Karaoke Forums

Ok, here's the scenerio. I play at a "dive bar", approximately once a month. The manager LOVES our show, AND pays us well. He also advertises in his bar for us, with flyers, etc. Most of our following (from another venue) will not come to this bar bwcause of its reputation, (drunks, fights, etc.), so it depends on the venue to make the show successful. The clientele of this bar could care less for karaoke. I'm sure all of you have experienced these type of bars, where it's like you're intruding on their (drinking time), or on their time (hitting on some young drunk chick), so you're really NOT WANTED. We stay very professional when there, even if we (my girlfriend and myself) have to sing for the whole 4 hours. Maybe we'll get 2 or 3 stragglers to sing a song or two. Also the owner will sing (if he's there). Girls constantly coming up requesting rap songs, or Lady Gaga, etc. I tell them I have these songs, "who wants to sing it", their reply, "No, NOT KARAOKE, just play the songs so we can dance. I tell them, " I'm NOT a DJ, just karaoke. I have NO INTEREST in being a dj, NOT MY CUP OF TEA. So, the owner says to me "I REALLY love your show, but, the til was the worse it's been. OH, THAT'S REALLY NICE. So I say, as you know, it's NOT because of our show, it's up to you to make sure YOUR clientele WANTS KARAOKE. He asked me a few days ago if I'd like to meet with him for a show first week in March. Just looking for opinions on "What would YOU do"???

Rosario
Serenity Now Karaoke

At the risk of sounding overly pessimistic, I'd say the show is already dead. Keep doing the gig as long as they'll have you but start looking for a replacement. If there's no demand for Karaoke they won't keep you around very long. Just because the staff likes your show doesn't mean a thing when push comes to shove.

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DJ Tony
Let It Rip Karaoke

That's what I figured also, but the owner STILL wants us there. What do you think about doing a show where you're the UNWANTED GUEST. It's like going to a party where only the person that owns the house likes you. I know I'm getting paid, but it really is disheartening. It's like, "the money is good, BUT"....... So far, all but ONE night that we played there, there was (some type) of fight, or domestic altercation. REALLY goes over big when you're TRYING to make the patrons have a good time. More people are paying attention to the "DRAMA" than the show. Kind of like going on Jerry Springer Show, and doing karaoke. By the way, I even TOLD the owner that his clientele doesn"t want karaoke, but HE still wants us.

Rosario

In my opinion...

Karaoke has evolved from where it was 10 or 15 years ago. Many karaoke hosts added filler music to keep things lively, and stop to take "DJ Song" breaks when its really slow or to let everyone stretch their feet 1-2x per night (Cupid Shuffle). Many people have gotten used to this and it just seems more lively.

If you are telling me that you and your girlfriend are singing all night with no filler music or DJ breaks, I'd almost be willing to guarantee you that is your problem.

We did that once.......in this case they brought us in to a bar that specialized in Pool Leagues--and the old school pool people want QUIET. So we actually had people yelling at us and walking out. We had answered an ad and they had done karaoke there before so we thought they actually wanted it but really it was just the owner throwing things at the wall in hopes it would stick. As it turns out, the former hostess was so bad that people hated us before we even started. In fact my favorite compliment was from a fellow who said, "I HATE karaoke but I can almost tolerate this."

But it was the same as you describe. One week the pool team that loved to sing would be there and we would have a good night. The next week that team would rotate to another bar and we would be singing to ourselves. But even with the singing team there they would have their backs to the stage playing pool and it just wasn't coming together into a fun night. It was a waste of time and a moral killer to be there so we dropped it.

When you first start out you tend to want to take anything and try to make it work. But it just seems like even having a bartendress who rolls her eyes at the singing or wants to go home early that night or whatever can really work against you. I think you experienced that elsewhere, also. Karaoke isn't for everyone and if you are at a place that hates it, unless you can totally replace the crowd, you are just butting your head against the wall. If the manager thinks he/she can advertise outside the place and bring in new people you might have a chance but if the audience is hostile to the singers they won't stick. If the manager is looking to change his bar's focus from being a dive and he intends to kick out trouble before it starts and appeal to a different clientele, maybe you could build it as long as he is willing to stick with it and pay you. But it doesn't look too good as is.

When it's just 3 or 4 of us, we'll play "filler" songs all the way through a couple of times a night. BUT, not after every song. MOST of the other karaoke shows around our area are MORE DJ than karaoke. They'll have 3 or 4 DJ songs, then 1 karaoke singer. That's NOT what we want to do, so we advertise ALL KARAOKE, ALL THE TIME. Filler is played between singers only for the time it takes for the next singer. We want to attract the KARAOKE crowd, NOT the dance club crowd.

Rosario

I agree with you to an extent. When we have 5 or more singers, its pretty much all karaoke, all the time. But, if its less, then we sing one round (everyone gets a chance) and then take a 2 song break. I was actually pist on Saturday when I learned that my new KJ opened the show, let the first (of two) singers sing, then played a DJ song while the 2nd singer gave me a WTF look.

If someone is going into a new show and isn't prepared to play a lot of DJ music, I'd say they're making things very difficult for themselves.

I also tell my KJs that we are KJs FIRST (let the singers sing!), DJs SECOND, and Singers THIRD.

The way I see it, you have only two options.

#1: Change the clientale:

Do YOUR show and run off the current regulars until you have NEW regulars that enjoy your show the way YOU do it.

#2: Change your show (my personal advise):

Adapt to the clientale. You'll see over and over throughout the history of this board and the experiences of others on this board that not everyone's show fits in at every bar. My show is one of the most popular shows in a large tourist area. I do a hybrid DJ/karaoke show.

HOWEVER, I also fill in for a guy about 5-6 times a year at the country line dance bar down the road. Do you think I do my hip-hop DJ/karaoke show at the country bar, and expect them to adapt to my show? Of course not. I do a much more karaoke-oriented show with very minimal filler, and the filler I do play is upbeat country, classic/southern rock, and oldies.

I also picked up a show for a few months where the regulars were all underground music hipster types. Talk about a tough audience! They only liked music that the mainstream had never heard of. Do you think I shoved my "normal" show down their throat? Nope, I went out and researched types of music I knew nothing about, and taylored a new show to their interests. Week 1 was a disaster. Week 2 and onward, after ADAPTING my show to the audience, was a rousing success.


I hate to disagree with you, but the "I'm NOT a DJ, just karaoke. I have NO INTEREST in being a dj" attitude in a new bar where that is what the regulars are ASKING for, means that the problem isn't the bar and their clients. It's not THEM, it's YOU. The problem is that you are not flexible enough to give the bar and its clients a show that will entertain them.

You are trying to sell widgets to people who keep asking you for doohickeys, then complaining that you can't make any sales. Want to make them happy? Become a doohickey salesman!

Just because your particular show is popular at your regular gig doesn't mean it will work everywhere, and it doesn't mean there is something wrong with the new bar's patrons if they don't like your show. I think you need to learn to be more flexible, or else you need to stick to your regular bar where your regular show works. If you want to branch out, you are going to have to learn to branch out!!

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C Mc
KJ, FL

We are also karaoke and not DJ but I could see if there were NO singers waiting that it might be advantageous to bend the rules a bit and adapt--especially in this situation where you are tyring to win over an otherwise hostile crowd--do something to make them happy.

But if we have singers at all, we suggest to people who want dance music that they sing a dance song. There is no reason people can't dance to karaoke--having dance floor type lights helps to encourage that mood. Of course you have to buy the dance songs to begin with so they can sing it.

It probably isn't a practical solution for everyone due to the expense but a friend gave us a used autotune unit and that has helped to get a few of the more modern dance songs done. But we are just gradually introducing it so can't tell if it is a big influence or not (you have to figure out how to use it first). But it has gone over well on "Dynamite" and "Believe" and sounds great with "Fireflies" although that isn't a dancer. If you could pull off Usher's "OMG," Rosario, then you might score some points--don't know--that one is popular in one of our venues but don't know about yours. Or you and your girlfriend could attempt Black Eyed Peas. Or are they requesting polkas?

Encourage singers from your other venue to come even if they don't like the bar due to the problems maybe they can change the attitude of the regulars or run them off during karaoke night. I don't think the manager would mind as long as the till keeps ringing he don't care who is there. But he might like a easier crowd.

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I like everyone when I first meet them. If you don't like me that's not my problem it's YOURS!
A stranger is a friend you haven't met yet

I'm an entertainer. My only job is to make my employer as much money as possible safely and ethically. That is my bottom line.

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C Mc
KJ, FL

Honestly I never took shows in these types of bars. It becomes 'my' reputation as well as the bars. We run strictly karaoke as well, which is why we get karaoke singers, they know we do not play dance music.
I can see having to bend the rules for this type of club, but in all honesty, they would probably be better off just putting in a good jukebox system with immediate download capability.

But I agree with Tony, look elsewhere. This is a no go as far as any possible success, especially when you cannot even get your regular followers to come to the club.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

We're entertainers. Okay, what do you do that's entertaining to these folks? Apparently nothing. Try something new. When I play a bar it's a "dive" bar because that's where I'm comfortable. Maybe you're just not right for that venue.

Here's a trick that has worked every time so far. If I don't have any requests in rotation when the show starts I sing the first song, something up tempo like Pretty Woman, Mony Mony, or Shout. Announce that you have no singers in line. Then the blackmail.... "Right then, it's Pat Boone music until someone puts in a request." Start playing "Tammy" or "April Love" and you won't get past the first verse.

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Okay, who took my pants?

Please let me say, that I am not trying to be insulting, but if I had your attitude, I would have been out of business four years ago!

I would have to say, that I two out of the four bars I play in are "Dive bars" and you know what? I have the most fun there.

I have people come up to me all the time, and say, "I really HATE karaoke, but I love your show."

Why is that?

Because I RESPECT who is there. I blend my show to fit with the bar's clientele, and then I grow the business. I make the bar money.

You are there to ENTERTAIN, not do what YOU want. You are getting paid. If the girls want to get up and dance, great!

Mix it up, do some singing, dancing, playing some music. HAVE FUN!

If you hate being there, that attitude will reflect back to the people there. Be positive, be proactive. I have singers that won't come to "dive bars" but they come to MY show anyway.

Do i always have a full roster of singers? Nope. Do i have a bar full of people having a good time? Yes it do. Do I get gigs for other bars and private parties from these types of shows? You betcha.

That's my .02.

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Good music, good friends, howling good times!

I'd go: "No singers? I'll practice my Tom Jones tribute act until we get some!" Same effect about halfway through "Green Green Grass of Home."

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Dave's not here.

Let me start by saying that I appreciate all of the input.Let me also state that I have NOTHING against the clientele at this certain "dive" bar. Let's face it, I've been around the block MORE than a few times, so that is NOT an issue here. It's not an issue of pleasing the clientele, because I know what they like. It's a JUKEBOX. Which this bar ALREADY has. The problem I'm having is that I KNOW these people don't want ANY KIND of ENTERTAINMENT. It's the OWNER who wants the entertainment, but doesn't want to change the atmosphere, and lose his regulars who are there to DRINK, play POKER MACHINES, GET DRUNK, FIGHT, and all of the other DRAMA. I guess I started this thread just to VENT, because it's just frustrating to know that an OWNER can't even do what HE wants in his own place. It really makes no difference whether I play there or not, as I'm in it to make (some) money, but I enjoy entertaining people and enjoying the experience. If it's not fun for me and my girlfriend, WE DON'T NEED IT. Your situations may be different, but for US, we're not in it for STRESS, and DRAMA. When I retired from my "real job", and got into this business, I swore that when it stopped being enjoyable, we'd quit. Believe me, we've tried EVERY kind of music to please these customers, and NONE of them worked. Koyote, people tell us the same thing, that they LOVE our show, just NOT IN "THEIR BAR".

Rosario

I'd say it's not really the owner's choice about where you do your show, it is YOUR choice. Sounds like this isn't a good match. I have done dive bar shows - I don't mind them but they also require a lot more work on my part - getting to know the patrons, finding out what they like, what they will and will NOT do, and am I enough entertainment for them? (This is important for the times when there are no other singers.)

Here is what I would do in your situation. First off, doesn't sound like your other followers are interested in the place so you are stuck with the regulars. If they are asking for a dance tune now and then, and you're getting paid to work there, then just do it. Karaoke all the time only works if there is someone who wants karaoke all the time. If you really want to keep the gig, bring in the dance music. Doesn't take much to do that ... an hour on Rhapsody, or the budget bin at your local big box store, will provide you with more than enough music to play a tune now and then. Invest in the NOW 34, 35, and 36.

Secondly, I would also find singers who like to sing that kind of music, the kind that will keep those regulars there and buying, and dancing and happy.

Then, begin looking for a place to fill that time slot. You aren't going to win this one. Owner or not, if every time you play there you have to wonder if the ring out is enough to pay you, and if the regulars haven't chewed off the owner's ear about having karaoke there, it isn't a good situation.

Sure he can, but if the market isn't there he's not going to be very successful.

There is a bar here locally that was THE place for karaoke. Had it not been for karaoke the bar would have died years ago and almost did. Well about 2 years ago someone came in and bought the place because it was doing very well. He spent ten's of thousands of dollars if not hundreds to remodel. The new owner then canned the karaoke, because he didn't like it and wanted more bands that would be funded by cover charge at the door.

They've now gone from being open every night to only open Thurs - Sat.

That's one of the problems with bar owners is that they see it as there bar and they'll run it the way they want. Sadly sometimes that just won't work in their market.

BTW - They just recently started karaoke again trying to boost business, but maybe to little to late as other venues nearby have been offering karaoke since they quit.

Try "Eye of the tiger". That should work.

Actually in my situation I was hired for karaoke only. They did not want a dance club (although plenty of people pack the dance floor with the singers). They wanted a karaoke club. So we get more singers that come in regularly. Often times I can walk in the door and have slips already on the desk before I even turn the system on.
But I have always been strictly karaoke as well since I started 20 years ago.

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