been better left undone and money better spent elsewhere since there were so many versions already out there. Just MHO.

But then again how many different burger joints or coffee shops does one need? Different tastes for different folks. You may love one manu and I may hate it.

_________________
You can be strange but not a stranger

I would be curious as to how many songs get released during a given year now as opposed to say the 70's or 80's. I would think there are more artists, more music genres, and probably more songs. But it also seems that there are less crossover songs, and less songs that appeal to a wide segment of the population. If this is correct, then it is not as good for karaoke, since they will sell less copies per song.

But now music seems to be written and marketed to smaller audience segments, for example, Young Country, Hip Hop, Adult-whatever. Has the creativity been channeled into ever-narrowing channels, and can this have a limiting effect on creativity? Is there even such a thing as pop music right now? Doesn't pop music, by definition, mean that it must have widespread popular appeal--that a majority of people, when they hear the song the first one or two times on the radio will say, "Yeah! That is a good song!", and hence you can fill a stadium with 60,000 fans at each city on a U.S. tour because there are so many people that the music appeals to. How many artists are there out there who can do that?

Here is another thought. Can a person be a pop star, without having a few very successful ballads--i.e., is the ballad the type of song that will always have the widest audience appeal?

okay, ramble mode off.

Has anyone heard the karaoke tracks on Taylor Swift's album? I imagine those tracks use the actual music, right? What does that take but removing the vocals? Doesn't require any additional manufacturing costs other than coupling them with some lyrics. ?? Do you see this catching on in the music industry or are there too many artists against karaoke to hope for this innovative shift in the craft? I'd love to be able to sing to the original music, and who would be opposed to it? It's the only frame of reference anyone has until a karaoke manufacturer changes it up.

I get a lot of my real music from Amazon these days, and karaoke tracks are becoming increasingly scarce. I need both music and karaoke tracks, and if they were on the same disc ... woohoo!!!!! Imagine the resale opportunities for classic albums if the karaoke tracks were included.

Well that is a gimme that each manufacturer was going to produce their own 'core' of the most popular songs, this would be against their benefit not to IMO. I was more talking about the specialty discs - like the decade discs (hits of the 80's, hits of the 90's, Movie Madness, one hit wonders, etc.) that are produced by this manu or that manu & not mass produced by all - which is what seems to be getting lost these days. Fewer & fewer manus are actually producing music that people actually really want & are trying to target the hit & run appeal of the newer music - probably because they can get licensing easier or the bands are new enough that they want their music heard - even if it is karaoke, or ??? Granted this is speculation on my part though!

_________________
LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

O/T - We have a different coffee stand every ten feet & they are always full - ok just seems like 10 feet. There was a joke about Starbucks that there are so many they are planning on closing the Starbucks in the restrooms of the Starbucks. There was on intersection in Seattle that literally had a Starbucks across the street from another Starbucks - and both were always busy. I 4 Starbucks less within a mile from my house, and three of those are in the same shopping complex!

_________________
LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

I'M SO GLAD THAT I DON'T DRINK COFFEE.....Maybe I should open up a chain of Pirate Coffee shops called SWASHBUCKS.

Lonnie you have all the Starbucks (thank God, what rauncy coffee) and we have Tim Horton's. Your Dunkin Donuts is ok.

_________________
You can be strange but not a stranger

I have a whole series of Motown discs where they did exactly that ... used the original studio music tracks with the vocal removed.

I know that the Party Tyme Karaoke discs are put out in cooperation with a record label and only their artists' songs are on those releases.

As has been said in another thread, more and more KJs are waiting for new songs to "take hold" instead of buying every month's CB or PHM disc. While I subscribe to a monthly music service for my DJ company, I'm keeping my karaoke current by getting the Supercore or Karaoke Kurrents update discs.

_________________
[font=Lucida Console]DangerousKaraoke.com[/font]
[font=Lucida Console]"Sing for the day, sing for the moment, sing for the time of your life!"[/font]

Mostly.... If you listen carefully to the version of "with you I'm born again" (preston and syreeta) and you'll find that it is actually a vocal mask. But the rest are pretty spectacular... being in the middle of "motown" we notice these things...