Karaoke Forums

Your plan might work for ethical/honest KJs, but the purpose of an audit is to validate that what is being stated to be true by the person being audited is indeed true.

Using the method stated above, I could imagine a scenario in which a Pirate KJ would simply find out which SC disks contain the songs he has pirated and submit that list to SC. Since nobody is auditing that the list he sent is actually the list he owns, then there would be no way to tell if he were being honest. If SC then used that list to create a songbook for that KJ and posted it on their website, then there would be no way for any competing KJ or SC rep to verify because they would see him using songs in his show that are in his dishonest songbook.

I agree that the audit process is very inconvenient for the legitimate KJs of the world, but ultimately, it may be what is necessary to clean up the industry by making it hard for the pirates to succeed. And as stated above, the purpose of the audit is to find out who is legit and who is not...so it would seem to be a necessary evil.

... we run an investigation, and bad things happen (bad for that KJ)...

But why?
I feel like you are intentionally missing my point.
If I show you my disks and have them registered with you, you would know what should be on my drive and what should not.
The post audit situation would be no different whether you saw my hard drive or not.
It seems to me this would help streamline the audit process and allow more resources to be devoted to investigations.

SC8125, while more rare than a lot of discs, is hardly unique. The cachet of 8125 is (1) its relative rarity combined with (2) the popularity of the songs on it, plus (3) its "forbidden" nature, which has practically spawned a cottage industry of urban legends.

Of those factors, factor 2 is easily the most important. They're great songs that everybody knows and that are, with a couple of notable exceptions (such as Hotel California, which, by the way, is on the GEM series), pretty singable.

I'm going to disagree with you slightly about "original form." It may be true that collectibles are more valuable if in original form. But I think you would be hard pressed to quantify the devaluation caused by the marking process in the context of a karaoke disc that has been removed from the shrink wrap.

Also, in the audits I have personally been involved in, I have marked 3 copies of 8125. No one complained.

I think you're really reaching on that point. Going on your logic alone, you have already devalued your SC 8125 disc by:

1. Removing the Shrink Wrap and opening the package.

2. You have devalued that same disc by playing it over and over again (every time someone has requested to sing a song off that disc).

3. Variation of Number 2... You have devalued that same disc by making a backup copy of it to use (and keeping the original safely away in storage somewhere). Every time you put that disc into a machine to play (even just that 1 time), there will be some kind of markings on the disc as a result of it spinning around at hyperspeed. The fact that you have put it in a machine to make a burn/copy of it, you have already created markings on the disc.

I'm sorry, but I don't see the harm in using special ink to place an ID mark on a disc. I know many KJs who use a Sharpie Marker to mark every one of their discs. Some use it as a code to find the discs easier when pulling them for people to sing from...
Example: You can place 4 discs in each page of a Case Logic holder. I know a KJ who writes 1A, 1B, 1C, 1D on the discs that sit in the first page. On Page 2, he has written 2A, 2B, 2C, and 2D on the discs in that page, etc... Now, instead of using Manufacturer codes, this KJ uses the Page codes as his songbook codes to find and pull a disc for play.

In your example of SC 8125, I have a question for you. Did you buy the disc to be used at Karaoke, or to own as a Collector's Item (like a Star Wars figurine, or an Original Barbie Doll in her NEVER OPENED packaging)? If you bought it to be used, then it shouldn't matter one bit if a small invisible marking be placed on a part of the disc where it won't affect the ability to read the data off the disc in order to continue using it.

How would that scenario be any different if a legit host turned pirate decided to only include discs and tracks that he owns to be audited. After certification he goes back to using his/her pirated SC tracks as well.

In either scenario it seems the following would be the case.

For: HarringtonLaw

I would like to know if I have a hundred or so of SC discs and were in the process of buying a hundred or so more that I wanted to rip to a HD (haven't yet). Can I get an audit before I rip them to a HD?

Must I wait until I have all my discs ripped to the HD before you will grant me an audit and why?
Because I know it takes hours,days,weeks, even months to rip a large inventory.

I know you are going to say so we can check you HD and make sure that you do not have any illegal SC material on it, but what is keeping someone that has gone through the audit from obtaining illegal tracks once they pass the audit?

I'm not saying I would do this but the possibility exists.
You can check my HD if you want but it is empty

I think a better question would be this - If you buy ANY disc and leave it shrink-wrapped (claiming collector status), how did you obtain a ripped version of the tracks? Unless you ripped the tracks yourself, the act of obtaining the tracks is likely illegal.

-Chris

That scenario would be different because if an audited KJ started using songs in their show that were not listed in their official SC public songbook, then they would be easily identified as a pirate. Therefore, post-audit verification is maintained.

I have several hundred songs I do not list in my books due to language restrictions in our club, but occasionally will allow someone to sing them if I know them & they will censor themselves. Doesn't mean piracy in that situation. Also I don't list duplicate songs, but still have them as otions for people to choose if they want.

Of course all of this presupposes that, after an audit, SC would make such a list and make it public...which is purely hypothetical based upon comments in earlier threads.

If the Certificate No. is underlined, you may click it to see a copy of the songbook which was current at the time of their audit. Changes in the songs on their system (additions or deletions of songs or the purchase or sales of original discs) may cause a host to deviate from being in 1:1 compliance with the attached songlist.

I posted that idea in reference to what is already on SoundChoices Certified KJ page.

I'll see what I can do. I know they are looking at revamping the site. I will make sure that information is added as soon as it can be.

Not true if you own multiple copies of the same disc. Do you really think it's necessary to open each copy and rip it separately? I have 9 copies of some phm discs. Do you really think I would need to open each one if I were running 9 copies?

My bad. I did not clarify. I did not mean to suggest that you have to open everyone. I was trying to target specifically to the SC8125 disc. If you only have 1 and it is still shrinkwrapped, then 1) the tracks were stolen or 2) they were ripped legaly and the disc was re-wrapped.

-Chris

Being in the trenches, and knowing a little bit more about the industry from our end than you do......you are wrong about #2 being the reason.....

My bad. I did not clarify. I did not mean to suggest that you have to open everyone. I was trying to target specifically to the SC8125 disc. If you only have 1 and it is still shrinkwrapped, then 1) the tracks were stolen or 2) they were ripped legaly and the disc was re-wrapped.

-Chris