Karaoke Forums

I lost a gig to a fellow competitor who undercut me a while back and now the venue wants to hire me back after this bottomfeeder lost all my loyal following. Here's the catch... The manager doesnt want to pay my normal fee but rather a portion (half) plus a percentage of the "Z" tape above a certain amount at the end of the night. While the thought of a "comissioned" type scenario is alluring, I am rather hesitant because of one, the fact they replaced me to begin with. Two, it's been almost three months since I've worked there and I dont know how long it will take to re-establish myself and finallly, who do I trust with honesty and integrity that works there after what transpired before?

I will also add that this is one of my favorite places to do karaoke because of the wait staff and bartenders that worked there before (don't know about now).

I wouldn't go back under any condition but my own which would include a raise in pay most likely - like the place or not. They did it once, nothing to stop them from doing it again. The decision is going to ultimately be yours, do you want to do your regular show for less & HOPE they make money so you can get your percentage as well? It's possible as well you may not be able to build the crowd back up to where it was, karaoke singers are sometimes persnickity in these situations & may not come back anyway.
Percentage pay is very iffy and unless they SHOW you the Z tape at the end of the night, all they have to tell you is that they didn't make the "certain amount" so you only get half anyway. What would the percentage be - 5%, 10%, 25%.....? How would it be calculated - from the entire Z tape total or anything over the certain amount only?

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Tell the owner that you want $50 more than you were getting before. Take it or leave it. He chased the crowd away and now he wants you to "guarantee" that you can get them to come back. The risk should be his and his alone. Sounds like he wants you to undercut the undercutter's price.

I would NOT go back for less....same as before not a penny less. Percentages are tough - he chose to bring in an undercutter who ruined his business. Now he wants you to clean up his mess. No chance on the percentage. Either he wants you back, or he can go and find another sub-standard hosting company...continue to pay less, continue to make less. Sounds like an A1 jerk owner to me. I'm not very charitable when it comes to owners who try to take the cheap way out. Don't cheapen yourself by taking his offer.

Money talks, BS walks..

No cuts..

I agree with the others... DO NOT ACCEPT less than you were making before.... EVER!!!

If anything, this is your opportunity to ask for more than you were making before they replaced you. If they are not willing to pay you more, at least you have a start figure to haggle with, and get them to agree to your original fee (before you were replaced).

As for taking a percentage of the total in the register, I would never go for that. I have had Karaoke nights where there were only 3 people in the place. Aside from that, "Buy-Backs" (a NY thing) don't get counted in the tally. Also, you don't know for sure whether they are giving you an honest figure of the tally. There are just too many "What-Ifs" involved.

Thank you everyone for telling me what I already was thinking. Even though I loved the venue the manager boned me and he could possibly do it again. I will go with my original fee or politely take my karaoke elsewhere.

You are welcome but I don't know if you saw my earlier because someone deleted it & I don't know why.

I just said that to do a show for anything less than before would be INSANE!

I don't know why either. You weren't being obnoxious with your comments.

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The Line Array Experiment is over. Nothing to see here. Move along.

Thank you for pointing that out Danny as well as quoting me so if my comment gets deleted again, they will have to delete yours.

Can you see the big Ostrich in the room?

Ask for more, a lot more! And do it with swagger!

"Hesitate" to negotiate, but do negotiate and after doing so properly you'll get at very least what they used to pay you.

And best of luck!

I look at it this way:

I charge a FEE.... I'm not on a "commission basis" nor am I in a "bidding war" with any other person.

So I'd have to agree with Wayne, to charge less would be insane....

I recently went through this same situation. The owner decided to hire someone to do "acoustic night" instead of karaoke, which failed miserably. He tried it for about 2 months and then asked me back after the crowd ran away.
I originally asked for $50 more and settled on $25 more. I would NOT settle for the same or less. HE broke it by hiring someone else for cheaper and then realized he made a HUGE mistake when the crowds left en masse. He realized the value of my services, yet wanted to pay less or the same. By my way of thinking, he now knew the REAL value of my services and shouldn't balk too much at paying more. He didn't, and I am still there. It took almost a year to build it up to the happening place it was before, but it's finally back.
OH, and I would NOT do the "Z" tape thing. Your crowd is gone and with my experience, it took almost a full year before things picked up again. Could happen to you, too. Also, unless you actually see the tape yourself, they could tell you anything. I personally wouldn't want to bother with the possibility. They've already proved they can't be trusted... why would you trust them with something like this?
A flat fee is what I would go for.
A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

I would definitely demand more money, and if not more money, then the same money plus more perks. (food, drinks. gift certificates, etc.) As for commission, same as everyone else here says: NO WAY!

I would also make them sign a contract locking them into a full year with you that makes it clear that if they try the same crap again that they'll have to pay you for the duration of your contract. Normally I don't subject bars to these kinds of contracts and go on a week by week basis because much of my competition in the Tempe / Scottsdale area does and it makes bar owners uncomfortable, but after what they did to you and themselves already, I think you need that kind of protection from them doing it again.

Charge him original amount +.

The contract idea sounds nice.

DO NOT AGREE to a % arrangement under ANY CIRCUMSTANCES.

He can take it or leave it.

Yes, it will take about a year or so to REBUILD the crowd size that HE CHASED OFF.

He is now not to be TRUSTED, and yes he is PERFECTLY CAPABLE of pulling this nonsense again.

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

Just wanted to follow up and let you guys know that the owner did call back and he agreed to pay us our original fee instead of the commision thingy. He also signed a contract which obligates him somewhat and makes me feel a little better.

Thank you all who responded and made me stick to my guns instead of caving in. This forum is an asset to any kj.

So glad to hear that it worked out for you. Your business acumen is obviously something he respects, in view of his actions.

Great news!

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