Karaoke Forums

We had a bar that did the percentage thing, but never made good on it. First and last time we'd ever do that. It was an instance where we either agreed to the percentage deal or didn't do the gig, and we had nothing going on that night.

Birdofsong

I don't like the percentage idea either. Even if the bar is completely honest, there is still the potential for suspicion which is only going to lead to problems. It a lot like bars that want bands to "play for the door" (i.e. the cover charge). Inevitibly problems arise because the bar doesn't report the earning honestly or the bar lets people in without paying, etc. I just don't see a reason to take a chance. Get an agreement for a flat rate and avoid the issues.

_________________
DJ Tony
Let It Rip Karaoke

I had a percentage gig a long time ago and it worked out well. It was a Friday night at a decent sized sports bar with stage and lights. We agreed on $100 plus 10% of all drink sales. At the end of the night the manager and I went to the POS screen and he pulled the numbers right in front of me, no problem. On my best night I walked with $480.

But... I do agree, percentage deals in general are a risk with dishonest owners/managers.

Bar owners engage in dishonesty??? Why I just can't believe it

I live in a very "fortunate" area, where I can set the rates (and get them!) and although there is "competition", it's nothing for me to worry about. I bring in the numbers and the bar owners realize it. The lowest paying gig I have is $225 and the highest I get is $400. These are PER WEEK rates.
When we have a slow night, it's not because they all went somewhere else, it's because no one came out at all, and they know that it's still money well spent.
I charge a flat rate and will never mess around with the percentage deal. My hubby did that once and got totally ripped off every week. he was asking 10% as well and on nights it was PACKED, they would only give him $150 or $200 and claim that sales were down, even though the place was jammed. Like someone else here said, it tends to encourage suspicion and you really do want the bar owners working WITH you. Best to have a good relationship with them, not one steeped in suspicion.

I've not ever heard of a DJ/KJ doing a percentage thing.. normally because the kind of money a DJ/KJ charges isn't a whole lot.

Now back in my band days, it wasn't uncommon for clubs to offer the band a base pay, plus a percentage of the door.

It gave the band an incentive to really promote the show.. since the more people forking over the $5 a head cover charge, the more cash the band got to put in their pockets.

But in those cases the 'base pay' was significantly more than what your average DJ/KJ would get paid.

But, the dj/kj only shares the cash with,,,, him/herself.

_________________
KingBing Entertainment C'mon Up! I have a song for you!!! [font=MS Sans Serif][/font]

True Rip, but since you haul in all the equipment. listen to all the prima donnas and do all the promoting and take on all the expenses, why not? You earn your money.

Yes, I remember back in the good "ol" band days playing at bars for $400 to $800 and divying it up between between 5 and 6 people of course owning the PA I got the lions share ($200) but then that meant I had to load in and out the entire PA system as well.... I make more doing karaoke with less work a lot fewer prima donnas and half the whining and crying!

Now you're surprising me Virgin... you really think you deal with more prima donnas playing in a band then doing karaoke??? I mean do band members actually whine to each other about who got to do what while you're busy performing??? Cause prima donna karaoke singers will definitely talk to you while people are singing and sometimes even while you are singing.

That's how I got in this biz.. I had the PA, and got tired of going through all the hassle of keeping a band together, booking shows, practice.. just to get to the end of the night having to split $400 five ways.

I've gone through a few phases over the last 15 years or so where i'll take a break from karaoke and hook up with a group for a few months to fill in.. bit it doesn't take long for me to be reminded why I don't try to make a living doing it.

I always had the PA, but never took a larger cut because of it. Only bands i've ever been in where one person got a larger share of the nights take was when I played with someone who was 'quasi famous'.

I think that no matter whether you work on percentage or don't, you will find some owners are honest and will show you the z tape and work as a team with you or you will find some who will try to mess with you, not matter what the deal. Percentage has worked for us when we have found a "good" owner.

Very true. We worked percentage for a while and very quickly it got to the point where the owner (back then) began to notice what he was paying us - never thinking, of course, that he got incredible service for the price - and he began thinking of ways to reduce the amount. Wasn't there long after that.

With the prices of disc on E-Bay increasing (seems that a lot of people are suddenly buying up CDGs on E-bay for some reason) that may have a ripple effect on pricing by beer KJs and in the end push up the prices that KJs get in any given area. It is a matter of supply and demand.

Well let's see! The drummer doesn't show up for every other practice because he doesn't really need to, The lead doesn't want to learn any new songs because he doesn't like them, the bass player shows up for practices and gigs drunk 80% of the time or proceeds to get drunk the other 20% and can't repeat the same line twice in a row because of it, both the drummer and keyboard player think they should get a bigger cut because they have bigger stuff to carry in, the leads singer thinks he should get a bigger cut because he is the front man that everyone really comes to hear, you practice to make the songs and transitions tight but on the night of a gig half of the band is drunk or drugged out of their minds and couldn't put two songs together with a hammer and nails. Every member of the band thinks they are irreplaceable and things should be done their way, everyone of them fancies themselves as a song writer and wants the band to do "their" song (no matter how bad it really is) All of them want to do "their own music" instead of covers (that people actually want to hear.

The whinning, crying, bitching and moaning is continuous and we haven't even got into the mix yet!

The drummer doesn't want the lead or vocals in his mix, the bass player only wants the keyboard and rhythm in his mix, the lead wants his guitar to be louder than anything else in the band (including the vocals), lead singer wants his vocals to washout everything else. everybody is unhappy with everyone else unless they are all drunk at which piont none of them can play or sing.

No there is no comparision between a Karaoke prima donna and a band prima donna and the headaches that come with it!

Hey Virgin...sounds like you need a new band. That one doesn't work right. My husband's band has very strict guidelines...i.e., no drinking on the job, no drugging, etc. No egos. Don't like the rules, don't stay in the band.

I have been involved in many bands in my life and have never encountered the kind of band you're talking about. wow. I'd quit playing in bands, too, if mine was like that.

Wow, so you've met my previous drummer, lead guitar player(s), and bass player then?
Lmao... very accurately discriptive;)


.

_________________
♥ Laugh your heart out, dance in the rain. Cherish the memories, ignore the pain. Love and learn, forget and forgive. Because you only have one life to live. ♥

I've been in and out of working bands for literally the last 23 years, and what Virgin is talking about is the same crap i've experienced.

In karaoke, there just aren't nearly as many variables. The version you have of the cover song is the version you have. About the most I hear from the 'prima donna' karaoke singer is the occasional gripe I don't have their favorite version of a song, or them asking to be turned up 30 feet in front of the mix.

Problems with guys in a band.. it's not even in the same league as your garden variety karaoke diva.

From guys with trouble with drugs or booze, to guys with trouble with the law. Guys who show up to practice wanting to borrow one of my instruments because theirs is in the pawn shop.. but don't worry.. i'll have it out by the next gig.. to just plain flakey guys who simply don't show up.

I used to have a sax player who would just send his students to fill in for him. Wouldn't even tell us he wasn't going to be there.. some kid would come walking in 10 minutes before the gig started with a horn in his hands. Fortunately the kids could all read, and my bass player would chart the stuff out for 'em real quick.

It's not as easy as 'don't like the rules, then you're out of the band' when you've got a full calendar booked. Unless you have everyone in the band playing off sheet music.. AND you have a replacement sight reader waiting in the wings.. i mean.. at least in rock and roll, you don't have a 2nd and 3rd chair.

Then you have the crazy girlfriends/wives. The chick that shows up and wants to fight because some other drunk chick flashed her chest to the band.

Or the girlfriend who thinks just because she happens to be blowing the bass player, that she should be able to sing 4 country songs a night.. even though it ain't a country band.

I guess it's all relative, isn't it. It would take me about 2 minutes to figure out that I didn't want to be involved with a group like that, and wouldn't. Most musicians I have associated with have been far more professional.

Yes, I agree there are a lot of more "professional musicians" out there, let's see like all the members of the "Rolling Stones", "Janis Joplin", half of the "Mamas and Papas", "Jimi Hendricks", and I could go on and on with a list of just the more famous "professional" musicians without even getting anywhere near those who are a legend in their own minds. My cousins in three years has been through 12 people trying to put together a band that will work together, and they are currently looking for another Keyboard player, lead vocalist and percussionist, my cousins both play guitar, bass, drums, keys and Jack also plays sax, violin, banjo and trumpet but they can't do it all onstage by themselves. The problems they are having I listed in my post above.

When the musicians are younger they have all the problems listed by Cheese and Myself, when they are older they have wives, husbands and children as well as the girlfriend/boyfriend problems plus the EGO problem and half of them are now deaf in one or more ear, suffering from tinnitus, liver failure, kidney problems, diabetes, a bad heart or a host of other ailments that can kept them from performing!

It is a rare band of more than three people who can all get along and don't cry like a bunch of little babies everytime something doesn't go their way. The last band I worked with had a problem with the lead guitarist because the gig was 130 miles away and his girlfriend couldn't go because it was an overnighter and she didn't want him out of her sight. My cousin filled in for them but hadn't done any practice with them at all