Karaoke Forums

So, if I am to understand this correctly...

1. We can use downloads from CB's website in our shows providing it was downloaded on the hard drive that will be used to run these shows.

2. We can NOT rip tracks from the the legally purchased karaoke CDG's that we own and use these tracks on a hard drive to run our shows.

If this is the case, then just about everyone here as well as just about every KJ across the country is breaking the law. Or at least, CB's law.

Chartbuster can you answer a simple Yes or No question. Just a Yes or No, please.

Will Chartbuster Karaoke allow us to format shift legally owned CDG's to hard drives/laptops and use them to run our shows? Yes or No

Alan, You are asking a person with a gag to answer your question.
CB is no different than the rest.
No manu's have rights that others don't have.
Using any media to do a gig is not legal.
It is very BLIND EYED.
The chances are it will remain that way.

I am asking because Sound Choice publically said... they would allow format shifting...

"Slep-Tone only sells its recordings in CD+G format. Slep-Tone authorizes
its customers to “format shift” and transfer the contents of a genuine SOUND CHOICE
CD+G recording to a single computer or MP3 player, provided that the customer keeps
the original copy of the CD+G in his possession as an archival copy that is not used".

I just wanted to know if Chartbuster felt the same way.

So, again I ask Chartbuster to answer the question posted above with a Yes or No answer.

Thanks
Alan

Alan, it is such an iffy situation.
SoundChoise have boldly made a statement.
It is one they hope they get away with.
SB could do the same but remain cautious.

None of them are able to (although they want to)
Make the claims we want to hear.

What's the hard part here? He was perfectly clear:

"
From our website: "You are allowed to make a single copy of your Chartbuster Karaoke discs for archive purposes only. Please note that this does not entitle you to use those backed-up tracks for any other purpose than as a back-up, including playing, sharing, distribution or performance.

"Karaoke shows that use tracks stored to a hard disk drive are doing so in violation of the Chartbuster Karaoke license printed on the original disc....."

This means that though may download it, it is for backup purposes only, and for personal use only. Can't be used in a show.

Even if the law said it could be, the second paragraph states that Chartbuster does not license THEIR music for use in a karaoke show. Clear as a bell. What's the question?

As for the "original disc" that the download is copied to- that's a foot shuffle.

1) What he's not saying is that if you use downloads instead of mfrs. discs, the license responsibilities now fall on YOUR shoulders. If you were questioned, YOU would be responsible to prove that the music is licensed- an a receipt of payment won't do that. When you have the original mfrs. disc, that responsibility stays with THEM.

2) There is NO "original" disc here. If you download a digital track, and you copy it to a disc, you are media shifting, just as if you were ripping a disc to a PC. You started with a digital download, and that's what you still have. Just putting it on a disc changes nothing.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Don't you just love the BACKUP DISK.

Not like any backup I can describe.
I guess you can always look at it.

I'd like to thank CB for the ambiguous comments. I know they want to say more but they have their hands tied as to what they can say. As always I think a modicum of common sense applies. If you have an original disc for each track on a performance hard disk you 'should' be safe from the manufacturer (no sensible manufacturer is going to sue someone who is a steady source of revenue) If you have a receipt for every downloaded track in use then you 'should' be safe from the manufacturer. If the music publishers / other associations decide to come after us they may, although I suspect they would be hitting up all mobile DJs not just karaoke.

In short we will all continue to run our business as we see fit, living by our own morals and altering our behavior based on the behavior of others. If CB begin a process of suing those who have uplifted from CD to hard disk we will either start using discs again, stop using CB or simply give up on the whole karaoke thing.

My conscience is clear, hopefully my court record will remain that way too!

- Jonn

Let's just use Taylor Swift as a perfect example of an artist who is making up the difference between what physical product used to bring in, and what the pirates can take out, with a few extra dollars of production cost to create their complete albums in karaoke version. Just makes so much sense.

Lol! I was wondering. So if something happens to the original, then the backup isn't a backup?

So far most of what I've seen is a bunch of crap! IF WE ARE HONESTLY TRYING TO DO THE RIGHT THING AND ARE NOT BUYING A LOADED HARD DRIVE, GIVE US A BREAK.

Having said that, have any karaoke hosts been targeted, sued, convicted for piddly crap (iffy) instead of blatantly screwing over the manus?

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

To me, this make sense.

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

To me making back-ups (either on disc or hard drive) is no different than using a colour copier to photocopy $100 bills. Just because the technology is there, doesn't make it right. Imagine, you lost some money somewhere or it got burned in a fire, does that mean you can go home and get your "replacement photocopied money" out and spend it? Afterall, you did earn the original so you should have the right to spend the "replacement money".

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You can be strange but not a stranger

Interesting argument, but on the other hand if you have US paper currency and you manage to accidentally tear part of it, as long as you have the bulk of the bill you can take it to a bank and exchange it for a fresh new bill.

Or you can go put your bill in the bank and use a credit card or debit card which might be looked at as somewhat analogous to format shifting your money. Just playing devil's advocate you know?

Still, I feel rather frustrated in what I'm reading here because I waited for years to go to the computer and only did so AFTER Sound Choice said that format shifting was ok with them in a formal statement. I figured if it was ok with them it was finally safe to do it. Now after spending hours converting my discs and spending hundreds on Compuhost I can't use them? Grrrr.

Then there's the idea I have to have a receipt for every single disc I have. I did pretty well with everything I bought starting out, but then I got married and my wife had a rather large karaoke collection which she brought purely for her joy as a karaoke singer thinking that someday she might start a karaoke show herself. Needless to say she didn't keep all her receipts. Now we're married and the karaoke manufacturers want to tell me that I can't use the karaoke discs my wife brought into our marriage now? Grrrr squared.

Maybe I just need to sell off my current stuff and use it to buy up a bunch of discs from DK and other DEFUNCT karaoke companies so I can do what I want with MY own discs?

If I buy a U.S. Savings Bond and I make a photo copy of it to prove ownership, I can then get a replacement if the original Bond is lost or stolen or burned in a house fire.

Or claim insurance... which is what a BACKUP disc is - INSURANCE.

A backup disc is NOT insurance, it's a copy. Further the vast majority of manus have a replacement policy for defective discs. Just like most manus of just about anyhting have a replace/repair policy for defective products. I will still stand by with just because the technology is there it does not make it right.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

You're entitled to your opinion and I mine.

I just love how you only read and post what you want to see not the whole thing.

CB has said and I quote

"Karaoke shows that use tracks stored to a hard disk drive are doing so in violation of the Chartbuster Karaoke license printed on the original disc. Unless the tracks were purchased as digital downloads and are being played from the original disk onto which they were downloaded, the operator is in violation of the license."

Note the phrase "Unless the tracks were purchased as digital downloads and are being played from the original disk onto which they were downloaded, the operator is in violation of the license."


They are giving permission to use downloads (not rips) as long as they are on the original disc that they were downloaded to. I don't know about you but when most people download something they don't do it to a disc they to it to a hard drive. So I believe what CB is actually saying is you can only use the original hard drive that the product was downloaded to or if you in fact download it to a disc only that disc can be used.

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I like everyone when I first meet them. If you don't like me that's not my problem it's YOURS!
A stranger is a friend you haven't met yet

Hard drives are very often called hard discs. If Chartbuster is going to replace a disc that no longer plays properly anyway, why would they care if I saved them the trouble of sending me a disc by me making a back up disc for myself? If my original hard "disc" fails, will CB allow me to download the same file again at no cost onto my new hard "disc"?

Most places would.
I don't think CB would be any different.
It is only places absolutely desperate for your last penny that wouldn't.

Excerpt from the dreaded KIAA's website FAQ...



So here's the membership list and we find Chartbuster listed

AUDIO STREAM KARAOKE
4401 Lyman Dr.
Hillard, OH 43026
phone: (800) 817-7024

CHARTBUSTER KARAOKE
10840 Chapman Highway, Seymour, TN 37865
phone: (800) 347-5504 | fax: (865) 573-1811

POCKET SONGS, INC.
MMO Music Group, Inc.
50 Executive Boulevard
Elmsford, NY 10523-9921
phone: (800) NOWSING (U.S.)
phone: (914) 592-1188 (All Others)

Priddis Music
(801) 785-0949

SOUND CHOICE
14100 South Lakes Drive, Charlotte, NC 28273
phone: (800) 326-1894 | fax: (800) 577-7464

STELLAR RECORDS, INC.
7 Oregon Street, Fall River, MA 02720
phone: (800) 979-7464 | fax: (508) 730-1712

STINGRAY MUSIC USA INC
2127 Ayrsley Town Blvd., Charlotte, NC 28273
phone: (704) 817-1530 | fax: (704) 817-1539

It seems to me that if I join the KIAA that Chartbusters has no teeth backing any dispute about ripping their tracks from cdg to computer -- unless they're planning on dropping out of KIAA?[/quote]