Karaoke Forums

You did the right thing cueball. I'm absolutely with you on that one.

I let a gig go before, because the manager wanted to dictate my rotation and let a regular sing a couple of times in a rotation while 20-30 singers were waiting their turn. I explained to him that I won't bend the rules for this guy, because of my reputation and that my reputation is worth more to me than this one show a week. He said something like "I am the one who pays you and you have to do what I tell you". So I said, no I don't ... and walked out.

I also agree with the OP.

I once had the owner of a bar I worked at for two years, who is my friend outside of business as well, ask me not to let two people sing anymore. He is right, their singing is bad for business; they are terrible and they sing the stupidest things. When there are dozens of singers and these two guys only get to sing a couple times a night, it's not that bad; but on this particular night they got there early and there were only about 5 other singers, so they were going to be back up again really soon.

I told him I wouldn't refuse to let them sing, but I did tell the two singers I would rather they picked some songs that were more suitable for the crowd. This worked well and they kept on singing, but were more savvy about their song choices.

I would say the bar manager in the OP's thread was genuinely trying to do what he thought was best for his crowd, as he offered to return the singer's money, etc. Of course, the OP has to look out for his reputation as a KJ, and I would have done the same thing in his place.

Half pay is fair for this in my book. I do a lot of outdoor events during summer, and my policy is half pay if the event is canceled due to weather before the show starts; full pay once the music starts. While this cancellation was for a different and questionable reason, I feel it was fair.

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Jeff Wheeler, moonlight DJ/KJ

I like the part about MAKING THE MANAGER GO TELL THE GUY HE CANT SING. Put the onus on him. He can do his own dirty work!!

I would have done exactly that and stayed the night and had karaoke for the bikers!

Bikers need Karaoke too!!

And I bet they would have been no different than any other partying karaoke crowd!!

Maybe Cueball could have got up on a table and done the PEEWEE HERMAN dance to TEQUILA and they would have made him an honorary member!!

As to the Bad singers, Bad singers are what KARAOKE IS ALL ABOUT!! It aint AMERICAN IDOL!! Karaoke is the GREAT EQUALIZER. It aint Karaoke without the good, loyal, paying customers who are lousy singers!!

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

It was nice of you to spare the man's feelings at your own expense. Having the manager be the one to tell him might have made a point to the manager but wouldn't have been so nice for the man.

We have a few that I used to dread for fear they were running off people. But like your guy, they always got applause. The other night I was walking through the crowd as one sang and was amazed to hear things like, "I could listen to her sing all night." It seems most in the town knew the person and their story and what it took for them to get up there and they were happy to support it. Guess I had read that one wrong.

At my show last night, I was lobbying a table who'd never sung karaoke before. (Got one to get up and sing -- he turned from karaoke virgin to karaoke slut in one night.) The woman said, "But I can't sing!" My answer is always "Surely by now you have noticed that is not a requirement for karaoke."

But I roger the song choice thing. I feel free to tell my bad singers who choose long songs that I would prefer that they do something different. They don't really have a problem with this, as I only do this when they have hit their third five-minute-plus song. I can usually suggest an alternative which they will do instead.

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[color=#ffff55]Mickey J.[/color]
Alas for those who never sing, but die with all their music in them.
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes, Sr.

I doubt that's going to happen. In fact, I think most people would agree with everything you've done. You have your own integrity and reputation to uphold, and no one can uphold it but you.

You did good cueball. I like diafel's solution but understand why you wouldn't have wanted to do that.

We had a guy in town that showed up to all the shows. He always had a pitcher going at his table. He was about 70, died his gray hair (showed up once without dying it so I knew for sure) and usually sang Elvis songs. His timing was off, his range was flat and the crowd never got into it. He usually got polite applause and people would stop at his table and pat him on the back and offer kind words. He passed away earlier this year.

You should have been paid for the entire show. You showed up on time, you were set up and the manager tried to get you to do something that was against your principles and of very poor karaoke etiquette in my opinion.

As far as someone telling me to play dance music when there is a large rotation going, no. Not if advertised as Karaoke.

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

i applaud you sticking to your morals and thinking of your singers feelings, especially in the difficult position you were in at the moment. that sort of real caring about a person is probably high on the list of reasons he and others continue to come see you, and truly displays your character.
[schild=4 fontcolor=0000FF shadowcolor=C0C0C0 shieldshadow=1]you're a good man[/schild]

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Paradigm Karaoke, The New Standard.......Shift Happens

Some managers/owners have control issues. Yes they pay us, but we aren't the same as all the other bar employees. It's our business also and our reputation we have to protect. It's a fine line we have to ride sometimes.

I've dealt with similar situations and would have done what you did by telling him if he wants someone not to sing he has to tell them. It's his bar and he can do what he wants , so he can be the a-hole.

I'm glad he at least paid you half. And I'm glad your friend is wise enough to understand. Sorry this happened.

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[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

Babs,

You are so correct. I have heard many times, "This is My business", (which is supposed to be why they do certain things, I guess...)

To which I always reply..."Well, you know what it's MY business too.....This isn't just for fun for me"

MrD

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[highlight=midnightblue]MrD - KJ/DJ Specialist
Visit MrD on facebook - mrdsentertainment
& on myspace - larrynance[/highlight]

I had a gig where karaoke was the same night as bike night during the summer and the bikers NEVER wanted to sing.

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They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

Hmmmmm... about 40% of our business are Bikers, and they generally request Karaoke, on a Sunday morning of all time, and they usually all sing... just the locale as in most things. For the OP I support your decision and give Huge Applause to you!!! Peace, S.

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"I think people should be allowed to do anything they want. We haven't tried that for a while. Maybe this time it'll work." George Carlin R.I.P (May 12, 1937 – June 22, 2008)

I've lived my business so far on 3 things the owner can tell me.

Volume needs adjusted
Clean or not clean language
Shut down early (as long as I get paid in full)

My rotation is my business.
He/she can only tell me someone is banned from singing if they are banned from coming into that particular bar. If they are in there and spending money, it's my call whether they sing or not.

If it's a new gig or new bar for me, I always let them know they are in control of the volume, clarify what language is acceptable and let them know if I need to shut down precisely at the agreed upon shut down time.

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

I would have told the singer that management didn't want him to sing

That's a great set of rules to have.

I think what Cueball did was awesome.

What's really funny is when your singers try to tell you how to run your show.

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Wam bam thank you m'am.

I did that once Jam. The time the bar owner made the decision mid night that he didn't want any Spanish songs sung. The only reason I did it was because I thought I could put in a better way then he could. I argued with him about it and I could see he just didn't understand it was wrong. He isn't good with people and I thought I could try to spare their feelings. They were nice people and didn't blame me for the owner being a jerk. Unfortunately it screamed of racism even though he said that wasn't the reason. They tipped the bartender and me very well, left and never came back. Looking back at it now I would have handled it differently.

He did learn a huge lesson from it though. The regulars caught wind of what happened and went directly to him to let him know how wrong he was. He has learned to leave the karaoke to me and not interfere now. I believe it was a learning lesson for both of us. I felt horrible about how it went down. I really didn't know how to handle it. I respect the fact it is his bar, but sometimes you just have to do what's right.

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[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

Can you imagine if it were one of the big burly Hell's Angels type bikers that had the bad voice? I bet the manager would just "let it ride" as the BTO song goes.

Well, here's an update....


Last week (on Friday), the KJ that I had filled in for (attempted to, anyway) did his show. The man in question was there (again... early as usual), and the Manager was there. According to the KJ, the Manager didn't say a single word about that man being there.

There were a few people in the back room (celebrating a birthday), and there were very few people in the bar. According to the KJ, the Manager approached him and asked him if he would mind going an extra 30 minutes for free (to compensate for the place being empty). His show is usually 3 hours (with the possibility (at Management's discretion) of being extended an extra hour). He agreed, and about 1 hour later, the place was packed, and the KJ had 32 singers. His show lasted 4 hours (Management asked him to go the extra hour), and at the end of the night, he only got paid for 3 1/2 hours.

I had this sort of thing happen, too under almost IDENTICAL circumstances. I was filling in for a KJ that I did not know. The guy who set me up with the show (a bartender) told me that they were not happy with their current karaoke guy and if I did well, I could probably keep the gig.

The bar was located in a rather remote area and it took me about 30 minutes to travel to from my semi-remote home.

Upon arrival, I introduced myself to the bartender. I got the show going, but had very few singers. The bar had plenty of customers, mainly snowmobilers who visited this location because it was located right off a major snowmobile trail. I found myself going back and forth between just playing music and letting the two singers sing.

About half way through the show, the crowd was now primarily women. I don't know where they came from, but I switched the music format to "universal dance music" - "Baby Got Back", "Yeah", "Cha Cha Slide" along with their requests. During all of this, I still let the singers sing - I would play 3-4 songs and then get the TWO singers back up and start the process all over again - while encouraging new singers and singing myself.

Well, during one of my "music breaks", I went to the bathroom. Some guy started giving me $hit about letting "that f-ing retard sing" and playing dance music. I said, "The bar pays me to do karaoke. I can't pick and choose who I let sing. I have to be fair to everyone. As far as the dance music goes, these ladies asked me to play it. As long as they are out there dancing and since I only have two singers, I have to keep playing it".

He then started to cuss me out, and at that point told me he was the owner. He said I better play some "f'ing rock and roll" or he was going to turn on the jukebox, and don't let that f-ing retard sing again. I told him "no problem" and changed genres immediately. All those women kept coming up to me asking me when I was going to play their requests and so on. I told them that the owner does not want that music played in this bar.

Well, I was getting NO response from the rock music. After about 45 minutes and 30 minutes from close, I said "F it" and played another round of music for these ladies who had resorted to bribing me with cash (which I didn't accept). I thought, F this owner. This is my reputation. If I get paid, I get paid. If I don't, F it. And, I let that "special" singer sing again, too.

I did get paid. But, I was never invited back.

Troy, did you ever find out if that guy was really the owner? Or was he just messing with you?