Karaoke Forums

This is a long story short version of my ordeal,that being said,Let me give you all a bit of history. We hired my husbands cousin (by marriage not blood TG) a few years ago he worked for us for 3 years.When he quit he quit b/c he had been planning buying equipment (all this behind our backs and the equipment is just like ours mind you) & stealing the shows we were working at the time (by undercutting our prices & telling the venue that we were trying to get away from the weekly shows & just do parties & weddings which was a lie) now when we found all this out we tried to get the one gig back by letting them know that his cousin was lyeing about us wanting to give up weekly shows. Well he undercut our prices so much we just gave up b/c we werent going to work for peanuts. we had that show for 2 yrs before he started working for us so we "thought" we had "some sort of relationship" with the venue but I suppose $ means more than that to them. Anyways, the other gig we werent worried about b/c we didnt care for the owner of the venue.

Back to the long story short version...this guy has been going to ALL of our contacts from when he was working for us (like gigs we would do in seasons b/c we're a college town) stealing our gigs for almost 2 years now. He has implemented ALL of OUR business tactics, policies & practices. Uses every way we use to advertise & grow our business.
Fast forward to this past week. We do a yearly charity event in honor of my mom who died of cancer & my husbands mom who survived breast cancer. We ve been doing it for 4 years this year would have been 5. EXCEPT his freaking cousin decides to take over & call it the exact same name barring one small word he used for A cure we call our event for THE cure...THIS P's me off to NO END! No one owns the name but WE brought it to the area 4 yrs ago noone has done a karaoke benifit for cancer in this area for 4 yrs (actaully ever that I know of) besides OUR company & HE decides to basically TAKE it like it was his own idea his own hearts choice. He did it to F with US. He has no interest other than that in doing this event. Im LIVID hot!
I WISH there was "something" I can do to stop this guy from doing this crap. This charity event was personal to us. We did it in honer of our mothers remember.
Now dont get me wrong,good old fashioned competition is so ok with me. I have NO problems with ANY of the other karaoke hosts in our area,NONE of them! But when it comes to an ex employee using all of our business practices and stealing from us I am at my wits end! What do you guys suggest we do if anything? I dont want to argue with anyone here btw,I just want a little feedback on if this has happened to any of you how you handled it. Thanks so much in advance for any info that might help me deal with this garbage.

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Kelley
Star Sounds Karaoke & Mobile Recording Studio


[shadow=black][scroll]You have to respect your audience. Without them, you're essentially standing alone, singing to yourself....KD Lang[/scroll][/shadow]

unfortunately, i don't see a whole lot as the owners really don;t care about anything but bottom line "what do i have to pay you at the end of the night".
what this person is doing is absolute bull $h!t and deplorable, especially in the cancer show. aside from a long trip to the desert with a shovel, i am not sure you can do anything. i hope you get the revenge you need and deserve.

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Paradigm Karaoke, The New Standard.......Shift Happens

I feel for ya... It doesn't sound like there's much you can do. I really don't have any business experience to advise you on what to do here.

I do have a question regarding the charity event. This event is something that you volunteered to do, right? That means that you were not getting paid to do it. You were donating your time. I would assume that the same is holding true for this Cousin. Since he will not be paid for this, why don't you just donate some money to "The Cure" and let it go at that. You can make a donation in "Honor of your Mother" for this event. This is supposed to be a charity event, so does it really matter who runs the show?

Cueball,
Its the principal of the whole event. We enjoyed doing this for four years. We took pride in it I guess you could say. We could have just donated $ in the first place but wanted to do a fun thing to honor our mothers. So yeah it kinda matters to us that WE run the show.

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Kelley
Star Sounds Karaoke & Mobile Recording Studio


[shadow=black][scroll]You have to respect your audience. Without them, you're essentially standing alone, singing to yourself....KD Lang[/scroll][/shadow]

I'm thinking WOW what an A$$.

Where did he come up with all the music in a such a short period of time he must be loaded?

Is it all Legit?

If not tell the venues he's doing including the one for charity what he is doing just might be illegal and they just might get in trouble for letting him do it.

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I like everyone when I first meet them. If you don't like me that's not my problem it's YOURS!
A stranger is a friend you haven't met yet

This is a perfect example of why some companies do NOT want the employees to "learn too much" of their business and have segmented their operations. Another way of saying; "keeping their own employees dumb."

One company here has an "equipment set up guy" that does nothing but move systems around and set them up and test them. The hosts have no clue as to troubleshooting if there is a problem. All they know is the volume knobs for the music and microphones and the "play" button.

The set up guy can't host worth a hoot and the hosts have no clue where are the wires go or how much equipment costs.

This is a classic example of why companies use non-disclosure/non-compete agreements to protect trade secrets and stop employees from leaving and starting up a competing company.

The charity event thing confuses me. How could he manage to just "take over"? If he's getting your gigs simply by undercutting your price that's one thing, but there's no price to undercut in a charity gig is there? Don't you have sponsors and such that you deal with for your charity gig that would recognize he is not you?

If on the other hand the charity event has always been held at the same venue and this is a venue that he is now working, the venue probably views this as their charity event and him as a mere "tool" in helping them pull it off.

Who is the organizer of this event? If you have been the organizer of the event in the past, then the contacts and such are yours. Start organizing and pull your event off in spite of what he is doing. He will look like an unprofessional copy-cat with nefarious motives.

If you have not been the organizer, and have only been a KJ for the organizer, there's not much you can do about it other than approach the organizer and question their change in loyalty.

Either way you better gear up for some business warfare.

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KNOW THYSELF

All you can do is "weather the storm"......you have to show him it doesn't bother you.....you must outlast him. Do another benefit on a different day(can never raise enough). Be better than him, nicer than him, and keep your head up. People like him give up sooner or later.....hopefully sooner.....good luck.......

Not worth the paper they're printed on.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Lone Wolf,I have asked myself that same question about his music..I still feel he stole our music also..even though he "started out" with 200 songs he now has more than us (10,000 songs) at a whopping 12,000 songs...it took me over 10 yrs to collect my music! I think he has been pulling our music out a little at a time as to throw us off from thinking he has our music. I do not/will not go to one of his shows to see it for myself though there prolly would be problems if we did. All I can say about him being legit is I WISH the karaoke police come to Gainesville asap to get rid of the riff raff in our city. Its rampid!
As far as telling the venue for the charity what hes doing & all its of no use he used to work for them also. All his sponsers are "friends" of his even the freakin company HIS MOM works for!

C.Staley,this has actually happened to us before with my own by blood brother. After that I was apprehensive about hiring family but my husband AND his cousin would ALWAYS assure me that my cousin was not my brother. His cousins favorite saying on the subject is "Im not your brother God dont like ugly" it made my skin crawl when he said it & it still does! Soo..thats why no no compete clause was used he spent over 2 yrs spouting that bs! & my husband let him have more biz info & more I wanna say "control" over OUR bisiness b/c he trusted him. Im always an untrusting person when it comes to our business. I dont give anyone too much info on how I do things even where I buy my supplies or equipment. BUT you have to understand karaoke was MY "baby" MY passion MY thing not my husbands so when my husband got help doing what I wanted him to do he was greatful b/c this is a "part time" thing for HIM he has a day job full time also. I told him for soo long not to give him so much "power" but deaf ears. Hes the trusting kind. Not me not after my brother! But whats done is done I suppose. I cant be mad too much at my husband he trusted his cousin like I trusted my brother. SAD that family would do this crap!Business plan template

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Kelley
Star Sounds Karaoke & Mobile Recording Studio


[shadow=black][scroll]You have to respect your audience. Without them, you're essentially standing alone, singing to yourself....KD Lang[/scroll][/shadow]

earthling12357

I dont know HOW he manages to just "take over" we were planning on an early October release (b/c we specifically wanted to do Breast cancer this yr & Oct is breat canceer month) & late October event but before our early October release I see on his facebook page that hes doing it! WTF?? I was and still am sooo p'd off! We use different sponsors every year. The first 3 were held at the same place & the last year we did it his cousin ran the show (as far as hosting anyways) so he got the venue which was a great venue but he had "connections" there b/c he worked for the a few years earlier. Another example of giving him too much control over what we should have had control over but it worked so we went with it. No excuses but stupidity I guess!

As far as doing the event in spite of him I just do not want to hear from our contacts (which are not like close friends they are just people who have entered the charity event before) "didnt you guys already do that this year?" and have to go into "no that wasnt us" & then listen to them say "well Im sorry I cant contribute to YOUR event b/c I already contributed to the other one thinking it was you guys or thinking it was the annual event" then I would have to be in a position of having to defend ourselves & badmouth him & our clients contacts & friends dont deserve that or even WANT to hear it ya know.So I just gave it up but did put a post on our company f/b letting everyone know it wasnt our event & the whole ordeal ina manner I thought was ok. heres our f/b to maybe give your opinion on if its ok or not. Im not taking it down b/c of anyones opinion b/c I put it there for a reason but I will surely listen to your views or anyone elses views. If the link doesnt work just look up star sounds entertainment of florida http://www.facebook.com/#!/StarSoundsEn ... tofFlorida


We have been the organizers for the yearly event since we brought it to the area. Im so just angry right now he totally just stole it! I mean he could have used soo many other names or even another charity (not cancer in other words) Hes gay & I dont at all have anything to say about that other than the ffact he could have done something closer to his heart like gay rights or something within that community. Why did he feel the need to use OUR charity fundraising event? Hes just copying everything! Stealing everything! Im so done with it!

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Kelley
Star Sounds Karaoke & Mobile Recording Studio


[shadow=black][scroll]You have to respect your audience. Without them, you're essentially standing alone, singing to yourself....KD Lang[/scroll][/shadow]

Hi Johnny! Long time!! Anyways I have heard that from SOO many people in the past two years "dont give him the stisfaction of knowing it bothers you" or "what goes around comes around" "karmas a byatch" & a few others! Im getting weary I think waiting for him to hit the wall. I have tried so hard to get the karaoke police out here to no avail. I know theyre busy but they have been to this area before & investigated a few people with consequences,I just wish theyd get HIM. Thanks for the well wishes

Lonman, do you have any suggestions as to what we could do now I know the no compete clause "might not" have worked but we'll never know b/c we didnt have one.

Anyone else had any ex employee competition problems that theyve handled? How did you do it?

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Kelley
Star Sounds Karaoke & Mobile Recording Studio


[shadow=black][scroll]You have to respect your audience. Without them, you're essentially standing alone, singing to yourself....KD Lang[/scroll][/shadow]

BTW if you go to the fb page the post about it is about 7 or 8 posts down sorry

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Kelley
Star Sounds Karaoke & Mobile Recording Studio


[shadow=black][scroll]You have to respect your audience. Without them, you're essentially standing alone, singing to yourself....KD Lang[/scroll][/shadow]

Not really it's always been a cut throat business. But there is nothing you can do to stop it - NEVER hire family to begin with, only train those people hired for hosting only, not the in & outs of everything else. Unless he was an 'actual' employee where you paid all taxes, SSN, etc. like a true employer would, on him, a non-compete wouldn't work since he is technically not your employee, he'd be classed as a independant contractor in which there is no recourse other than hope your show is going to stand on it's own merits and hold it's price and the clubs believe the same.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

I would suggest sending a letter to all of your sponsors from the past reminding them of the date and location of your fifth annual event stressing fifth annual and thanking them for their participation.

I don't see anything wrong with pointing out that there is a new unaffiliated outfit starting up a karaoke event for a worthwhile charity using a name very similar to yours for reasons unknown to you.

"I appreciate your continued support and regret any confusion caused by their actions"

A written letter will probably be the best way to deal with it so you can avoid off the cuff emotional comments that may look unprofessional.

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KNOW THYSELF

I'm willing to bet that he stole your music just like he's stolen everything else from you.

1. I would visit all of the venues that he is working for (which were previously yours) and inform them that he is most likely operating illegally. Inform them that they are opening themselves up to a lawsuit and for them to ask the KJ to show them certification from SC and/or Chartbuster or show them all of the CD's for every track on his computer/hard drive to prove he is legal. Of course, he won't be able to do this.

2. Call SC and Chartbuster and the KIAA and report him.

Remember, anybody that can charge less than $150 can do so because they have no investment in music. It's stolen. That's why they can undercut everyone else.

Good Luck and fight back.

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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.

Alan, you can't walk in someplace and tell them that your competition is "most likely" operating illegally. Do you realize what kind of hot water you'd get into if they weren't, or even if they were and you couldn't prove it? You could open yourself up to a pretty nasty lawsuit. Get proof first, or don't do it.

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Birdofsong

OK, maybe the wrong choice of words but there's nothing saying that you can't inform the venue owners about the ramifications of hiring someone operating illegally.

Without accusing anyone or implying that the current host is "most likely" illegal, you can inform them what to look for, what questions to ask, and how to protect themselves.

I would think that any venue owner does not want to risk losing their liquer license and be named in a lawsuit.

You can also print out the PDF file from the KIAA's website for bar owners. Handling in this manor, you are not accusing anyone.

Here's how I would handle it:

Mr. Bar owner, did you know that 90% of KJ's are putting on shows using stolen or pirated music? Did you know that hiring one of them puts you and your establishment at risk of a lawsuit if they should get caught?

Handling it in this way is NOT accusing anyone.

Mr. Bar owner: Karaoke piracy is a big problem that is affecting the industry. Here's how you can help and protect yourself from a possible lawsuit...

Good luck.

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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.

As much as I feel for you, you should have seen the warning signs. If you listen to my old "karaoke system owner who rented to me", she'll tell you that I stole all of her shows. Truth is, I was a good karaoke host just starting out - with no money for my own system - and was on a rental agreement with her to rent her system for 4 of my own shows and one of hers. When she found out that I was on the verge of switching my "karaoke affiliation" (because I found a better system at 33% less cost), she "fired" me. But, all of the owners stuck with me. And I even took the show she booked. Hell yes I did - but I wouldn't have taken "her" bar had she not called all my bars to say "I fired Troy". They all said "Who are you again? We hired Troy to run karaoke, not you".

But, that's not your scenario. Still, I have been in the business long enough to know that today's karaoke hosts are often tomorrow's owners.

Good luck - and use this as a learning experience and get better at what you do.

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I'm not a cheerleader, but I paid for my pom poms with my own money!