Karaoke Forums

Try downloading MTU's trial of microstudios......see if it plays the files

I have tried Microstudios, Karafun (yes I know), Singlos, The Jukeboxer, Trikaraoke, Roxbox just to name a few. none of which say anything about rbin files.

The Cd's are fine and will rip just fine, I no longer see this as a NEED to Have as more of I just wanna know why. It seems that acesonic's rbin is the culprit. it's not a true bin nor a cdg and I cannot find any documentation about the rbin

You can email me one of the files for testing, but I suspect it might be a BIN file without interleaving performed. If you have problem sending large file over email use service like YouSendIt. My email is info AT powerkaraoke.com

I am sending it now through yousend it is a 36.49MB file size

An rbin file?......this is the only file like that I've found
http://www.ravenprecision.com/Manuals/p ... 122C_l.pdf

Same here but there is a mac program that is supposed to open these files and they are supposedly rbin or rawbin. the program is kjams. Acesonic uses an *.rbin file (rawbin) and names them cdg. kJams claims to open them but basically only on a Mac. this info was off the kjams site. they have a windoze beta version but it does not function well yet

As I suspected this is BIN file that has not been interleaved. To convert it to regular BIN file you need:

1. Change the extension of the file from CDG to BIN
2. Download and install Karaoke CD+G Creator Pro
3. Run Power Bin Interleaver (you will find it in Programs menu/Karaoke CD+G Creator/Tools)
4. Deinterleave the file (make sure that you select 'Deinterleave'). Do not forget to set proper output folder for conveted file
5. Voila, you have BIN file that you can play with Siglos or any other player.

I really appriciate the time on this. I have been reripping cd's for days it seems and am almost done. However as I said earlier I wanted to know if it was an odd issue or just me. Thanks to all how tried to help.

What's the difference between an interleaved and non- interleaved bin karaoke file. For that matter, what's a bin file exactly?

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Okay, who took my pants?

BIN file is an exact copy of CD track with subcode data. For some reason data are interleaved, ie. CD+G packs are distributed between several CD sectors. You need to put them together (deinterleave) to get meaningful information.

To make sure I have this right.... The interleved bin leaves the 96 timing (subcode) bytes in place as they are read from the CD mixed with the music data while the non-interleved groups the graphics bytes at the beginning or end or somewhere. Right?

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Okay, who took my pants?

Both kind of files have 96 bytes of CD+G data in every sector (2448 bytes). But interleaved also has single pack of subcodes distributed in several sectors, so they need to be combined before can be interpreted.

Well I'm still confused but this is getting way outside the intended purpose of this forum. It looks like I will just have to hit the books. But thanks for explaining.

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Okay, who took my pants?

Why would you say that? This is a tech forum, the thread is about cdgs and bins. Best way to share info and learn.

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

Okay then....

I don't understand Power's use of the terms "Sector" and "Subcode."

So far as I know a sector is an area of a storage disk (hard drive, CD, DVD, whatever) so once you read the data from one storage device to the other, in this case CD to hard drive wouldn't the sector information be superfluous? As for "subcode" as I understand it in reference to CDG, is a method of dividing an 8 bit byte into bits so that not all of the data in the byte is used for a single purpose. The CDG is an example. The first bit (labeled P) is set to 1 or 0 alternately so the cd player knows how fast the disk is spinning. The second (Q) bit is used for a host of things such as displaying text on a CD player. In that case the information in the"Q" channel is read vertically. The CDG graphics information is in the last six bits of this byte. As I understand it every 33rd byte of each sector of the CD players output (if it just doesn't throw the byte out as garbage) is the Graphic information. If the sectors have headers and footers, I don't know.

Assuming all that is right (and it's only what I've read) I think Power is saying that sometimes there are some extra graphics bytes somewhere. So, if that makes any sense and I haven't got the whole thing bass ackwards, where are the extra graphics bytes found and how can you tell an interleved file from a non?

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Okay, who took my pants?

If you use digital extraction of CD data, each sector is 2352 bytes long. If you read in raw format, it will also include extra 96 bytes of CD+G, CD-Text, or thatever is stored in P-W subchannels. BIN file is a sequence of extracted sectors, so for every 2352 bytes of audio you get 96 bytes of data (it is described here: http://www.jbum.com/cdg_revealed.html ). But these data are meaningless in raw format, as due to decrease error possibility CDG pack logically corresponding to one audio sector is distributed (interleaved) between several sectors. So in order to interpret this (and paint lyrics on text) you need to shift some bits to make them in correct order (there is al algorithm to do this, and it is described in CD+G documentation published by Phillips). Once this is done it is also possible to run error correction, as CDG data contains Reed-Solomon error correction codes in case some bits are missing.

I'm confused. Using Power CD+G Burner, the format I always select to burn a cdg is CDG+MP3. I read above that if I burn the cd on BIN file I get the exact copy of the original cd.

Does that mean that BIN file is a better copy and CDG+MP3 is somewhat a little degraded or a second generation copy? Hmmm, if so I will start using BIN instead.
Thanks for your reply.

Graphics part of CDG and BIN file are the same, the difference is in audio (in MP3+G audio is compressed).

Graphics part of CDG and BIN file are the same, the difference is in audio (in MP3+G audio is compressed).[/quote]

Therefore, if there are no audio compression burned under the BIN file, that means BIN file has a better sound (or slightly better?) than MP3+G? Thanks again.