Karaoke Forums

True, no host but we have GRO

_________________
I can neither confirm nor deny ever having or knowing anything about nothing.... mrscott

You know the thought occurs to me that each of you might be correct...in your own areas. Every bar, every town, every state has their own needs, clientele, or different styles of what makes or breaks a good show. It is way to diverse to pin down to one or two elements. For some it MIGHT be the equipment, for others, it might be the host, or the food, or the prices or just whatever. I might be nit-picking myself a little here, but where I am, the equipment isn't that important it seems. My mentor/friend who has really crappy gear proves that, "in my area". Same might not be said in lets say, Portland, or Los Angeles. I dunno.

Bur for me, the simple fact that I am taking a different approach on how "I" choose to befriend each and every person in the room, not just my little circle of friends, will be the catalyst for success. I know it.

Thank you all for your great input, and also for keeping this thread as one that is useful for all who read it. Different points of view are always welcome.

Your point is well taken, Mr. Scott. From other posts, it sounds like you are in an area similar to ours--rural with a few venues far between. We do get a few who make the trek in from other areas but most tend to most regularly attend the bar closest to home. We don't have a big pool of bar-hopping people from which to cull the best singers. We have to provide a fun and friendly place to keep the neighborhood people coming back and make the show out of who we have.

You are correct. Where I live (Utah), bars are very far and few in between. Especially in the outer regions outside the Salt Lake, Ogden or Provo areas. In fact, my county where I live has only 1 bar total. Same for the counties to the left and to the south. But I don't do any of these bars for karaoke. The owners are all in their own little worlds, and have a different view of what karaoke should be. All three of the bars mentioned actually do karaoke, but it's not me who hosts them. My closest venue that I host at is 50 miles away, the next closest is 79 miles away, and the third one I host is 98 miles away. All of them I dearly love. And I would like to make each and every one of these shows such a success that they ARE the place to be for fun and singing. Right now they are all doing "pretty" good,,,just not "great". The bar owners and I all deserve "GREAT". I can only accept my "excellence" when it comes to personal dealings with others. It's really as simple as that.

Before you kick yourself too much, also consider the unemployment rates in rural areas. We have 18% in our county and it has become a real struggle. Many of the jobs are minimum wage commute types and people barely make anything over their gas. We have had nights where we had 25 singers on the board at one time but they are coming later, leaving earlier and sticking to draft so the till isn't what it could be. We tend to feel we must be failing as hosts and look for what we could be doing wrong yet we found out that two other shows in the area rarely have anyone still coming at all. We think we can do some spectacular thing to change it and it doesn't get us to where such efforts did just 3 months ago.

While I would never say quit trying to improve, don't be too down on yourself either. The impact of the economy has become very real for some of us and there could be factors affecting your attendance that have nothing to do with you as a person.

I am not being down on myself at all,, I am seeing areas of improvement is all. It all starts with me. I see how I can inspire people. And that I can and will make a difference.

It is a lot easier to compete for customers when there are a lot of them (medium or larger city).

If you are the only show for 40-50 miles around, then dynamics are very different from other places. It is a lot easier to cater to a subset of the karaoke/bar crowd in busy areas.

If you have a high population area you can go for the karaoke crowd only, but if you are in a small town you pretty much have to cater to whomever decides to go out to a bar that night as well.

Well, where I live is small,,, around 3000 people,,and the percentage of people who drink is very low (Utah of course). 2 of the 3 shows I host are also in small towns, one around 5000 and the other around 3500.. the last one is in Salt Lake, but it's a very specific clientele (lesbian/womans club). But I don't buy the story of there not being enough business to support a bar. Several years ago, when the population was much less, just in the county I live in there were 7 bars, all very long running. Now there is only 1 left. There are 2 different reasons for the others closing. First reason is the owners just simply got old and retired and didn't want to sell, or turn the business over to their kids. The second reason is, here in Utah, the lawmakers have made it very difficult in bars/clubs being able to turn a profit because of fees, licensing, regulations. Utah has some of the strictest laws and regulations when it comes to alcohol. And it makes it very difficult to become profitable because of them and the overly priced fees.

In fact the oldest running bar that "was" in Utah, (also located in my county) wanted to relocate to a larger building. The county was going to assess them a "highway access fee" of 50 thousand dollars, and require the business to upgrade the highway for safe access. Total cost of this idea was over half a million dollars. Needless to say they didn't relocate. Later that owner sold his business to another person who eventually destroyed the business and it closed. This bar had been in business since 1906. Even if someone wanted to open it again, they couldn't because of a law that states a bar/club cannot be within 1000 feet of a school, church, park, or publicly owned building.. There is a school about 950 feet away. Even tho the bar was there first, they cannot reopen because it had closed down for longer than 30 days...

These are some of the things that we have to deal with here in our area. So, I don't believe its because there isn't enough business, even in this economy. I believe and feel that we as hosts,, and those as the bar owners,, control our own futures and our own success'.

Wow.
When I had a pub I felt badly done to.
I was next door to a primary school.
You do have it tough.

Things are different from state to state. Just to make a point, I've gotten RFQ's for my systems at pot clubs here in California, where we have legal medicinal, and we're voting for full legal status November 2nd.

Pot bars is what we're heading towards

Bars probably won't be reliable in Utah.

Get yourself involved in civic events. I'm sure your city puts on festivals and get togethers. It's a good way to network. Recently we had "Japantown Idol" I didn't run it, but the guy sold it to our Japantown Business association sold it as "Idol" and it worked. Sounds lame, but it works.

Sorry Mr. Scott off topic -

Toqer what do you do when you have unruly singers. A singer that starts screaming the F word over the mic or disrobing for example. I had these things happen last night at my show. Aaarg! Sometimes I feel like the karaoke police. If no one was is manning the stage it seems things might get out of hand. At least for me on a busy night.

_________________
[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

That is exactly my point. While there may be enough people to support more bars/shows if there are not many open, then the bars must of cater to all of the bar crowd in the area. There are a lot of reasons why the market may not meet the demand that may be there, but much of that is beyond our control as a KJ.

If someone does not feel that they will fit in at the only bar in town they will just stay home more often. If your Karaoke night is going to have people who just want to be in a bar, and they have few other bar options nearby it will be a different crowd from a city with 10-20 or more bars that they can choose from.

It is a matter of people going to a generalist bar or a specific type of bar. When given that choice, if the specific bar type that appeals to a person is not avalible they are more likely to stay home. For a lot of people the generalist bar wont do.

For a lot of karoke shows they are trying to be a specialty, while others are trying to liven up a generalist bar. They are very different things. I am willing to bet that many of the regulars at your lesbian friendly show would feel as comfortable in the small town generalist bars (where they are more likely to run into people of different views). If such people live in small towns they are more likely to drive far or stay home.

My show is awesome. That is my opinion. I know every show out there not being run like mine, runs the chance of a KJ that plays favorites, or will waste my time in other ways. Of course I love to sing, but I'm married and have 2 kids. If it's a choice between going out, or staying home with my wife and kids....




On stage. Singing. Constantly all night. BTW, unlike Jer, you do get offensive. I'll point that out further down your post though.



1. If we're entertainers, aren't we supposed to make sure our customers are entertained?

2. Machine rotation is fair.

3. If 1 and 2 are true, then 3 will be true as well.

4. Automation can do all of the above. How can you fairly make comparison without ever having been to my show? I've probably been to 1000's of shows like yours, mine is unique.



1. There are men... That GASP LOVE OTHER MEN! There are women, that GASP LOVE OTHER WOMEN! and there are people that GASP! LOVE TOQER!

2. They keep coming back because the experience is 100% consistent.

3. People love my dedication to my craft. They love the way things are no BS here. They love looking at a wall, and seeing their name on a LCD projector in front of a background of a roller coaster. They know I put many man hours into making this a karaoke show they run.




1. 90% of worldwide karaoke customers pay to sing. Asia was ahead of the curve on karaoke, and they're ahead of the curve on pay to sing. It'll only be a matter of time before karaoke jukeboxes are as prolific in the US as they are in Asia.

2. That's fine. I bet you hand wash your clothes too.

3. Why would you even say something like "You can't really call yourself a KJ." It really shows your closed mind that you can't accept that there are other ways in the world to run a show. That is a very narrow way of thinking. Even the whole "I wouldn't pay" thing, again..You wouldn't even set foot in my venue, because you've already pre-judged it.



My crowd is diverse. We're in San Jose California, and according to the recent census we're one of the most diverse cities in the US.

People pay because it's no big deal. We're talking about a $1 here. You can't even buy a whopper at burger king for a buck anymore. (The jr yes)

--------------------------------------

Why is it everytime I talk about how I run my show I get so much criticism from this forum? I've won best karaoke in our local newspapers 13 years in a row, so I must be doing something right.... Right?? I'm not trying to troll, I'm just saying how my stuff is run.

Toqer, no judgment at all from me. I learned (just last night,,hehe) that every type of host is welcome and has a place in this world. I for one wouldn't host that way, but that's ok too. It works for YOU..then it must work, period. Not to say it would work everywhere, because of the reasons I had already stated up on an earlier post. But then again, the way I host might now work where you are either, or the way Cheese hosts, or the way BigJer hosts, or any one else for that matter. To each his own. I for one LIKE the personal touch, the flaws, the good, bad and everywhere in between. But for me, I just demand my utmost excellence when dealing with people. That may or not be true for you or anyone out there.. And THAT is ok too. There is no "right or wrong" , its just the way it is.

When bad things happen I blame myself because I didn't design an idiot proof enough system...

Overall the trick to unruly singers is to coral everything and try not to overreact. We use kiosks and web pages, not songbooks (so no books wet/thrashed on the floor.) Our mics are wired (no changing batteries, and their travel is limited by cord length) There are no mic stands for them to swing around like giant battle axes.


I don't think there's a single bar in the greater San Francisco bay area that would care if someone screams vulgarities. We are so tolerant out here, it's unreal. For example, the real version of Notorious B.I.G. "Big Poppa" makes gratuitous use of the "N" word (If you don't know, now you know n***a) . I've seen white guys sing it that way (even though the karaoke lyrics don't list it that way) They sing it well enough that it pays respect to biggie, and black guys just love it.

Disrobing you have to worry about depending on the state. Our state issued liquor licenses have clauses that forbid publicly lewd behavior. Usually though if it happens.. It's just for the duration of a persons song. So I don't sweat it. Just do a sigh of relief when it's over if nobody gets arrested

Make it clear to the owner of the venue that karaoke is performance, and these things might happen because people want to "perform". Try to convince them to take the same attitude, so you don't have to sweat your bosses.

I've actually spent some time watching Toqer's show(he broadcasts it over the net), and I can tell you it is high energy and very interesting. There is never any downtime and somehow he has managed to train people to be up there ready to sing as soon as the previous song is finished.
While I love the personalization of a host who announces and queues things up, Toquer's show definitely has it place.
You can't go expecting an average run-of-the-mill show. If you do, be prepared to be disappointed. Go expecting what just Toquer told you, and I'm willing to bet you would have a great time.
And he's right. While there certainly are Asians that attend his show, there are many of other nationalities that attend as well, including Caucasians. It's great big melting pot.
I can say that if I'm ever in his area, I will be making a bee line for his show and I will have no problem paying the dollar to sing. But, he will have to promise to let me check out his system!

Wow.
Little old England is in the dark ages.

I'd spend time at TOquer's show and pay $1 per song if i visited.

His is the only show on the mainland that i've heard of that charges to sing.

Here in hawaii it is very common to charge $1 per song.

Karaoke came from Japan to Hawaii then hit the mainland as we all know...

Every place in hawaii offered karaoke and even many karaoke-rooms opened til the market was oversaturated. There was a backlash in the 90's and most bars/restaurants got rid of it all together and returned to live music or added MORE DART BOARDS or pool tables instead.

In order for karaoke hosts to survive, kjs started to charge $1 per song in addition to the pathetic pay rate bars were offering..and still do.

I used to make $250 a show on the mainland. Here the going rate is $100-$125. Add a buck per song and tips and most times you clear $200 per show.

Most tourists are usually 'aware' of potential high prices on everything here and very few people complain about having to pay $1 a song at most shows.They're on vacation and want to have a good time and not nickel/dime everything.

Most visiting singers usually want the backstory as to why they are charged to sing.

We DO NOT have a tip-jar, but are regularly tipped ON TOP OFf the $1 per song...THAT'S CRAZY if you ask me, but that's how it works here. People having fun and spending money on their vacation. I am amused as i visit the bank weekly with hundreds of georges in hand...

Some local regulars i don't charge if they visit the shows a lot. They usually end up tipping anyways and more than it would cost if i charged them.

It works here. I'm happy it works for Toquer too! I second the claim that it will happen to a lot of places on the mainland eventually. You already pay $1 for darts, jukeboxes and pool tables...sometimes more! And cover charges for bands..WHY NOT pay a $1 for great interactive entertainment such as karaoke?

Oh... maybe because it hasn't been done there... YET...

I'd love to see honest kjs on the mainland in rural/slow areas making more money
once the dishonest ones are gone. The constant reinvestments in this industry takes a big bite out of everyones bottom line.

Okay..i'm "rambling on again' like the wife says. Too MUCH SUN . Gotta go walk the poochie now before she ruins the new carpet...

Aloha Everyone! -john

like some people have said in this post.....simply put.....what works in one location will not necessarily work in another geographic area.....

I think this has been the most useful thread I have read since I have been a member of KS. We have KJs with great sound and with bad sound, books, kiosks, disk based, computer based, some with great singer interaction some with no singer interaction, clothes on clothes off, single singers, groups of singer. Could it be that we're just not that important to the show?

_________________
Okay, who took my pants?