Karaoke Forums

If someone purchases used SC cdgs, how can they recognize the "marks"? Also, if bought online, it might be too late to avoid making the transaction.
What should we do?.....What can we do?......Any knowledge(from anyone) how CB marks audited cdgs?.....
Also, what is the procedure for selling cdgs, that have been audited?.......thanks in advance

very good questions Johnny I am sure that Mr Harrington will pop in soon to answer

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I think it was mentioned somewhere, that if you decide to sell your SC discs (the ones that were audited and marked), not only do you have to remove those tracks from your hard drive, but you need to include some sort of bill-of-sale indicating the transfer of ownership of those (marked) discs. I'm sure Mr. Harrington can correct me on that point, if I am wrong.

Now as for someone who just puts them up on e-bay, and doesn't say anything about their discs being marked (as the result of an audit), it would be interesting to know what Mr. Harrington has to say about that. After all, how are you (the buyer) supposed to know that you purchased a disc that was marked with an invisible stamp (the method that they are now using at SC), if the Seller doesn't say anything? And what are you supposed to do about it if you decide to get audited, and you don't have a receipt any more? Personally, since I am not in this as a business, I do not keep any of my receipts for new purchases beyond the point of me testing the disc out to make sure it's playable. Once I have done that, I add the disc to my library, and toss the receipt. I only keep the receipt if I know the disc is going to be returned. I didn't start running any Karaoke shows until I had well over 400 discs in my library. Prior to that, it was a hobby collection. And, since I didn't keep receipts for the first 400 discs, I just didn't/don't see the point in me keeping them for the other 600 discs I have accumulated over the years.

I'm going to bump this one up to the top one more time...

Johnny, I confess to being confused by the questions- maybe I just don't understand them.

We're talking about factory original CD+Gs here right?

Previous to the SC stuff, if someone had some extras- or a bunch- they simply sold them. Somebody eles bought them. Ownership changed hands. That's it.

What difference does whatever SC's doing make?

Someone may have gone through an audit and had their discs marked- OK. Later on they decide to sell the discs ( BTW- I'm assuming that we are talking about standard discs, not the leased GEMS) and does so. Ownership changes hands- same as before.

Whatever auditing process the original owner went through has no effect on the new owner. The old owner would be expected by SC to delete those songs from their shows.

The new owner just bought some used discs just like before, and the discs start a new life with him. What the new owner does with them is up to him, same as before.

Was there something that I am missing from your questions?

Note to Cueball: Cue, if you have a collection of original manufacturers' discs then the fact that you are not a pirate is self-evident. Why would you worry about receipts? You wouldn't need them for anything but showing business expenses for tax purposes, and after all the years you've been collecting, it's a lttle late for that write-off anyway...

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Yes--1. He wants to know if a procedure is in place for reigistering a transfer of ownership of marked discs and what that would be.

2. He wants to know if he has a way to tell if he is buying already marked discs off of eBay, etc.. Maybe they are stolen and he buys them and then goes for an audit and the marks show up. What then. Just an example.

3. He likes hearing from Mr. Harrington. He is sort of a kick. Okay, I put words in his mouth.

Almost Joe,
my buddy Chris got audited and discs marked so i can not use them in my audit.
i buy his Foundations from him, but they are marked, preventing me from borrowing them for an audit (cheating the audit)
as they are marked, i can not rip them in my system as they already have a mark on them, thereby being invalid.'
i just bought useless foundations.
unless there is some other way.
in your Luddite case, no issues at all, in my digital case, big issues.

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Paradigm Karaoke, The New Standard.......Shift Happens

It's a little simpler than that.
I pulled these excerpts from the soundchoice website:



Since "content" has been defined as including your CD+G and ownership of "content" is identified as Soundchoice, after signing this you won't have the right to sell your discs, so no problems.

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KNOW THYSELF

In my opinion, when Sound Choice started making karaoke cdgs, they were intended for home use, and never in their wildest dreams did they foresee a commercial use. They've been trying to go back in time, and get the money they would have gotten had they saw it comming...... ...that's at least part of it, in my opinion.
ps.....not just for the money, but for control of the use of their product.......just my opinion...

Is that what you are required to agree to for the voluntary audit?

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My statements, opinions and conclusions are based on my own personal experiences, observations, research and/or just my own $.02. I'm not a "cheerleader", but that doesn't make me a Pirate.

I'm not sure if it is used in a pre-suit audit or not. It's generic enough that I imagine so. Here's the link for the full document:
http://www.soundchoicestore.com/skin1/i ... %20SUE.pdf
There's a few things in it to give me pause, see if you can find them.

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KNOW THYSELF

Sorry...I have to disagree. I was around at the beginning and Sound Choice was most definitely marketing to the commercial market. They put inserts in their discs telling KJ's how buying SC discs could help them maximize profits. The home market came much later.

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Birdofsong

Birdsong is 100% correct. Sound Choice has been marketing to and producing for commercial KJ's at least since they started releasing on CD media.

-Chris

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-Chris

Well they rushed into it, and didn't do their home work....they were a later entry into the game......any opinions from anyone else?.....

ps....my statement is still true..........it's still my opinion...

Johnny, they were one of the first. They started on cassette tape.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

Yep I have some cassette still dating back to the mid 80's that I found before we had video discs - cdg wasn't really even out yet at that point - at least in this area. I never saw a DK cdg until 91 or so.
Singing Machine was another in that era.
They didn't rush into anything IMO, when BC was on the SCBB, he stated when they got into CDG, there was no classification (cdg was still fairly new at that point) and they were considered phonorecords at that time, so they released their tape library with the graphics. It wasn't until the Eagles said Nay Nay to the displaying of graphics with their lyrics is when it all started! Later CDG's were re-classified as audio/video works where the sync licensing came into play which hampered some of their releases (and many other manus at that time as well).

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I said later, not late.....according to wikipedia Pioneer dominated the international karaoke market in the 80s & 90s....anyway, I always say things that I hope will get "any kind" of a response.....forums have been slow for a long time now. Also, I haven't got a response from HarringtonLaw on my topic header, and I'm trying to keep it up near the top for at least a few days........guess I only have myself to blame, that no one takes my questions seriously..... ....I can live with that...

I got this from a question & answer page dated Apr 18, 2010:

"DK karaokes are produced by Daiichikosho Co., Ltd., otherwise referred to as DK. The company, founded in 1973, has headquarters in Tokyo, Japan. Although the karaoke market has seen a sharp decline since 2004, Daiichikosho Co., Ltd. remains the largest producer of professional karaokes."

Pioneer dominated in the LaserKaraoke - however I believe Wiki has wrong info or at least misleading, Pioneer didn't come out with karaoke Laserdiscs until like 88, which is when they basically took over the cassette market since lyrics could be shown on screen & instant cue up - no fast forwarding/rewinding anymore. CDG didn't even exist until later 80's which is when DK sprouted, then it was a race between video or graphics - in which graphics eventually won around 93 or 94, which is also about the time SC started making cdg's. Cassettes with printed lyric sheets were being made by several manus and which is what MOST kj's used in the late 80's (the few kj's that existed that is). Much of the 'karaoke' scene in the 80's was the recording booths (all cassette tapes) you'd see at malls & fairs, where you could record yourself singing and bring home the result. These died down once karaoke hit the bar/club scene in the late 80's as well.

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Pioneer introduced the LD Karaoke system October, 1981

"October 1981: Introduces LD player for home use and 70 LD software titles in Japan.
October 1982: Introduces the LD Karaoke system for business use.
November 1982: Introduces CD player."

I was over at the warehouse, and there were two Pioneer Laser machines on the shelf..

I should have asked "How Much"?