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...Well, as much as I don't like admitting it. I was out of the hosting business when the newer technology came into the Karaoke Hosting World (early-mid 2000's). I hosted from late 80's to 2001 and started to come back in it around late 2008 (disc-based only). I still had a collection of CDG's from those working years, some I did sell. I even bought some after my hosting days for my personal use and potential future at hosting again.

.....Around 2008, I decided to get back in but wasn't interested in going digital. Started building my system and buying new CDG's. At some point the word started coming out from Manufacturers "as long as you're 1:1" we will consider you OK to play. So, I decided to give the digital music side a shot. After months and months and months of ripping and re-ripping, I was almost ready. As the weeks and months passed, new rules were being set down by the "Big 3." It's Audit Time! Cool, no problem.

....Once digital was being accepted and put out by certain manufactures (2011), I decided to purchase some digital products from CB and PHM. Had no problems with either company. Especially when they started checking their sales records. After that it was more along the lines wow, ok then "Sir, is there anything else we can get you today?" and "By the way, we truly thank you for you business." I also made sure they had pictures of my CDG's/SD Cards for their records and told them, "IF I ever decided to sale any of them I would pass on the info to them plus get buyer's name, address and phone number for their records." They said, "Thanks, but keep in mind the new owner, if for KJ use, must follow the same rules." I said no problem, will pass it own and thanks"

....I completely understand the issues with Piracy, not only in Karaoke but many other IP businesses. It's truly in a sad state worldwide. Sound Choice has a great deal to protect but consumers also have rights. Their 1:1 audit requirements (agreements) are a little too invasive for me at this point. Thought it would be fairly simple: 1) Set a date. 2) Go through my HD. 3) Pick any SC CDG, (matter fact, let's start at the beginning and go through all of them, I don't care). 3) Payment from me (electronically) 4) Receive Certificate plus sticker. 5) Get business on SC website. 6) Be prepared for any potential future audit/s. 7) Update any new SC products when purchased.

....Apparently the RULES just keep changing and I no longer feel like dancing to the new stuff. So, I believe that I will just stay partly in the dark ages, as a KJ and play my SC-CDG's from Original CDG's (not my media-shifted/format-shifted HD).

...Will this be a pain? Somewhat but been there and done that before. Will I subject my SC CDG's to theft, possible damages and progressive usage? Yes. Will it mean having to play some Karaoke off of external hard drive through laptop (LEGALLY PURCHASED ripped CDG's, CB-SD Cards and CB-Digital Libraries) and some (SC-CDG's) off of my laptop's CD drive? Yes. Will it mean carrying around an extra 314 SC CDG's? Yes, but I will take them out of the jewel cases and packs (foundations & bricks) then put them in numbered window sleeves and keep them in the old disc box within my reach but can be seen if you approach my table. Will I have to hold up each and every SC CDG that I plan to play and announce, "Here's another Karaoke Classic we're playing from the Sound Choice Disc Collection...." every time? Yes.

....Will an investigator see my SC CDG's? He should if he's trained and qualified but I will not toss them out on my table for everyone to TOUCH, GRAB, STEAL or BREAK. I have invested a great deal of $$$ in them and taken EXTREME CARE of them this far in the game and I'm not gonna change that part now. If someone comes up to me and wants to see them, I will show them but no touchie-touchie. I don't want someone to scratch my plastic.

....Now, will this keep me legal in the eyes of Sound Choice? From what I've read, it's suppose too!

....For those who have taken the audits and passed or settled, I SINCERELY wish you, your business and Sound Choice the very best, honestly I do. As with many other KJ's, I'm also hoping for new Sound Choice Music in the near future. As far as Fighting Piracy, I would be the first person in line to stand right beside you.

....You're free to question my reasons, rip me a new one, make fun or whatever you wish. But just remember, I have read (pulled up old threads) where some of the other KJ's on here have had their concerns with the SC Auditing System and or Agreement. Some have went forward and some have stood their ground. Either way, it's their choice. For me, I do want to have my Sound Choice Purchases in my Library with the others. But, if it's going to bring nothing but Fear of being named in a lawsuit (even while doing the right thing as mentioned above) then I will have to reconsider if I want to even keep my SC CDG's.

....Please understand, I completely support the idea of audits! Sound Choice wants to protect their products and rights.....I can definitely respect that! But, I know I want to protect my business, rights and assets, also.
....Man, I sure do miss the 90's when we could charge a Professional Price for a Professional Service and didn't have to worry with technology advancements making it easier for Low-Investment-Illegal-KJ's to enter the market. You either had the Manufactures' legally manufactured CDG's/Laser Discs or you didn't!

....."Show Me Da CDG's for media-shift/format-shift" No Problem! "Don't worry about the fine print, JUST SIGN HERE"....auh, not just yet.

....By the way, I wouldn't consider myself a "cheer-leader" but more of a "fence sitter." Also, thank you for your time...respond away if you wish.

MadMusicOne I don't have previous hosting experience but also feel I got caught up in the whole audit thing as well. I was just about to start my audit process when the fees were put into place, then one thing after another popped up to the point I'm currently not comfortable with signing the current document.

I'm also not comfortable with the lack of documentation on the manus website about the process, the forms, etc.... The document seems to change and it's so frequently it's hard to keep up.

I'll keep singing at home and consider playing from original disks if I decide to start hosting, but not sure that that would prevent a suit either.

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My statements, opinions and conclusions are based on my own personal experiences, observations, research and/or just my own $.02. I'm not a "cheerleader", but that doesn't make me a Pirate.

hiteck...I agree. Have read several of your responses in other threads and agreed for the most part. Am I nervous or paranoid? Somewhat, sure! What little I have I want to keep! Don't want to be accused of something while operating legally. Even having to defend myself could prove to be costly. As far as the KJ's operating illegally? My thoughts...."Book 'em, Dano!"

I will say that I agree with both of you. The threshold between when to play or not play any brand is entirely up to the individual KJ and how they want to run their business.

And like you, I don't believe in signing away anything I (a) don't have to and (b) never had to before.

I currently find myself in a similar situation. I have been digital since about 2005. I have certified my sc library and even bought (leased) a GEM to expand my second system. I have 2 sets of every Monthly since 1995 + extras 2 dk 3 pioneer 3 allhits 2 dangerous about 300 maestro etc. I would like to add the CB cert, however I only have 8 disks in system 2 and 10 in system 1, all purchased direct from CB. CB was one brand I never purchased until new music dried up. If I spend 200.00 for them to audit 18 disks I have added 10.00 a disk to my costs. There are about 15 songs that get regular play at the shows. Do I ditch them? I signed up for their monthly releases late last year. I didn't mind spending the money to audit almost 1000 sc disks between the 2 rigs but 10 bucks a disk?!!!

I had no problem with the SC audit, it was organized, friendly, etc (i also went to them, they weren't looking for me). I would spend that money again to use the disks digitally.

.....Yes ed, it is hard to dish out $199.00 for a CB Audit for so few discs. To me, it's a tragedy that when the very first cdg's were made, they didn't contain individual serial numbers that could have been tracked from manufacturer to wholesaler/retailer to buyer, especially through some national data base.

.....Congratulations on your SC Certification. I wish you the best in your business!

I have 28 SC disks. I will not spend $150 (because that is the new fee), to audit them. I just won't use them. I will only use those brands that will allow my to shift them to the computer without any hassle. I even found out that if you have less than 10 CB discs you don't need to certify. I only have one. CB doesn't care about SGB discs. They can be shifted. I got that from Gretchen, herself. All Star and Party Tyme allow shifting. The only thing is that you have to have the original disc. Well, I own every disc I have shifted. Then there is Tricerasoft, and Select - A -Track. They license their products for us WORLDWIDE, with use for public shows. I got that from Tricerasoft, AND SBI, themselves. There are so many options there is no reason to do business with SC, if one doesn't feel comfortable to do so.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

MadMusicOne,
I am one of the certified hosts(audited and passed by all 3 major US manus). It is my personal opinion that as long as you are operating legally I welcome you. 1 certify 2 play from discs 3 remove SC/CB/Stellar and any other brands you are not 1-1 on, and I have no problem. I HATE THIEVES. Certification has worked out well for me in my area but I do feel it is up to each host to decide what works for them.

Blessings and Good Luck to You
Athena

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"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

Or just play them on the disc themselves!

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

No. It's more convenient not to carry discs. It's faster, and I don't have to worry about mishaps where they get scratched. Not using them, they stay pristine, in case I need to rip them again.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

I have 20 year old discs that still look and play like new! It's all in how you treat them!

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

I doesn't matter. I'm not doing anything wrong in NOT playing them off the disc. Since I can't rip my SC discs without permission, that I would have to pay for, I just won't use their products.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

Your perogitve, only ones your hurting (gaining or losing) is those that want to sing from them. I know you have mostly the Headbanger stuff if I understood correctly, in this area anyway, that is slicing my own throat because many of those songs aren't available on many other manus - we get ALOT of those songs sung nightly.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

People here are mostly into Country and pop. The hardest rock you hear around here is Bon Jovi. Like I said on the other site, if the day comes when SC joins with CB and offers their songs on a drive like KJMP, I will be all over it. As soon as I can I plan on getting the KJMP system, and I will keep it stocked with credits, and buy as I need. As for the expense, I am not worried about how much it is per song. I am getting what I want, when I want it. Hey, you never know. if more people get on that system, the prices may even come down, over time.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

I would jump on the SC HD Media Pro version as well if it ever comes to light - HELL i'd buy Compuhost just to be able to unlock them & play them on Hoster!

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Maybe if enough people buy the CB version and like it, Mr. Slep will open his eyes and modernize. Until then, as far as I am conserned, he can keep his discs.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

Nah plenty of people still buying them (and requesting them). I know i'll continue to use mine nightly. Since that is 75% of my library!

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

...Athena,
......Thanks for responding to my Original Post. I'm going to try and break down your response with the following as I see it. Am doing my best to be respectful but I have been burning the candle at both ends getting my taxes ready.

I am one of the certified hosts(audited and passed by all 3 major US manus).
...Congratulations! I have certification with Chartbuster. When I ordered some PHM CDG holes with Stellar/PHM, Tony told me they are no longer doing audits. (You can re-read my original posting) I tried contacting SC by emails and phone calls back in 2009 but got no response. Had to order many of their CDG's through their Authorized Dealers.

It is my personal opinion that as long as you are operating legally I welcome you.
...I have CDG's from back in the 90's (when I was working for other KJ's and building my own collection) and some that I had picked up years later. Once I got back in (after buying new equipment) I stayed disc based. Didn't really want to do a show with my lack of computer skills but did change after hearing that the Manufacturers would allow if 1:1. No, I didn't go out and buy a hard drive loaded with illegally obtained tracks to run my shows. I have spent HUNDREDS of HOURS ripping and re-ripping. If was fun learning the "How To's" but got very tedious as the days turned into weeks and months. Time that I just can't get back in my life.

1 certify
...Have done this with Chartbuster and Tony & Crew from Stellar knows what I have. Both Manufactures also have copies of my receipts and pictures of my CDG's, SD Cards, MP3+G Discs and Chartbuster 6000 Digital Library Vol. 2. KIAA is not currently taking applications.

2 play from discs
...I plan to do this with SC only because I'm not comfortable with what is currently being offered in their agreement. I explained this in my original posting.

3 remove SC/CB/Stellar and any other brands you are not 1-1 on, and I have no problem.
...Confused here? EVERY file/track (both DJ & Karaoke) are ACCOUNTED FOR, period. Not one file does not have a matching original CDG, MP3+G Disc, SD Card, Chartbuster Digital Hard Drive. Do I need to get an audit or permission from you? Just asking? Sorry if I sound sarcastic but I'm not in that 90% that is or has been operating illegally.

I HATE THIEVES.
...I don't like using the word HATE but I am no fan of THIEVES or LIARS!!!

Certification has worked out well for me in my area but I do feel it is up to each host to decide what works for them.
...Again, congratulations! I am hoping that it continues to not only work out for you but other legally operating KJ's, the Manufacturers and myself.

...I will say this, after crunching my numbers from the past, my total investment since 2009 is just under $29,000.00 of which $14,000.00 is music. This doesn't include my previous collection of 1000 plus DJ and Karaoke CDG's. After looking at my Gross Income from 2011, my accountant said, "Man, you need to get busy, PRONTO!"

...My conclusion, I jumped back into a business that I didn't study the market before making the investment. Very BAD mistake on my part because I'm not gonna play for beer and stale peanuts. I just ASSUMED the going rate was what we charged back in the 90's. Wrong Again! I would have rather taken a trip to Vegas and let it ride than this! But, it's a little late for that now.

...But regardless and seriously, thanks for responding and good luck to you, also. By the way, I did agree to do what Mr. Harrington said to do when playing SC CDG's directly from the CDG (as mentioned in my original post) if this would keep me legal in their eyes. However, after viewing another thread, I doubt that I'll be playing any singers' SC CDG's because it's getting to be a little too much to keep up with. I want to keep SC in my collection but there's a lot of liability to using them. Please remember, I'm not cheer-leading for any one, I'm just sittin' on the fence at this point.

MadMusicOne,
Your method is one that shows integrity and honor. I am sorry that the industry has changed since you left and that now upon your return you are seeing the damage that has been done to the industry by those who have stolen/downloaded/shared music.
I understand the mind blowing investment in music (I don"t even want to add up what we have spent in over 18 years) The time spent ripping (it took us over 5 years for the CDG's and another 5 to get a usable copy of the LD's).As you have stated time we can never get back....but boy it is easier on our backs
It is my hope that the actions by the manus will turn around the state of OUR industry and that karaoke will survive. In my family we currently have 3 generations of KJ's and I hope to live long enough to see 4. KJ's,
Venues, and Singers all need understand that steal of music is wrong and that it will end up killing the industry if not curbed.
As KJ's we have always had to fight Crapioke, and the ups and downs of popularity however adding in those who steal music that legit hosts have paid for over the years leaves a very uneven field for us to try and compete on.
My best wishes to you in getting you business flying and if I can be of any help feel free to PM me.

Bright Blessings
Athena

BTW...It is my personal opinion that playing customers original discs and just holding it up and announcing the fact is perfectly safe....but you do what you feel safe with

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"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

I think the whole "holding up discs thing would make one look foolish.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE