Karaoke Forums

This whole back-up thing is rediculous. If I buy a CD and make a back-up copy, if something happens to the original, do you think I'm not going to use my back-up? Isn't that why I made it? Or should I just look at the back-up and go out and buy the CD again?

Think about this...

You back up your computer don't you? To another Hard drive, DVD's...it really doesn't matter what media you use to back it up to. Now, lets say you have a crash! Are you going to use that back-up you made to restore your computer, or are you going to just look at that back-up and say...nope, I can't touch that. I'll just go out and get me a replacement computer. Well, why T F did I do the back-up for?
Isn't that the whole purpose of the back up, so I can use it if something goes wrong?

Do you all see the play on words by the manu's and how crazy this whole thing is. Are you going to listen to the BS or use your own good comon sense?

In agreement Alan.

I spent many years working field service for HP as a server engineer.
All the corporate companies had DLT tape backup of everything.
Windows, Office, You name it.
Everything is backed up. And sometimes used.

CB et al.
Tell the corporates they can not use their back up's.
They would politely say "Up yours mate"
So would I.
Have a really nice day.

....And you didn't read the last part of my post. There IS NO "original disc"- they're shuffling. A manufacturers licenced disc, as bought say, at a brick and mortar- is an "original" disc. What you burn a download to is just an MP# on a disc- the same as a download, but a hard copy. An ORIGINAL disc, as sold by the mfr. keeps the responsibility of licensing on the mfrs. shoulders. A download puts that responsibility on YOU, Since the combo Fix/Sync/Recording/Commercial/Digital/Promotion license required in the U.S has never been drafted for downloads, you can't use them in a show.

However, CB will never say that, because they want to sell their product. Kinda like SC giving "permission" to rip discs. They can't. As previously stated BY THEM, they only promise that THEY won't come after you.

This too is funny, because apparently, after making that assurance, they now use the display of the SC logo by KJs who have bought their discs and ripped them ( believing their promise) as evidence of a counterfeit, because all ripped songs are basically just that due to media conversion. In other words:

SC said they wouldn't press the issue in regard to media conversion so KJs would buy the discs to rip, and now uses the display of the ripped tracks that KJs bought as evidence that there is a probability of trademark infringement- Putting them through audits because they bought and ripped the discs that SC said they wouldn't mind being ripped.

Cute, huh?

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Speaking of ripping.....we are all getting ripped off. I think this whole subject is hilarious. And everyone is a legal expert. Yes you can...no you can't, you need a license for this, no you don't. People..tell them all to kiss off..use the disc you have, enjoy your shows, and be done with it.

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Sweet Little Me In Karaokeland........

My youngest daughter loves "Dora The Explorer". She also knows how to work the DVD player. What she doesn't know at her age is how to take care of a DVD. The first thing I did when my wife bought the discs was make a copy. We still have the original, but it is now beyond playable. Meanwhile my daughter is on her 4th copy of the DVD. When it get's scratched up, I burn her another one.

If I was to call/write to the manufacturer and ask their permission, do you think they would say "Sure! Make as many backups as you like!"? Never.

Am I going to be hauled into court for making a backup of "Dora saves the Crystal Kingdom"? I think the chances are extremely slim.

In my opinion, the same goes for Karaoke. I don't believe any manufacture is going to make a stink over a legit 1:1 backup copy for a single rig operator assuming you bought it and still hold the original disc. But they are also never going to say "Go for it!" publicly either.

Bazza that's quite legal under the Copyright Act as fair use and personal.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

What is the point of making a backup if it can't be used in the case of the original failing? Is it just to be displayed in a glass case for future generations to see that you once had a usable Chartbuster Karaoke disc? The pure definition of "backup" would certainly negate that!

Yes Your Honour. I did make a single copy of the original Chartbuster Karaoke disc as a backup. No Your Honour, I did not use that backup copy to play, share, distribute or perform any of the tracks. Yes Your Honour, I did make a copy of that backup copy so that I could use the tracks, because my original Chartbuster Karaoke disc was damaged. Isn't that what a backup is for Your Honour? No Your Honour, this new copy is not a second copy of my Chartbuster Karaoke disc, but a copy of the backup.

Yes, you CAN get "replacement money" from the U.S. government, but I don't know about Canada:

http://www.bep.treas.gov/uscurrency/damagedcurrency.html


Very similar to "send us your broken disc and we'll replace it" except that there is no "out of print clause."

All we have to do is take it to a bank and they'll replace it. Our banks are constantly culling "bad money" when it comes in. They just separate it out for the mint and it gets replaced with crisp new bills.

Yes you can take it to the bank for replacement. You cannot make a copy of it. Now you're getting it. You can replace your discs and money. No one said you can't. But you cannot copy them (discs or money). That is the point.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

No copying, ok

but you can format shift your money, FACT.

Yes you can.
I will drink to that.

Really? Strange whether I use $10 cash or $10 debit, when the transaction is over I have $10 less. When you format shift even once you have doubled what you had.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

If you only use one of your format shifted products at a time, then what difference does it make? Now if you are running more than one rig on one purchased track, then I get your point.

Hey it was your flawed analogy... But I will play.

You are confusing an EXCHANGE transaction with the shift, if I sell ten discs on ebay I will also have ten discs less.

But you see even if you shift your us currency to an electronic form, it is still the same $10 you do not double it. REMEMBER THAT LOGIC and try applying it to your entire analogy.



No, you do not double what you have when you format shift. You will still have the same songs/$.

IE:

I have 4,000 songs on disc and shift them to my hard drive, do I now have 8,000 songs?


When i deposit my $4,000 check in the atm, do I now have $8,000?

You most certainly do have 8,000 songs, 2 x 4,000. You take a $10 bill and make a copy of it, you have two. One legal and one illegal.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

When you format shift your money you forfeit the paper money for electronic money. (And can format shift back to paper in return for forfeiting the electronic money.) When you format shift karaoke you are definitely making a COPY. Perhaps all the manus can provide us with a Karaoke Bank where we can forfeit our discs in exchange for electronic versions. (Providing of course that we can shift them back in a quick visit to Karaoke ATM!)

Now, if all the manus would simply let me subscribe to their monthly releases in DOWNLOAD form I'd be perfectly happy, I'd especially like a DISCOUNT for buying multiple copies for multiple rigs. Then again, if I give up the business I can SELL physical CDGs on to someone else. Selling the downloads on? Much more of a grey area.

I depreciate my CDG purchases of several years as they hold at least some value. Downloads are immediately written off as they instantly have no resale value.

Perhaps we could close this topic, it's been hijacked, answered, sent off topic, hijacked again and should now be buried in soft peat and recycled as firelighters.

Then again it is a cheerful banter!

- Jonn

I guess my problem is with CB's statement that you must download to the hard disk you will be using for your show. I for one, do not like the idea of downloading straight to my show computer. With all the possibility for getting a virus downloaded to my drive, I would choose to download it and test the download before taking a chance of ruining all the songs on my work computer. I don't even like to update it because I don't trust MS either. Do you think the manufacturer is more secure than Microsoft?

I personally think that the manufacturers are faced with the dilemma where they see the advantages of the computer karaoke system but do not have a clue as to how to combat the Karaoke Pirate who downloads illegal tracks or sells hard drives already loaded. That is where the efforts need to be. If they could solve that issue, the other would not be a problem.

I still say that each of us has a responsibility to the industry and to ourselves to help stop the illegal copying and the pirate shows. There needs to be education of venue owners on how these acts could potentially hurt their business by knowingly allowing illegal activity. After all, most have liquor licenses and stand to lose them if they knowingly engage in illegal activity.

Do the manufacturers not have a way to encode their tracks with a serial number of sorts? Armed with that, tracks that are legally purchased could be registered and illegal activity could be audited when found. Some software also has encoding to limit the number of copies that can be made from an original disc.

The software manufacturer that supplies my hosting program has a way to only allow you to have its program live on one computer at a time. To change computers, you have to physically remove the license from one in order to use it on another. Could manufacturers not use this same type of technology on their discs? You buy from a registered retailer and then register the disc (or track) on line with the manufacturer who emails you a confirmation of the license. That license is only good for that track on one computer at a time. That would help (nothing is 100% foolproof) alleviate the illegal copying which is the crux of the problem.

CB - tell us what you think! Have you considered this? Would it work? What would the downside be?

Wow, your logic is awesome... Lets see if I can format shift enough times to build up my library to 100,000 songs.

Seriously you format shift $10, you still have the same $10... It is just in a different format.