Karaoke Forums

Karen, I actually disagree. Just last night I went to a show that charges 5 bucks just to walk in the door. Now, here it was a Wednesday night, and the place had well over 150 people in attendance. However, it was a contest, but it only involved 20 singers, that's it. The rest were there to support their favorite singers. And this place has been in business for literally decades, and STILL is the busiest bar in Salt Lake, by far. Yeah, it's the "norm" here for cover charges, I will admit that. Would it be better or busier without cover charges? who knows? My opinion is, if a couple bucks is gonna make you change your mind if you wanna enjoy a good night of karaoke, then by all means stay home. If a person can't afford $2-$5 cover, then they have NO business thinking that they need to be participating at a karaoke show. Principle? no, I think it's just being "cheap". A cover charge is just another way the owners need to pass on the expense of entertainment to the customers. Just my little ol' humble opinion.

But since cover charges are not the norm up here for karaoke, I think Karen is dead on. Your scenerio last night is different, it was a contest, the people that were not in the contest were there supporting those who were - so in a sense were there for the contest as well. I have seen contest 'nights' charge a cover, but again, it's only on a special night & not a regular charge. Like said, I can probably within a 5 mile circle find anywhere from 25-50 karaoke shows throughout the week.

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As you mention the bar has not been wildly successful without a cover charge for karaoke.

Sure the cover charge may only prevent a portion of the potential walking in the door, but unless you have the bar full (or close to full) anyway then a cover charge can only hurt.

Cover charges may work if it is the norm in your area, but unless your place has a great reputation (as a new karaoke show with a new KJ it is hard to have one) it is a natural response to go to a free karaoke show if there is one nearby as opposed to an pay one of unknown quality. In an area with lots of karaoke already it is pretty hard for all of the free karaoke shows to have a worse reputation than an unknown show that charges money to go in. It is not "cheap" it is just a natural response.

The problem with karaoke is that untill you reach a critical mass of people it is not much fun. If there is no-one in the club the next person in the door may leave instantly. If this continues for any period of time during the show it ends up a totally dead night.

I'm not saying that "free" isn't more appealing than a "cover", all I am saying is if a person can't afford a couple bucks, then why are they even going out at all? Yes, I will definitely agree that not having to pay is more attractive, but you will be paying one way or the other, whether it be in food cost or drink prices, YOU WILL pay. Now if a venue is being greedy? weeellll,,that's another story altogether now, isn't it? Here where we live, bars aren't on every corner, like some other areas. In fact in the county that I live in, there is only one bar, that's it. The population of the county is about 23 thousand or so, and is spread out for about 60 miles from the north to the south, with all the towns down one highway. The percent of "bar-goers" is very small, at about maybe 5%. and i'm being really generous at that. As far as the rest of the state, it's not as bad as it is here, but still percent of "bar-goers" statewide, it's probably about the same, maybe a tiny bit higher. In fact, people who even drink, is only less than 15%. Very had part of the country to try and make it in the bar business. And then you top it off with the fact we have some of the strictest liquor laws in the country.

So, now you see why it's quite normal for bars here to try and recoup some of their costs with something as simple as a cover charge. Other parts of the country are probably not having to deal with the same philosophies and attitudes towards bars and karaoke as they do here. I hope not, it's tough going here. Hence, the reason I travel as many as a 100 miles one way to host a show.

Both cover charges and minimums are rare for karaoke. Why?

1. All too often, Karaoke singers are non-drinkers, and therefore non-spenders
2. Too many singers think THEY are the entertainment and that they shouldn't have to pay while they are entertaining others
3. Some karaoke singers like to hop from venue to venue to game the rotation
4. KJ's don't believe in them, as a rule

But I have seen, though rare, successful shows with minimums or covers.

I think if the managment comes up with the right mix of ingredients, it's definitely worth a try! Personally, I'd recommend working with a small minimum to start of $5 per person.

So you have your choice --average karaoke bar and experience for FREE or an exceptional Show and a great establishment for $5 cover?

I can't believe all the singers that complain about one thing or another who wouldn 't pay $5 for a night of no complaints.???? ( using the OP scenario of a great place)

One advantage of the cover charge is that it would probably entice people to come to the show early. It would discourage people from barhopping or straggling in at 1:00 in the morning, because who would want to plunk down $5 for an hour or less of music?

I have 3 weeknight gigs, all five minutes from my home. On two of those nights there is one other place in our small town with karaoke. Within a 5-mile drive there are 3 more places, 2 with karaoke on two of my nights. There is another place in that same area that runs Fri & Sat. People DO bar hop so a cover just wouldn't work. Just as singers vary, venues vary, and towns vary. Feel bad for you - a great part of your earnings go to pay for fuel I would think.

The problem is that in my oppinion many karaoke shows are not very good. Unless I know how the show is going I dont know if I am going to spend the time to sing at a show.

Many a time I walk into a bar get a negative vibe on the place and may be gone in 5 minutes. Some times it is just to check if some of my friends are there or not. Other places I may spend several hours. If people are going to shop around for a bar that "feels right" for them and the mood they are in, they might have to visit a few different bars.

If your style for going out is to visit one of several possible bars and chosing only one of them to spend a few hours at one of them while only checking out the scene for 2-5 minutes at 3-4 others a cover charge begins to be annoying. If you are going to pay a cover charge at a bar that you think you only have a 1 in 5 chance to spend the night in, then eventually you and people with a similar attitude will start frequenting bars without cover charges.

Of course this only really applies to a situation where there are several bars within close walking distance, and it is a matter of chosing among them,

That's probably also the opinion of the management since they already had 2 different KJs in there who, in my opinion, do pretty good shows. They might well want someone who's a little more personality-driven to be as more of an "attraction" than just hanging out a "karaoke" sign. It's one of the reasons I've been branding myself as much as the karaoke entertainment I offer.

I also agree with the "bar hopping" scenario. At most karaoke bars someone will come in and if they think there's not enough people there, or it's not their scene, they have no money invested and will immediately leave. If you pay a cover, chances are you (and the friends in your party) will stay for at least one drink and one song. This place is definitely a "destination" on a Sunday night; there's no other karaoke competition in the area.

This venue - and again I call it a "venue" because although they serve alcohol, it's not a "bar" in the traditional sense - is challenged to attract a crowd on nights other than for their dueling piano show. I don't doubt that their new management is committed to making this work and would be willing to try other types of promotions if the 25-cent beer thing isn't packing them in.

Some things are beyond my control, but I'll do everything within my power as talent to make it work. The proof is in the register ring. We'll find out soon...the first show is on 2/21.

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In that case, IMO, people may come, pay the cover & find out it's not for them & not return & tell their friends not to bother.

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My thought Lonnie.

The scenario from Dans original post is this :
huge performance stage
concert-quality house sound
downtown entertainment district
wants to make a name for this place as a karaoke spot

I would say this is NOT your typical dive bar out in the rural sticks.
It appears the manager wants to make it the "best karaoke show" in the area.
for that experiance some people might pay a small cover charge.

But for a cover charge the venue has to deliver an EXCEPTIONAL karaoke experiance.

Here's a Quarter, by Travis 2-Bits

You say they were wrong to make us pay a cover charge
You're upset, you're eye sheds a tear
And you say that your budget--see it just ain't that large
Well, here's a quarter, buy someone a beer

Buy someone who's thirsty, and might give a darn
Treat someone you haven't treated all year
But, don't you come 'whining about this new cover charge
Here's a quarter, buy someone a beer

We thought that your wallet would never run dry
Now it's empty the worst of our fears
But I've found this coin, girl, underneath the barstool
So, here's a quarter, buy someone a beer

Repeat Chorus

Yeah, here's a quarter, buy someone a beer!

With apologies to Travis Tritt

We charge $1 per turn on stage and sellout almost every weeknight, always on weekends.

There will always be complaints. Your perfect "great show" is not always going to be my perfect "great show". People are different, and their wants from a karaoke show or venue are different. I have seen many busy shows that have good followings that I would never return to. There is no formula that makes a show great.

I have left early from many a show that others thought great and enjoyed other shows while others have left disappointed.

Just because they charge $5 does not make them better, just more expensive. They might be better (for me) but that remains to be seen.

Dan:

In summation, here's what you have been told:

If you have a cover charge and people don't like the place/the KJ/the size of the crowd, they might go and tell others!

Might they also tell others of the same complaints if there weren't a cover charge?

If you have a cover charge people might go to one of the other venues that have karaoke and don't have a cover

Might they also do that regarding any venue that has a cover charge when there is entertainment?

Just because one person thinks the show is great and would willingly pay a cover doesn't mean everybody else is in agreement about the quality of the experience and the required cover

Is everybody willing to pay $100 to see Bette Midler? And how long has she had her Vegas show now?

So, it seems that we have kicked the possibility of charging a minimum to the curb and have focused on the "dreaded" cover charge.

Well, Dan, consider that the venue might not want to actually charge the "cover charge" or "minimum" right away. But... the venue could let it be known that there is a "charge", and the charge is being waived at the moment as evidenced by a "coupon" or "token" or a "wave of a hand"

THINK OUT OF THE BOX!

Tovmod, I actually paid $150 to see Bette Midler when I was in Vegas last New Years and I found it worth every penny!

The more I've been thinking about this, the more I'm intrigued.

Consider the recently-opened movie theater in the Seattle area called Gold Class Cinemas.


How many people would find value in a $32 ticket to see a first run movie on a Saturday night when every other movie theater is charging $10-$14? Those who want to sit in their own recliner instead of a sticky padded plastic seat. Those who want waiter service to bring them upscale food, drink (and alcohol). Those who are happy to pay a premium for better picture and sound. All those things contribute to the overall enjoyment of the movie - not to mention the feeling of exclusivity?

Might the same thing apply to karaoke singers who can afford a paltry $5 to sing in an upscale venue? A karaoke spot which ostensibly screens out the "rabble" who'll show up at the no-cover dive bar in favor of a more upscale venue with great sound and a big stage and premium food and drinks?

You can see it as either madness or genius. The proof is in the register ring which will become apparent soon.

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I think if done well, there could be a market for it. You might even attract some people who might not normally sing karaoke in a typical venue.

As far as the theater goes, I wonder if it is big screen or shoebox. I don't see a lot of movies, but for the few I see, I might be willing to spend a little more, though I think the Remond price is a little steep. There are probably a lot of movie goers that just want a slightly more upscale place--one where you don't have to pry your shoes off the floor when it's time to leave, one where they use real butter on the popcorn.

It reminds me of relatives who used to talk about the great service they got on the old Northern Pacific Railroad. The baked potatos alone were to die for. There is a real need for qualtity and good service, and not always keeping both beady eyes on the bottom line.

Thought I'd chime in with my 2 cents.....

I'm in the Houston area where karaoke is plentiful. There is a spot here in town that is similar to what you describe called Spotlight Karaoke. They have a strict dress code, and the drinks are on the high end. They charge to sing, or you can sing free with a two drink minimum.


There used to be a place out here called 'Midnight Rodeo' They offered 25 cents drafts, 50 cent wells, and $1 longnecks. Cover Charge was between $5-$10. I think if you were under 21, they charged more. Anyway, they eventually closed down. The clientele was mostly 18-25. They tried to raise the drink prices back up since they started losing money, but ended up losing all the cheap drinkers. They closed down shortly after, and that was when the economy was good.


I like the idea of a two drink minimum to sing and regular-priced drinks vs a cover (non-drinkers could purchase soft drinks) Keep in mind that not all people at the karaoke show sing. Some are friends of the karaoke junkies and just there to have a good time. If he wants to charge for the stage experience, he might upset the non-singers who may, in turn, convince the singers to go to a place without a cover since they are not reaping the benefits.

On a personal note, I would not pay to sing no matter what the venue looked like. As a singer, I care about the sound system, a fair rotation, and a KJ who knows how to run sound. The size of the stage and the look of the bar are unimportant to me.