Karaoke Forums

I am upgrading my Karaoke equipment. Just bought a Yamaha unpowered mixer MG102C.

I had a Phonic Powerpack 408 PA package. It includes a Powerpod 408 powered mixer and 2 speakers(80W each). I want to reuse them. Can I connect the output from Yamaha mixer to the Powerpod 408 and just use it as an Amp? I am thinking connect Yamaha Rec Out RCA to powered mixer Tape In RCA jack, will it work?

If this doesn't work, then I need to buy separate power amp. Any suggestion for Amp to push 2 80W speakers? Or maybe I should just dump this PA package and get Active Speakers.

Thanks in advance.

Well it's a much better mixer than the Phonics, however it does not have any effect built in so you will have dry vocals. You could run the outputs of the Yamaha to the Phonics, but there isn't going to be any advantage to doing so especially for effects.
Option C, dump the current package & get active speakers and an external effect unit. You will be MUCH happier than the power the Phonics is able to push and the sound clarity will be 75-100% better with a good powered speaker system.
New question, what would be your budget for a set of active PA cabs?
And I guess I should have asked what is the primary use of the system?

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The whole system would be for home karaoke.

The Phonic mixer is not good. That's why I am upgrading. I am willing to dump the current package.

I forgot to mention in my previous post - I have already bought a Lexicon MX-200 effect processor.

I guess my budget for active speakers would be a couple hundred dollars. Is that reasonable or I have to spend more? Any suggestions are welcome.

Well ok at least you have effects for the vocals. A couple hundred bucks wouldn't even get you close to 1 decent powered speaker so you may be back to your orginal plan of trying to run the tape out to the tape in - however, I still do not think you will be satisifed. Even going with a couple of 'cheap' Behringer powered speakers like the B212A would run you approx $500. Problem most likely was not with the mixer section of the Phonic - although it is a very basic system, it just is not very powerful, the speakers are small & can't push the nice clear sound.
You now have a decent quality mixer with a nice effect processor, hooking it up to the Phonic is not going to improve sound THAT much.

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If you're looking for a pair of inexpensive powered speakers for a home system, Musicians Friend has the Harbinger 12" powered speakers on special for $150.00. I know it's not JBL or Mackie quality, but for a home system they may be just what you're looking for. 12" and 180 watts with a 5 band EQ. You might also consider the 15" version for $199.99. 200 watts of power. Not over the top for a small home system. Guitar Center will match the Musicians Friend price since they are sister stores.

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My first choice IS Sound Choice.

A dumb question, the price listed in most of the online stores are for one speaker, not a pair, right?

Most of the time, if they are sold in pairs it will usually be reflected in the price as per pair or something, otherwise yes it's usually priced for one speaker.

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Is there a minimum requirement on how many Watts I need for home Karaoke? What about the minimum size, 8", 10" or 12"?

Is Behringer B212A good enough for home use? Are there any other recommended entry level ones?

Thanks in advance.

Technically no, there is no minimum watts required, minimum size needed, it's all going to be subjective to your ears in the long run and how much space you have to work with. Honestly good sound typically doesn't come as cheap as some would hope - as you've already experienced first hand with the small system you purchased and now want to replace. You now have a nice mixer, great effects, ( you didn't mention what kind of mics so i'll leave those out at this time) your speaker/amp combo is going to be your make or break for how it's all going to sound in the end.
What exactly didn't you like about the sound with the other system - let's go there for a minute.

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The Phonic system has 4 mono inputs. I use 2 for mic. I use the Tape In for music. There two things bother me,
1. When I sing, I feel the voice and music are not mixed together. Voice is voice, music is music. I don't know if I can describe it any better, but it just doesn't sound good.
2. The Phonic powered mixer has built-in delay effect. When I don't have music, I can hear it adds echo or delay to my voice. But with music on, I can not feel anything. The vocal sounds "dry".

I have two AKG D 8000 S mic I got from Musician's Friend about 4 years ago for total $49.99. So I guess they are not good quality by any means.

Recently I experienced a much better system at a friend's home, the vocal and music are blended well. There is also noticeable difference between with and without the external effect processor. He has
TC Electronic M350 effect
Shure SM58LC microphone
Behringer 1832FX mixer
Denon 3805 receiver
Boss 301 speaker.

So now do you think my problem is the mic, the mixer or the speaker?

Thanks a lot.

Instead of active PA speaker, can I use active Studio Monitor? My room is not big.

Try plugging the music into channels 3 & 4 - this will give the music the ability to be eq'd & turned up. It's not as convenient as having the music on one control, but the tape in is not really supposed to be used for mixing, it's more designed for fill for bands in between music sets, it has no other adjustments.

Again, try the music on the 2 other channels & see. If you aren't hearing the desired effect when the music is playing, you might not have the effect turned up enough - but remember you just want the effect to accent, you really do not want to hear it but notice if it wasn't there.

Well they are entry level mics, but should still suffice.

Mixing is an aquired skill, you want the vocals to cut through just above the music, neither should be overpowering each other. So try the new connections & see what that does.

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When I get my 3.5mm mini - dual 1/4" cable, I will try what you suggested on the Phonic. Of course, I can also compare it to my new mixer and effect processor.

Thank you.

I received the Yamaha MG102C and Lexicon MX-200. Now the music goes into the stereo channel. I connected REC OUT of Yamaha to Phonic Tape IN to use it as AMP. MX-200 made a big difference, the vocal sounds much better. However, I am still not satisfied,
1. music and vocal are not blended as good as I want. Any suggestions?
2. the whole sound doesn't feel like they fill the room. I use the two 10" speaker come with the Phonic Package. Right now I placed them on the floor. Should I raise the higher?

Or should I dump the Phonic package and change to something like the Harbinger 12" active PA speakers? (Choose Harbinger because of budget limitation). Or Bose 301 connected to my HT receiver like one of my friend has?

Thanks.

Again, mixing is a skill that needs to be learned - mostly by doing & what sounds right to your ears.

You can try to raise the speakers to where they are above head, however chances are it almost sounds like you want more - ie a sub. and/or more power in general - remember the Phonic only pushes 120 watts 'max' - to recreate the fullness of the bass the 10's cannot acheive. The more power you push, the fuller the sound will be at regular listening levels - as a rule, but it also helps to have good amps & speakers to begin with. The 120 watts & 10 inch speakers are not a great start for a PA (ever for home IMO). 10 & 12" speakers in most 'pa' setups are considered midrange speakers & not really set up for bass (fullness), now in smaller areas, they can work better, but still not MY first choice for MY preferred sound quality.
I do not consider Harbinger a very good candidate for anything, maybe for home use they could pass. But I have never heard anything good about them pro wise and can't imagine them being any better in a home setting so you will be crap shooting that.
I will never recommend a home stereo ie your Bose for example - for karaoke as they are not designed for live vocals and could blow if you push any kind of volume through them.

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Try cutting the midrange eq just a bit on the music channel, and boosting it just a bit on the vocal channel.


Without a doubt.


Personally I would stay with the phonic till you had a chance to save up for something better. The 12" Harbingers will be an improvement, but you would be better off buying something better.

And if you are going to use the Bose, just use them for the music and use the Phonic for the vocals.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

Thanks for all the great input. I really appreciate it.