Karaoke Forums

Hey all,

I've been singing karaoke casually for years, but ended up picking up a craptastic Emerson GM527 all-in-one box for Christmas with the family. I figured I'd be happy with it and a small selection of songs, but after reading these forums, singing a few tunes and already having spent more on songs than I did on the machine, I'm realizing I've been bitten by the bug.

In retrospect, I should have ponied up a little more cash and started off with a better platform, but hindsight's 20/20. What I'm looking for now is how I can go about building a better system and selection without starting over from scratch (in the short term, at least), while still preparing for future upgrades.

So, I look to you, the veteran Karaoke Scene crowd, for a little help on developing a path to karaoke greatness with upgrades over time without breaking the bank. This is mostly for fun, and I don't know if I'd ever want to go pro, but I'd like to build in a way that I could if I wanted to. The way I see it, there are really three areas of growth; Song Selection, Equipment, and Software.

Songs
I think I'm in pretty good shape here. I bought a few CDs containing specific songs I wanted and a small base of music appealing to various audiences. I figure my next steps are to pick up the SC Foundations and then the Bricks to establish a good songbase, maybe signing up for the monthly CB disks and Pop Hits Monthly. That should keep me occupied for a good amount of time, but I'm open to any other advice on the best ways to build a collection.

Equipment
I mentioned my sweet Emerson rig earlier, and I already picked up some decent replacement mics. I know that this thing is barely going to cut it for even a family gathering, but I figure I can make use of it for a while if I pick up some equipment to enhance it. I mean, it's got the ability to play CDGs, display lyrics, hook up to a TV, and has RCA outs. Long-term, I'll need to replace it as the head unit, but I should be able to make it work for me in the interim... right?

What can I add to this "rig" to make it sound decent? I'd prefer to pick up gear that I won't outgrow immediately, but again, not break the bank either. Is this a reasonable goal?

Software
I have no immediate need for anything more than songbook software right now, but I don't want to throw that out when/if I upgrade to KJ software. From what I've read, Fast Tracks is one of the better pieces of software and the fact that it's modular step towards CompuHost, a solid KJ solution, is appealing. Any other suggestions for someone who doesn't want to skimp on songbook software yet is accounting for more serious software needs later on?


I hope that I've come off as relatively knowledgeable on the topic (i.e. I did some research before throwing my hands up and begging for help), but keep in mind I'm a complete newb to this and not much more well versed in audio equipment in general. Remember to speak slowly, use small words, and provide specific examples of good makes/models of equipment, whenever possible.

Thanks in advance for any help you can give me, I look forward to the monster you're helping me create.

Songs: Not knowing what you have, the Foundation/Bricks are a great core. You can also check into the Chartbuster packs, I don't care for much of their earlier rock/pop stuff, but their country is pretty high grade. Search some of the stores like karaoke.com for sales, sometimes they even have a $1 bin with decent labels, just closing out overstocked items.

Equipment: Yes as long as the Emerson has the RCA outputs, you can run that into a real PA system. You didn't state a budget, but i'd probably look into getting a decent little mixer like the Yamaha MG82CX would give you a great platform heads over the Emerson for mic inputs. Run the player & mics into this.
Then maybe a couple powered speakers, Behringer (not a huge fan but) B412DSP could work for you.
You said you had decent mics?

Software: Completely dependant on your needs and what you would like to spend. For home use there are some decent free players that will work.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

A good cheap software player is JustKaraoke. Has a lot of the bells and whistles that the higher costing softwares have and won't break the bank. It has a kiosk feature that works with both their free keyboard based kiosk and their inexpensive Super Remote Tool. The biggest difference between the to is that pretty much the keyboard based one is pretty much dedicated to karaoke where you can also use the Super Remote Tool for DJ purposes. The program allows you to select karaoke only, karaoke and audio, Audio only, karaoke audio and video, etc. to search through your songs.

Even Compuhost has a kiosk program that I am beginning to like as you can make it as easy to use as you choose to.

A Kiosk program replaces songbooks and makes fast tracks only necessary for naming imported songs.

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The Line Array Experiment is over. Nothing to see here. Move along.

That sounds like some good advice. Between the price, your recommendation, and the reviews I've read, that mixer sounds like the way to go.

As for the speakers, if you don't like Behringer, can I ask why you'd recommend those? If I had to guess, I'd imagine it's the price:value ratio, being that they're listed as 50% off on Amazon. I'd further assume that these are good mid-range speakers, in that anything cheaper would be of substantially lower quality and anything of higher quality would be substantially more expensive. However, we know what happens when you assume, so I'd love to hear your thoughts on this.

What don't you like about Behringer? Is there something that's a bit more expensive that you do like? If I decide to pony up $600 on a pair of speakers anyway, I'd rather add a few hundred more for something that will stand the test of time. But if we're talking about thousands of dollars for a decent upgrade, I'll stick with the Behringers.

As for mics, I realize that "decent" is entirely subjective. When I said it, I meant "not the throwaway speakers that came with the system." I picked up a pair of NADY SP-4C, which should suit my needs just fine for now, but what would you consider a "decent" mic? I figure it's a waste of money upgrading mics until after I've acquired a decent mixer and speakers, but I've been eying the Shure SM58s.


JK sounds like a good piece of software, but I don't think TriceraSoft's offerings fit my needs. My software needs are a songbook creator for now (while I run karaoke off CDGs), while future-proofing my set-up for an HD-based professional-level rig later.

The biggest single issue I saw with TriceraSoft's Song Book Creator (beyond being generally less robust than FastTracks) is that it doesn't list what CD the song is on. I still haven't seen more compelling offerings for my circumstances than Invicion's, in that its song book software is among the best, if not THE best, while also having a strong overall hosting solution, should I later choose to upgrade.

As for kiosks, not only am I far from needing such a thing yet, I tend to feel it's just technology for technology's sake. Some people (like me) like to spend the time perusing a songbook and with the proliferation of smartphones, FastTrack's web songbook should do just fine as a high-tech alternative. Besides, isn't the interaction with the KJ part of the experience?

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Thanks to both of you for your help. I don't mean to come off as argumentative or spit in the face of people who are trying to help, just wanted to put my perspectives out there so you can educate me in case I'm misinformed.

Because most people setting up a home system would balk at the price on something of good/better quality - but then do you really NEED a high grade PA for home use? So that is a question as well that can relate to budget. Again I was starting in the basement (or at least as low as i'd go) on powered speakers as you didn't really state budget. Although I would really never use them, others think they sound just fine - even use them in shows.

This is just me, but it's quality issues, failing components - i've never owned/used a Behringer product that didn't have some kind of issue. And basically I personally do not like the sound - however they do sound better than the BMB "made for karaoke" junk.

You named it - Shure SM58! Great workhorse, great sound, nearly bulletproof - i've been using the same 3 mics since 94 - 7 nights, they've had every kind of abuse you can think of and still sound as good as day 1. Just replace the screens when they become overly dented.

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I think it is worth mentioning Mtu hoster for software gives you your hosting ability and songbook creator I have used this just over a year and am very happy. But if its just songbook software KJ Pro makes excellent books that look great. again these are just my opinion, Happy Holidays...Cord

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I'll be alright as long as there's light from a neon moon

I like Lon's suggestion as far as the mixer. What size room are you planning to put this in, that will have a lot of impact on what speakers you should select. I like the idea of getting a pair of powered speakers (as opposed to buying separate amp & speaker cabs).

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DJ Tony
Let It Rip Karaoke

I agree with the above posts about powered speakers. Even though you aren't very mobile now, if you become mobile, you'll appreciate the simplicity powered speakers provide.
My advice is to check craigslist. And don't just search in musical instruments, or electronics, because people make mistakes and post gems in the wrong category all the time, just click the FOR SALE text at the top of the column and you can search every category at once. Make sure to make your search a little more specific to weed out other stuff. I search for brand names specifically or Powered speakers.
I see pairs of Mackies and JBL's going for $500.
Good luck.

Thanks for the suggestion. From what I've read, it seem like CompuHost and MTU are the most popular hosting packages. For my needs, I think MTU is out, as the song book creator is integrated and I'm looking to buy a stand-alone product that I can later incorporate into a full hosting suite.


I guess the answer to room size varies. Initially, I'll be running it in my living room, which is approximately 14' x 22' with a connected kitchen, adding another 14'x10' space. However, I'd eventually like to be able to take it to parties and such, with varying dimensions. But I guess my living room is the minimum area I need to be able to cover.

Being pretty unfamiliar with audio equipment, would you (or anyone else) be willing to give me a quick intro to amps, speakers, and powered speakers? In a general sense, I understand that unless speakers are powered speakers, they need an amp. What exactly does an amp do? How do you determine the right wattage for an amp? What are the advantages of powered speakers over speakers and an amp (aside from ease of set up)? How does one tell if speakers are powered or not?


That's good advice, thanks!

Here is another option for a system to play through. You would either have to order it online, or go to California to buy it directly.

http://www.carvinguitars.com/products/s ... 10&cid=101

Carvin is good quality stuff, and has great customer service, should there ever be a problem. The link is for the smallest of their package deals, there are many other options to look at too.

Nice thing about Hoster creating your songbooks, if you use any kind of numbering system, it will always match exactly what you have in your computer.


Amplifier - simply powers the speaker. How much power you'll need is completely dependant on the speaker you will be running. Some speakers require say 300 watts, some speakers can require as much as 1000 watts or more.
Passive speakers - a speaker cabinet with no power, requiring a separate amp to power it.
Powered speakers - a speaker cabinet with an amplifier built in. A powered speaker almost always has an amp perfectly matched for the speaker it's running. There is no guess work.
There are advantages and disadvantages to both types of setups.
Powered speakers are nice because they are completely self contained, built with matching amps and crossovers, usually fairly lightweight in comparison to a typical speaker box, uses standard (cheaper) microphone cord to get the signal from the mixer to the speaker. A couple downfalls are they are not upgradable as far as changing out amps or crossovers (not a huge issue) and do require a power outlet for each speaker.
Passive speakers require a separate power amp that is matched to the speakers power rating (PROGRAM POWER RATING), they are usually heavier, need more expensive speaker cable to run from the amp to speakers plus the cable to run from the mixer to the amp. Advantages - usually a better sound (but this is completely dependant on the speaker itself) and more easily upgradable. But more to setup & move around.

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I just wanted to say thanks again to everyone (especially Lon) who has chimed in on this thread. I tried my best to educate myself before asking these questions, but I know this is basic stuff to you all and I'm sure it's been covered ad nauseum in various threads. However, it's been incredibly helpful to me, thanks for taking the time to educate a new member to the community!