Karaoke Forums

Do we need compressors in order to sound good? My local karaoke cafe shop uses DBX-266XL and DBX-223XL. What's your opinion on those? Are they any good?

You need compressors to keep a really powerful singer from blowing out your speakers. You can also use compressors to help keep the music at a common gain.

You don't *need* em per say, but it's better than having to adjust every single song, and every single singer. I just keep my mic gain kranked relatively high, and let the compressor smack down someone when they're singing too loud.

I originally started out recording music, so I applied this logic to my karaoke setup. WAY too many times have I seen singers scream or 'project' into the mic, severely over-riding the backing track, and potentially blowing a speaker.
I have a dual channel tube compressor with side chain input that I plan to use double duty to duck the filler music when I make announcements also.

The 223XL is a crossover unit not a compressor.

Like said it is nice to have one on the vocals to keep those that get a little loud in check without having to keep your hand on the fader every second. The 266 is a decent unit and is very effective, I prefer the 166XL as it also has a built in limiter which is also nice to have so once you have a set volume for the singer, it will not go any higher than that. What model tube comp are you using?

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

What's a tube comp?

Sorry I was referring to the post right above mine, tube comp - tube compressor.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

In my opinion, you need a compressor for Karaoke even worse than you do when mixing a band. The most important feature, as has been discussed, is the safety factor of having something in place to prevent excessive levels and clipping. This is particularly important in Karaoke because the input level from one singer to the next varies greatly. You don't have the luxury of a sound check to dial in the input attenuation of each singer to make sure the singer's peaks aren't running into clip.

As far as audio quality, it makes your mix a lot easier to control. Karaoke singers for the most part have horrible mic technique. The result is that the input level can go from a whisper of -30db to full on screaming that runs well into clipping on the pre-amp in a heartbeat. The compressor is incredibly helpful in making sure things are loud enough to hear the whispers while still controlling the peaks and keeping them from being too dominant.

A side effect of compression that's also very nice is that by controlling the peaks, you'll often times also find it makes keeping feedback in check just a little easier.

So as far as I'm concerned, for Karaoke a compressor is an absolute must,

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DJ Tony
Let It Rip Karaoke

I agree with letitrip, compression is probably the best tool you could buy, and learn to use, for karaoke. I would sooner throw away every disc with "Picture" and "Paradise by the Dashboard Lights" than do a gig without my compressors. Okay, maybe not much of a sacrifice...

It is important to know that compression has an effect on gain-before-feedback ("GBF") and noise floor as well. If you are into 20dB of gain reduction with a bunch of open mics, feedback may be the result. I have seen live sound guys make this mistake as well.

When I do regular karaoke for a private function where I'm being paid pretty well, or a "sing with the band" type thing I provide sound for on occasion, I compress the vocal channels going to the PA, but not to the monitors. This way it has minimal affect on my GBF. I use the limiters in my monitor processing to keep the screamers from damaging the monitors.

I have also seen a novice KJ fight feedback all night because he was trying out for my job on a house system and did not understand how to adjust the compression as needed. I think the bartenders there gained a new appreciation for me that night, as one remarked, "we never hear feedback when you are here." Probably why I still have that job and the new guy did not get hired.

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Jeff Wheeler, moonlight DJ/KJ

I continually ride the channel slider and in doing so, I've often thought of different means of signal processing but have yet to do anything about it.

I have read some information on this topic in the past but apparently I didn’t learn much (if anything) about it at the time. So I'm curious as to the placement of this processor in the signal chain.

Would I get the same performance if I inserted it in the mains between the mixer and the AMP? Compared to connecting it between the microphone(s) and the mixer; requiring multi processors? If the latter is the better choice, would I connect it in series between the mic and the mixer channel, or connect it through the channel insert?

And if there are advantages/disadvantages to either, what are they?

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EveningStar Entertainment & Events
JR & Michele LaPorte
Peoria, AZ

It's better to put on your mics on your individual mics if you are looking for controlling a loud singer - reason being is if it's between your mixer & amp, it will compress when that singer screams, however it will also drop the music volume as well so the screaming vocals will be what is primarily heard. If it's only on the vocals, then when that loud singer engages, it will only compress the vocal, keeping the music volume where it should be which is what the goal is to have a good balance between vocals & music.
A compressor on the final stage (between mixer & amp) for speaker protection can be used, but the ratios and thresholds are going to be set much differently than would be for a singer.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

You don't want to do that. The music is already compressed.


Through the insert. Most compressors have two channels, which handles your two main vocal mics. Should be enough.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

If you have more mics than compressors, you can also compress a group of vocal channels. Most mixers that have groups have insert jacks on each group bus, or else they have a group output that can be routed through a compressor, and back in on a different input.

This is not as good as one compressor for each microphone channel, but it is better than compressing the entire mix.

FYI the Behringer MDX4600 is a very inexpensive 4-channel compressor that is suitable for karaoke or entry-level band PA. It costs about $130 MAP.

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Jeff Wheeler, moonlight DJ/KJ

Micky I have to contradict you...

It's still useful to compress music. I'm sure you have these tracks for comparison. Compare Sound Choice's Billy Idol White Wedding to Zooms, and if you have it DK's.

Volume wise, SC's versions are always what I consider to be a proper mix. You can adjust the volume slider nearly all the way up and it won't clip. DK falls somewhere in the middle while Zooms is always near peak. This is pretty much true across the board on all their songs.

Different singers sing/scream at different volume levels, as do their background tracks. So it stands to reason dropping a compressor on the music track makes the same sense as it does for dropping one on the mic track.

Compression for purposes of normalization is different than compressing a final mix. I have a compressor on my main mix (as well as all mic channels). The threshold is high and so is the attack and ratio. It acts as a softer limiter which is what I want.

Compressing for purposes of normalization will have an audible effect on the louder tracks.

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DJ Tony
Let It Rip Karaoke

Yes, I found it on B&H Photo, Video, and Pro Audio for $117 (Incl. UPS Ground Shipping) Thank You.




So when the main mix compression kicks in does it have any adverse effect on the (already-compressed) mics?




Thank You. So that I’m clear on this then, I connect the output of my mic to a channel on the mixer as I normally would. Then connect the compressor channel to the insert of the mic channel with the applicable insert type patch cable. Is that correct?

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EveningStar Entertainment & Events
JR & Michele LaPorte
Peoria, AZ

The compression on the main mix doesn't have any adverse affects because the mix of vocals to music is already established. It only effects the final volume of the overall mix. So since I've got compressors on the mic channels there's not as much of a concern of a loud peak in the vocal channel causing the main mix compression to clamp down on everything. Quite honestly, I'm not sure that compressor has ever actually had to kick in. As I said the threshold (the level required before it kicks in) is quite high so that it only kicks in when the main mix approaches peak. My output level is usually in the -20db to -12db area so it never comes close to the -6db threshold that I have on that compressor.

As to connecting the compressor to your mixer, you would connect your mics as normal directly to the mixer. You would then connect an insert cable (1/4" single TRS to dual TS "Y" cable) to the Insert jack on the mic channel and to the input and output of the compressor. On the dual end (that connects to the compressor) the ends will be marked Tip and Ring. The tip is the output from the mixer (so it goes to the compressor's input) and the ring is the return path to the mixer (so it goes in the compressor's output). The ground (sleeve) is shared. So everything goes out and comes back in through one jack. I hope that makes sense. If not I can provide some good sources to describe it better.

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DJ Tony
Let It Rip Karaoke

It makes perfect sense. And thank you so much for that detailed description. It will serve me well.

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EveningStar Entertainment & Events
JR & Michele LaPorte
Peoria, AZ

You might consider buying a small "insert snake" for your compressors. This is basically several cables in an outer jacket that keeps them neat, and they will have nice labels and more professional connectors than the Hosa crap sold at many music stores.

http://www.audiopile.net/products/Patch ... heet.shtml
These are the most "fool-proof" kind to buy when your mixer has 1/4" TRS insert jacks, and the compressor also has 1/4" TS jacks. It will work with an MDX4600 just fine, and with any mixer that has the 1/4" inserts. The one I linked is a good quality 4 channel cable, and it costs about the same as buying 4 individual ones.

Usually the "TIP" jacks will go to the compressor INPUT, and the "RETURN" jacks will go to the compressor OUTPUT. But if your mixer is unusual, you just swap the connections on the compressor and it works right.

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Jeff Wheeler, moonlight DJ/KJ

Now that is just the ticket, Thanks!

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EveningStar Entertainment & Events
JR & Michele LaPorte
Peoria, AZ

Note that in this case "unusual" = British (at least in most cases).

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DJ Tony
Let It Rip Karaoke