Karaoke Forums

Okay, there it is--new thread, old question. May even be a repeat of an old thread. We await the definitive answer. Thanks in advance, as they say.

Old question, old answer. NO DOWNLOADS are legal for use in a show by a U.S. based Karaoke Host. Kurt Slep has even concurred, and because no combination license has or ever existed, no one- despite disagreement- has ever been able to produce such a document.

Also no manufacturer has the legal right to give permission of any sort to use downloads in a show- not in their jurisdiction.

If they say it's ok, that only means that THEY might not come after you.

That's as definitive as it gets, and until someone can produce a combo licence document from a source that can be checked with government agencies, it's a fact.

Also, if and when it DOES become legal here, a text file would have to be downloaded with each track to confirm that track's source and legality for use in the U.S.

_________________
"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Sorry, Joe, I should have clarified. CB rep said he would answer this question himself if I would start a new thread.

Gonna have to stoke to fire and beg to differ. There are no laws explicitly stating that using legally purchased downloaded songs in a show is against the law. It may be against the licensing terms.... but that is not a law per say, more a contract. Using downloads may place you in breach of contract... a civil matter, not a legal / illegal one.


Jonn

[Edited to change 'now laws explicty' to 'no laws explicitly']

Let's stop driving ourselves crazy with all this legal mumbo jumbo. Here is Tricerasoft's position, taken from their website:

It is our position that you have the right to make copies and/or transfer your original songs to any alternate media or storage system for playback provided that ONE and only ONE copy is used for performance at any one time and that all copies must be controlled so that no illegal copying (ie passing on of any of those copies) can occur. Make sure to lookup information in your region on any Performance licensing and/or digital hard-drive licenses.

I didn't mean t start the argument again--I wanted to hear the response from the horse's mouth and was asked to start a thread in order to get a reply. Evolution of threat is below.


Posted: Yesterday at 3:19 pm

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Replying to questions/comments further up the thread:


Quote: (Lonnie)
Curious, if I download a song from Chartbuster, can IT be played in a show, provided it's only being played in one show per download?

(reply from Chartbuster)
We have the rules on our site if anyone needs to review them. I will refrain from posting the URL in case it is in violation of the forum rules (it might be interpreted as a ploy to send people to our site, and I don't wish to offend). Look for "Terms and Questions" on the left-hand column of links.

leopard lizard @ Wed May 26, 2010 5:28 pm wrote:
Chartbuster, is it possible to get a yes or no on here as to whether your downloads can be used in a karaoke show? Many people have been to the site looking for that answer and for some reason can't seem to figure out where it is or what it means. It has been argued back and forth on here in the past which is why we were all so curious as to what you would say.

(Reply from Chartbuster)
I'd be happy to answer that question, but please post it in a separate thread since I don't wish to thread-jack this one.

Exactly, let the question be answered from the manu it was posed to.

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Can this question be asked of just one MFG? -- Is the question is it LEGAL or is the question ---Willl Charbuster LOOK THE OTHER WAY on a 1:1 foranmt shift?.

The LAW whatever it is is the LAW ... Charbuster - Soundchoice or whomever can't decide it does not pertain to their discs. They can decide not to litigate against you for NOW...but what happens in the future if minds are changed and now they decide that NO FORMAT SHIFTING is accepted.

This question CAN NOT BE ANSWERED by anyone other than a LAWYER who can only interpret the law as written.

Oh by the way ....Let's start at least 3 more discussions on this suubject becuase I think the HORSE is not quite DEAD yet

Sound Choice and Kurt can comment on .... Sound Choice's position on the matter. Obviously their is legal opinion is just one of many that have been presented on the larger picture of legal downloads.

The company Soundchoice has not sold the rights to sell downloads so obviously he considers downloads illegal OF SOUNDCHOICE songs. In this he is correct.

Clearly Chartbuster has sold the rights to downloads considering that they sell downloads from their own site.

Therefore the difference between soundchoice and chartbuster is significant.

Zoom, SBI and Sunfly clearly sell downloads as they can be purchased either directly or by links from the company websites.

It would appear to me that performance of a legally purchased downloaded song is ok to use in a commercial karaoke setting. The question is that is that downloaded song legally purchased is important. For sound choice, their position is no, they do not sell downloads. But that is a business decision based on soundchoices business model, NOT the legal rules.

If you DO intend to use MP3 downloads in a karaoke show, just be sure to keep all of your purchase receipts.

Common sense goes a LONGGGGGG way in these laws.

All that the artists and manufacturers want is their legal cut of the $$$. And the only reason manufacturers oppose MP3s is because it is easier to leave them out of their cut!

As a KJ, make sure that you are ONLY buying CDGs and downloads from manufacturers that pay their licensing fees and ALWAYS keep your purchase receipts, which any small business should be doing anyway!

Follow those SIMPLE, COMMON SENSE steps, and no judge in the nation is going to hold you liable for anything!

There, the debate is over. No more discussion

_________________
C Mc
KJ, FL

Can I get an A........MEN!

- Jonn

You can get a purchased in good faith...

New thread, but an old and still UNANSWERED question up until and including my post!

While Chartbuster has already stated it's position it has also indicated a willingness to clarify its position on this forum, hopefully with the definitive answer that you requested. And towards that end you were asked to start a new thread devoted to their response!

So far, Charbuster who has the knowledge that we are seeking has as yet to respond to this thread. But just look at how many others have! And which of those others have clarified Chartbuster's position regarding the matter?

Yeah, it's so typical. You all deserve and I will give you a, A-What?

Mr. Grimes please save this thread and respond to leopard lizard before everyone on this forum hijacks this thread and we'll have to start another one!

Stoke away, and then post a copy of the combination license that is required in the U.S for such a purpose. Not having such a license is the same as piracy- a federal offense.


The license - which has NEVER been drafted, would include, Fix, Recording, Sinc, Commercial, Digital, and Promotional rights- ALL agreed upon by ALL parties involved. Good luck, and waiting to see it.

_________________
"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Please Note" "Their Position" is not a legal statute, only their way of saying that THEY have no problem with it.

Again, even SC acknowledges that downloads are not legal for U.S. based hosts.

_________________
"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Again, please post a copy of the reqired combo license, as well as the text document of licensing that would have to be downloaded with each track for legal verification of the source and licensing of that track. Thanks in advance.

_________________
"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Tricerasoft is a Canadian based company, could that make a difference

(Apologies Joe for my typos (now corrected) in my original post)

Basically my point... if there is no license to do these things then you don't need a license to do these things. As soon as someone comes up with a license then we can be in breach of it. You cannot be in breach of something that doesn't exist.

I know we'll never agree on this issue until either a license exists (such as the Digital DJ license in the UK) or someone with a legally bought and paid for song library that has been format shifted goes to court and wins / loses. (Long range weather forecast does not include a cold day in hell though)

- Jonn

Here's the way I see it...

When you purchase a karaoke song(s), you are purchasing the right to use and play that song. It doesn't matter whether those songs are delivered on CD's, SD cards, or VHS tapes, you are buying the song, and not the media it's stored on.

Now, how I choose to play the song(s) that I have legally purchased is my option. If I want to play it using my CDG player, laptop, cassette player or whatever, is my right. There is no law that says that songs on a CD must only be played back on a CD player. And if there is a law, show me. Not speculation, not someones interpretation but the actual law if one exists.

Do you see how ridiculous this is, If I buy the CD, it's fine. I could format shift and use it in my shows...if I download the same songs that are on the CD, I can't use them in my show. They suddenly become illegal. Is that the most stupid thing you ever heard.

All I know is we are the ones buying thousands of dollars worth of karaoke songs from the manus but this whole legal thing is crazy. And personally I don't care.

In the meantime, and until definative laws are written or court rulings regarding karaoke are defined, it's very simple...

Legally buy your music, keep your receipts, and use it in your shows.

End of Story.

Wont work.

It wont be policed
and
Every pirate in the country will buy a license.
Suddenly they are legal...