Karaoke Forums

Scott, you do have a dilemma. Any chance you could buy your own bar? That would solve your problem.

Okay, here is what I would try in this situation. It would take some out of the box thinking, but in your case it seems you're going to have to do that, anyway, or just move to a more populated area.

If bars are not popular, what IS popular? Where do people go to recreate? Is it restaurants? Or is church the only thing people in Utah do (I'm not being facetious, I am serious)? I would start looking at places that would appreciate entertainment for their patrons as an added maybe? Are there chain restaurants that have family nights?

Seems like bars are out of the question for you. They aren't getting it at all, that the reason they have no profits is they don't have entertainment. That is the most difficult principle to get through to some bar owners. That they aren't going to be paying you out of what they take in now, it will be out of what YOU bring in for them. Duh. Simple concept to me.

Anyway, back to the subject: Family shows? I'm not sure how Mormons live (I'm assuming this is what you're up against, the Mormon influence on the sins of bars?) but I'm sure there are opportunities to become involved in (or create) some sort of activities involving karaoke? Just a thought. I've been mulling your situation over for a couple of days and to say the least it is frustating for ME...can't imagine how it is for you.... Good luck.

Scott, are there any "clubs" out there like Nights of Columbus, Elks, etc. that you could hook up with. Also, have you tried going the private party route? Can you get your flyers/business cards on public bulletin boards like in supermarkets.

Since it's hard for you with the bar market, I would concentrate in doing private parties. With Christmas coming up, can you contact companies in your area? Some companies have Xmas parties. But you need to get advertising out there letting people know that you are available for private parties. Can you advertise in the yellow pages? Or your local paper?

Just a few ideas if you didn't think of them already.

Here's an idea of a different sort. Since it's winter, you have time to get this plan together. First it WILL take a little capital. You'll need a generator big enough to run your equipment. Then either buy, or rent a TENT big enough to put on a show. Name your karaoke show something like "Brother Scott's Traveling Karaoke Show" (I stole that from Neil Diamond). The reason you'll have to wait is obvious, the tent won't support the snow. After the snow flies, and melts, find a plot of land to set up the tent, maybe squat the land, or lease it. Send out a gazillion fliers, put up homemade signs directing the way to the tent, and make it a revival type of karaoke show. I'm sure there alot of frustrated singers in your area just dying to be heard. No preaching, but all types of music allowed. I bet you'd get alot of gospel type singers, as well as choir singers, etc. I know this sounds CRAZY, but so does driving 140 miles. To start with, just put a donation jar out, and see what happens.

Rosario

OK, to reply to everyone, first of all thanks for the suggestions. All of them are pretty good ideas, and yes I do consider all possibilities.

Karen, in case you are wondering, yes, I am Mormon (LDS) and I don't drink at all. But that won't stop me or others to having some fun here and there. Some bars are busy, others not, same as anywhere else in the country. My Saturday show (80 miles away) is busy as can be and I love going there.

Church activities are not as common as you would think, but even those are not a situation that I could make money, it's all a freebie thing for almost everything that way. Restaurants are the same issue as bars, not many around, and of those that are closer, they don't have the potential of doing karaoke at. Some have tried, but always failed. Cafe's and restaurants just simply won't pay what is needed to attract customers. They operate on a very small profit margin as it is. That's why I must travel. But my options are getting fewer and father in between.

Alan, there is one ELK's club about 60 miles away, and I approached them once, and yeah, they were interested, but only on a "once-in-a-while" basis, maybe once every other month. Simply not enough to warrant my time to save a day of the week simply for them. Could I buy my own bar? not a chance!! I don't have any funding like that. Although I have given it a lot of thought. How, where, that sort of thing. Private parties are always an option, but again are far and few in between. Most won't pay much for something like that. Weddings are possible, but again are far and few in between for ones that even would consider karaoke/dj. And most don't even think of music until the very last minute.

Rosario, you actually are getting closer to an idea that I have been working towards for the last couple of years. I have been working towards moving away from karaoke and doing car shows. But that is a growing process too. And it's coming, very quickly. It's just being able to make it through this winter. That's why I have been looking for shows, simply to make it through the winter.

Thanks again for your input, it's DEFINITELY appreciated, a lot! These bars/clubs that think karaoke won't work, or can't see the benefits are the reason I asked. How do I convince them? or even ,CAN I convince them?

I do OK now with the 3 shows I have, but could use more for sure, as I am sure many of us could. Thanks again.

Not an easy situation you're in. I wish you the best of luck!

Convincing the type of places you have to work with is a problem because they probably don't have the cash reserves or cash flow to front you while you build the show. If karaoke has been a poor return, convincing them you can do any better is not within the realm of their experience. And it may not happen right away so it's not like you can convince them and then instandly deliver the world's riches to their door. That is why the dreaded trial price concept might work, even if you take the hit at first. Or maybe you might be able to convince them to give you a go at a limited run at full price if you are a good salesperson. Especially if you can show good results from your other shows.

One other possibility is schools. A teacher friend told us that with the budget cuts, many don't have a regular music/arts teacher any more so they try to make up for it by hiring for special classes here and there. She said the school paid $250 for a group to teach her class break dancing one day so karaoke could certainly count as music ed. We also noticed the schools have hired karaoke companies for their talant shows and I don't see why there couldn't be a karaoke dance. We were gearing up to persue that when we suddenly started getting conventional shows but we do have a set of "cleaned up" books should we ever persue it again.

Anyway, we are a bit like you but not in as extreme a position. Our shows are only an hour's drive tops. But we get the concept of what you are facing.

Seriously mate concentrate on the particle accelerator.
To be trying to be a KJ from where you live is like
Throw a penny down the well for a wish.

I know you don't want to hear it.
But get real.

Don't get me wrong. I would support you.

100 miles away to do a karaoke gig? Leave equipment at the bar and get a motorcycle or something that is super cheap to drive? I can't imagine any other way to make that cost-effective for you. Maybe one of those Chevy Volt cars is in your future.

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Jeff Wheeler, moonlight DJ/KJ

Mate, I worry that trying to make it happen will cost you too much.
Do you really need to live where you do?

I dunno how any of you feel about where you live, but where I am is my "home". This is my families heritage. I am living on the property that has been in my wifes family since 1868. So moving is not an option. Around here, we do what we have to do to survive.

Leaving the equipment at the bar is also not an option unless i had 3 different identical set ups ( or more ). And a motorcycle won't work either, winters here are brutal. But you are correct in your thinking. Transportation costs are of huge concern. Thanks for your input tho.

Mostly what I am asking is how to deal with owners/managers that have the view of karaoke to be costing less than what i am charging. I have dealt with many so far in my "career" as host, but now the choices and options are getting fewer and fewer all the time. With bars closing, or having dealt with some already, the "pickin's are getting slim". It's been said before to "think outside the box". That's some of the input I am looking for. Again, thank you.

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As I read mrscott's last post, I was thinking along the same lines. Private parties. Would take some heavy advertising until the word got out.

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KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

in the suburbs of chicago, some of the hotels (holiday inn etc.) that have small bars inside did karaoke as well as bowling alleys, most of them have a small bar. i dont know if there are any hotels or bowling alleys by you, just throwing ideas against the wall.

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Paradigm Karaoke, The New Standard.......Shift Happens

how about raising cattle instead?

Nah, it's turkeys here!

If i were in your situation I'd either kill myself, move, or find another job.

Sounds like a whole lotta not any fun. I complain anout only having 2.3 million in my demographic.

I'm not sure, but... don't you need to pay licensing fees to ASCAP, BMI, and SESAC if you do something like that (since you would be doing this on your own, and it involves public performance)?

Mrscott,

Logan Ut is a nice place. Lots of Mormons. Perhaps you can get involved with sound gigs for the churches or kids functions, special events, birthday partires, fundraisers, or if there are Christian based YMCA's there.

I have owned a full service dj company for many years and the money is great with moonbounces, concessions, djing, karaoke, outdoor movie projector rentals, and subcontracting clowns, magicians, and special acts.

Maybe that's your future...don't limit yourself to just karaoke! Good Luck to you!

Cue, I never even thought about the "legal" aspects of doing something like I suggested. But I'm sure you'd have to get some kind of permit. As far as paying fees, if he got a church to sponsor the "events", it could be construed as a revival of sorts, and the church could compensate him. I don't think anyone would be going after a religious organization for ASCAP, or BMI fees. I don't think any churches pay those fees for gospel songs sang in church. Where there's a will, there's a way. Sometimes you just have to be creative. Depends on how much effort you want to put into it.

Rosario